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  1. #481
    unscannable Tigerlily's Avatar
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    I'm content with you being a pleasant, nice INTP.
    Time is a delicate mistress.

  2. #482
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Here's another one.

    Emotional expression does not make someone a Feeler.
    Remember when you said it's harder to convince someone their conclusions are incorrect than that their perceptions that those conclusions are based on are?

    This is one of those times. You're going to continue to be wrong about this until you change your perceptions.

    Emotional expression, unless invoked by some other function, does make it a Feeling function. When your personal psychology prefers these functions over others, you're a Feeler.
    we fukin won boys

  3. #483
    Senior Member Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    About my supposed inconsistency regarding the voice of majority:

    Regardless of BlueWing's interpretation, all that really matters was my reason and my intent, because I'm the only one that can be certain knowing what they were. They were my own thoughts. If I phrased it in a confusing way, point taking, sorry about that. But in the end, for the purpose of understand the cognitive process that goes in my head, all that matters is understanding what was going on in my head at the time I wrote those things.

    My emphasis on the plural opinion had nothing to do giving into feelings.
    It was indeed based on the notion, that if there are fifteen people, one of them supports one idea, and the other fourteen support the opposite idea, then supposing they are all equal educated on the subject, the one dissenter is more likely to be wrong than the fourteen others who are in agreement with eachother.

    I am well aware that this notion alone is no where near good enough to hold a whole argument, or to completely disassemble another argument. That was my point about how it's "not much", but is one of many valid points in the bigger picture, and was on my side in that particular argument, which is why I brought it up.

    As for BlueWing's comment about proving whether or not people are experts... That's just not a very good point. I know of no way to prove that any of the were experts on the subject. BlueWing didn't suggest any way. If I prove that all the others are experts, then should we have to prove BlueWing is an expert as well, to get this even? I can't seem to prove that he is, either. In the end, I assumed all parties equal because I don't think any of you are qualified experts. Not BlueWing, and not any of BlueWing's opponents. It's just a bunch of people that dabbled in Jungian theory and came to this forum.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  4. #484
    Senior Member Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Emotional expression, unless invoked by some other function, does make it a Feeling function. When your personal psychology prefers these functions over others, you're a Feeler.
    I think I was making a point about the bold part actually. If I understand waht you meant.

    But yes, I know that in a very vague sense, what you said is true. However, when I say anything using the words "should", or "want", even then I'm technically using Feeling... I think, at least I hope, we are all recognizing the fact here that human beings would not function at all if literally devoid of any of the functions.

    However, if I'm expressing emotion, but using T type rationale, I think the rationale is the more important aspect here.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  5. #485
    Senior Member Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    Later in that discussion, when digesthisickness displays a negative reaction to Magic's proposition. He states ' it is only an assumption!'. What fervent love of truth!

    This is just dishonest, and a sarcastic insult, too. There's nothing wrong with a little educated conjecture, especially if someone publicly notes to all that it is just conjecture. It's also something BlueWing has done a fair deal, so if this makes me an F, then it make him an F, too. But he wouldn't agree to that.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  6. #486
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    I think I was making a point about the bold part actually. If I understand waht you meant.

    But yes, I know that in a very vague sense, what you said is true.
    Vague nothing. I'm precisely correct.

    However, when I say anything using the words "should", or "want", even then I'm technically using Feeling... I think, at least I hope, we are all recognizing the fact here that human beings would not function at all if literally devoid of any of the functions.
    No one is entirely devoid of any functions.

    It's POSSIBLE to be, but no one is. It's hard to go... however many years without at least using each one once. They switch off sometimes between seconds... there are only 8 of them. People live for years. I bet most people don't even go a DAY without using all 8 at least for a second.

    That's not really what I'm saying. I'm saying, you're an F because you use F functions more than T functions.

    However, if I'm expressing emotion, but using T type rationale, I think the rationale is the more important aspect here.
    Then it would be invoked by T. Still T.

    If it's in the plan...
    we fukin won boys

  7. #487

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    I'm sooooooooo not following this debate. I wish I could, but alas, I'm not 'T' nor 'J' and I don't have legal training. Oh wait, I gotta be more NF about it -->



    I can accept that Magic is an NT if that's what he says he is. I think he is humble, sensitive, and has a very well developed "F". Or rather, he focuses a lot of his Ti on "being [morally/ethically] correct/living the right way" -- similarly to Edahn who I also believe is an NT (okay, fine, let's not open that up again).

    I can nod with Xander's statement that 'losing a few flaws suddenly makes you 'P' and 'F'" and I reiterate that how you 'are' in yourself (your type) stays the same regardless of how you develop, adapt, mimic, or mask other qualities.

    Can we bring up Enneagrams?

    I think Magic mentioned he is a One sexual variant (right?) so that should flesh out his 'type' more and why he expresses differently than some other INTPs on the site.

    There's lots of variety within type.

    I'm going to fall asleep now. I can't wait to see what people have typed in the morning!



    And BlueWing, don't take this the wrong way, but I totally want to buy you a drink (several in fact, very stiff ones) if we ever meet IRL.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

    Johari/Nohari

  8. #488
    Senior Member Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    That's not really what I'm saying. I'm saying, you're an F because you use F functions more than T functions.

    And I have to disagree. I tend to believe the results I keep getting from the raw function tests. If there's any concession to be made, it's that my Ti and Fi are tied, so maybe I should be called an INXP, but there's no reason to call me an INFP. I'll note that my Te always comes out higher than my Fe, so, averigin all of it, I still have higher scores on T than on F.

    Another point worth mentioning is that different people respond differently depending on the environment. I can safely say that I come across as more Feeling here than I do in personal life. There is unfortunately no way to prove this to anyone here.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


    _________________________________
    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  9. #489
    Senior Member Gabe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Great... ENFP here we come...

    Well I'm not too sure about ENFJ. You've yet to get really feisty from what I've seen and that's something I look for in ENFJs. I'm also not familiar with you crusading for anything in particular.... There again I'd rule out ENFP (I don't get the feeling that I've been hit by a buick with shag-pile carpet on the outside...usually). INFP is another I'd be tempted to rule out, I've not seen any sergeant type attitude and you seem to open (Mr Carebear stuffs that one up but I find INFPs are usually guarded). ESFJ would be interesting if it were true... but I'd imagine you'd give Limey a headache. My only other recourse is ENTJ and I don't get the whole 'world is layed out' vibe from you.

    Nah I'll stick with ENFJ. I'll know more once I see the dynamic you.








    A rotten truth to be sure but yes. That'd be Mr Lydon.
    I guess I'm not as "with it" as we ENFPs supposedly are.

  10. #490
    Senior Member Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    In the very end, he states the following in red font.
    "*I suppose, at this point, it's amazingly obvious that intimacy is my primary instinct*
    __________________"
    And I think this is just a simple misunderstanding. I was specifically referring to another personality type system known as the Instinctual Variants. Perhaps BlueWing is not familar with it. If he is not, then it's likely that he interpreted my statement incorrectly, as jargon from a subject you are not familiar with is very easy to misunderstand.

    I have looked into the subject, and so far found no correlation between the Instincts and T/F preferences. I believe this is because the definitions have no overlap. Jung's T and F functions refer to means we use to pass judgement on subjects. The Instincts refer to what subjects are of importance to us. So, a person could have Intimacy be his/her top Instinct, and still subject it to completely T based judgment.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


    _________________________________
    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

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