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  1. #4771
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Sorry, we're not taking votes. When the genetic MBTI tests are out, the truth will wash over your doubts.
    Okay well i'll look forward to relaxing about it then.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  2. #4772
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    AA is not an NTP in my opinion. His thoughts aren't clear and incisive enough. This is not a bad thing, just an observation. I think he processes things more viscerally, which fits with Si. Ti I think is there, but it is far from dominant. It's certain he uses Fe, and I think it's clear Fe is more prominent than Ti, as he is more prone to making tentative thoughts about things than a decisive train of logic, and is always sensitive to social harmony and his own value in relation to it. I think ISFJ is accurate.

  3. #4773
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    AA is not an NTP in my opinion. His thoughts aren't clear and incisive enough. This is not a bad thing, just an observation. I think he processes things more viscerally, which fits with Si. Ti I think is there, but it is far from dominant. It's certain he uses Fe, and I think it's clear Fe is more prominent than Ti, as he is more prone to making tentative thoughts about things than a decisive train of logic, and is always sensitive to social harmony and his own value in relation to it. I think ISFJ is accurate.
    he's always been kinda tricky for me but i think isfj or infj fits probably. i feel like i see both ni and si but i haven't looked super close honestly.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  4. #4774
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    Ya, ISFJ or INFJ seems to fit well on the whole.

  5. #4775
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Not exactly what I said, current not mainstream, just because it puts me in mind of popular culture doesn't mean I think it's mainstream. But it's more of a vibe, which MBTI LURVES.
    But I don't love vibes.

    Wow. Well you are certainly Fi, I've never seen such indignation.


    Incidently any human being is able to pull meaning from anything and everything. The quality of Ne is about being able pull in different frameworks of information in order to create new avenues of potential. And those potentials have a quality to them, they aren't just random observations. Who cares about 'deeper'? My toilet bowl is deep.
    Exactly. I wasn't saying Ne is the only type that pulls meaning from anything, although I should have specified what kind of meaning I meant when I said it up there. I'm a little sloppy like that. BUT the way ESPs seem to view things like music (which is what I thought you meant when you said "style" or whatever; I don't get what else about me could be viewed as modern) is something I can't relate to. What I relate to about ESFPs is pulling the meaning out of something in relation to yourself. But I suck at describing how things sound physically, identifying what's actually going on in the song, etc. I know the whole "big picture" thing sounds like bullcrap but that's basically what I get from anything I see. That, and possibilities for where they could be or what they could be doing, etc.

    I think your reaction reveals more about your own biases, I'm the S here.
    I think I was just being too lazy to specify what I meant.

    Type is nothing more than modes of operation, individuals can be intelligent and insightful regardless of type, it's the way in which it is reached that is important.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    AA is not an NTP in my opinion. His thoughts aren't clear and incisive enough. This is not a bad thing, just an observation. I think he processes things more viscerally, which fits with Si. Ti I think is there, but it is far from dominant. It's certain he uses Fe, and I think it's clear Fe is more prominent than Ti, as he is more prone to making tentative thoughts about things than a decisive train of logic, and is always sensitive to social harmony and his own value in relation to it. I think ISFJ is accurate.
    Yeah, I always thought of AA as SFJ for these reasons.
    7w6 - 2w3 - 8w7 sx/so


  6. #4776
    I am Fay's Avatar
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    @Chanaynay the way you described music sounds really Fi. Finding meaning is also important for Fi users, I know some of Kelly Clarkson's songs and they are definitely full of emotionality. She expresses the different sides of feelings, but it's less about meaning and more about putting out emotions. The reason why I dislike pop culture and pop music, is because the interprets are not real. They all are linked, governed by their managers, they are told what to say, what to do, what to wear. The element of human's individuality is totally pull off from mainstream music, just because of making more profits. It's kind of sad, that music is no longer presetned as the form of art, where the artist could present and express himself, but it's rather used just as another form of business. And that's what mainstream culture is about...business. But I am not interested in business, I am interested in art. The real and true art. Kelly Clarkson went out as the winner of American Idol, these people have no chance to say anything. They are just a products of a TV show. The influence can be latter smaller, but it's hard to change once you're put in the box by the eyes of audience.
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  7. #4777
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    ENTP of the Lark variety.
    If Lark is ENTP, Lady X is ESTJ.

  8. #4778
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polly View Post
    @Chanaynay the way you described music sounds really Fi. Finding meaning is also important for Fi users, I know some of Kelly Clarkson's songs and they are definitely full of emotionality. She expresses the different sides of feelings, but it's less about meaning and more about putting out emotions. The reason why I dislike pop culture and pop music, is because the interprets are not real. They all are linked, governed by their managers, they are told what to say, what to do, what to wear. The element of human's individuality is totally pull off from mainstream music, just because of making more profits. It's kind of sad, that music is no longer presetned as the form of art, where the artist could present and express himself, but it's rather used just as another form of business. And that's what mainstream culture is about...business. But I am not interested in business, I am interested in art. The real and true art. Kelly Clarkson went out as the winner of American Idol, these people have no chance to say anything. They are just a products of a TV show. The influence can be latter smaller, but it's hard to change once you're put in the box by the eyes of audience.
    I disagree, in fact I think Kelly is a shining beacon of hope to pop musicians today.

    Kelly Clarkson has come out swinging at Clive Davis, whom she accuses of "spreading false information about me and my music" and bullying.

    Davis is currently making the media rounds in support of "The Soundtrack of My Life," a new memoir in which he reveals he is bisexual and had "loving relationships and sexual intimacy" with both men and women. Clarkson took issue with a very different passage, in which the music mogul apparently writes that she broke into "hysterical sobbing" when he demanded that smash hit "Since U Been Gone" would be included on Clarkson's album.

    "Not true at all," Clarkson wrote in a WhoSay post on Tuesday. "His stories and songs are mixed up. I did want more guitars added to the original demo and Clive did not. [Producers Max Martin and Łukasz "Dr. Luke" Gottwald] and I still fought for the bigger sound and we prevailed and I couldn't be more proud of the life of that song. I resent him dampening that song in any way."

    The "American Idol" winner goes further, alleging that Davis berated her after she played him "Because of You." "I cried because he hated it and told me verbatim that I was a 'sh-tty writer who should be grateful for the gifts that he bestows upon me,'" Clarkson writes. "He continued on about how the song didn't rhyme and how I should just shut up and sing. This was devastating coming from a man who I, as a young girl, considered a musical hero and was so honored to work with."

    Eventually, the label placed "Because of You" on the album, and it went on to be a smash hit. Clarkson goes on to say that she's since found fulfillment in all her professional relationships, thanking Davis "for teaching me to know the difference" -- presumably between ill-wishers and supportive partners.
    And that's not the only time Kelly has been able to speak her mind. I would link more quotes from her but I'm lazy. But I'll just say she speaks her mind in interviews all the time. A few times she's actually addressed the issues of pop musicians not being able to put out what they want and things like that (for example, in the quote above). I don't see how anyone could call her a product of a TV show when she's really passionate about what she does. Her music inspires others, which is basically what I think the point of art is. Just because she's "mainstream" or whatever does not mean what she produces isn't art. Like, she's turned down multiple label offers in the past because they weren't going to give her what she wanted.

    In fact, I wouldn't even label Kelly as a "pop" musician either. She really does whatever she wants - her sound can range from R&B, pop, pop-rock, rock, acoustic, country, holiday, etc. Her most recent song was actually a country song dedicated to her husband and was written by her while they were engaged. Because of You was written about her life as a child and if you think that isn't real then I don't know what IS real. Or the love for her husband you can hear in Tie It Up. I don't care if she's a pop musician or not, calling what she makes fake is just totally wrong. You can see she's passionate about her music, she's happy about what she does. Also if you've ever actually heard her song "Catch My Breath" (which she herself wrote) she actively fights against the idea of people in the music business trying to suppress artists by not giving them a voice:

    Catching my breath, letting it go,
    Turning my cheek for the sake of the show
    Now that you know this is my life,
    I won't be told what's supposed to be right
    Although I don't see how any of this is related to my type at all besides the fact that I'm definitely FP. I just had to reply because if someone is going to call Kelly fake or just profit-oriented or without a voice, the claws are coming out.
    7w6 - 2w3 - 8w7 sx/so


  9. #4779
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    AA is not an NTP in my opinion. His thoughts aren't clear and incisive enough. This is not a bad thing, just an observation. I think he processes things more viscerally, which fits with Si. Ti I think is there, but it is far from dominant. It's certain he uses Fe, and I think it's clear Fe is more prominent than Ti, as he is more prone to making tentative thoughts about things than a decisive train of logic, and is always sensitive to social harmony and his own value in relation to it. I think ISFJ is accurate.
    I agree with this. As it happens I actually don't like the lack of precision in my thoughts, although I've never thought I was NTP of any kind and have resisted any suggestions to the contrary.

    I'm not sure if the grass is greener, but it certainly looks better designed from a distance. Meaning that I've always admired, even from a young age, the precise thoughts of abstract thinkers and after all why not? Such individuals were the ones who paved the way for so many advances in our history, social, philosophical and technological.

    But...I'm not one of them and never will be. I knew that too, from a young age. So I don't strive to BE like someone, but I do strive to be someone other than me, whoever that is.

    And unfortunately MBTI sometimes has a habit of reminding one of limitations. People have told me of dealing with the hand that is dealt to you, to which my mindset has always been to change the hand. Personality, barring damage to the brain or extensive conditioning, doesn't really allow you to do that.

    No wonder ISJ's have been placed into the melancholic category.

    Imagine being told you are going to be a janitor for 50+ years, then imagine that you are lonely and don't fit in anywhere, then imagine there was this theory that seemed to help in self revelation despite it's lack of hard evidence, imagine you don't fit in there either, imagine your own conscience beating you up for whining when others would love to have your opportunities, imagine knowing that you're at your peak in intelligence and skills, imagine being just intelligent enough to comprehend this to some extent, then imagine...

    ALL THE PEOPLE!

    Then imagine that you could and perhaps some might say should be helping to do something worthwhile to contribute towards the world, for if you lack ability, intelligence and creativity. At the least you can compensate with tenacity.

    Self pitying dick.

    I could go on, but id rather leave this type of stuff in my blog. Still, why do I seemed compelled towards avenues I was not built for and which I have consistently failed in?

    I hate my parents, but it always mirrors...and what I really hate
















    is me.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  10. #4780
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    I agree with this. As it happens I actually don't like the lack of precision in my thoughts, although I've never thought I was NTP of any kind and have resisted any suggestions to the contrary.

    I'm not sure if the grass is greener, but it certainly looks better designed from a distance. Meaning that I've always admired, even from a young age, the precise thoughts of abstract thinkers and after all why not? Such individuals were the ones who paved the way for so many advances in our history, social, philosophical and technological.

    But...I'm not one of them and never will be. I knew that too, from a young age. So I don't strive to BE like someone, but I do strive to be someone other than me, whoever that is.

    And unfortunately MBTI sometimes has a habit of reminding one of limitations. People have told me of dealing with the hand that is dealt to you, to which my mindset has always been to change the hand. Personality, barring damage to the brain or extensive conditioning, doesn't really allow you to do that.

    No wonder ISJ's have been placed into the melancholic category.

    Imagine being told you are going to be a janitor for 50+ years, then imagine that you are lonely and don't fit in anywhere, then imagine there was this theory that seemed to help in self revelation despite it's lack of hard evidence, imagine you don't fit in there either, imagine your own conscience beating you up for whining when others would love to have your opportunities, imagine knowing that you're at your peak in intelligence and skills, imagine being just intelligent enough to comprehend this to some extent, then imagine...

    ALL THE PEOPLE!

    Then imagine that you could and perhaps some might say should be helping to do something worthwhile to contribute towards the world, for if you lack ability, intelligence and creativity. At the least you can compensate with tenacity.

    Self pitying dick.

    I could go on, but id rather leave this type of stuff in my blog. Still, why do I seemed compelled towards avenues I was not built for and which I have consistently failed in?

    I hate my parents, but it always mirrors...and what I really hate
















    is me.
    Why not focus on being happy? Imagine the possibility of being happy without any conditions attached to it.

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