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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephano View Post
    Not really the self-indulgence. You responded some time ago that you also procrastinate certain things, which is common for perceivers. However, my impression was that you saw it as something "positive" in terms of you don't mind it really. I think especially type 3 and 8 would want to work on it rather than accept it as a personal trait. It's just my view, it's not that is has anything to do with the "official" mbti.
    Why was that your impression? I actually hate the procrastination, I did mention I would like more self-control: "I want less procrastination, I would like to be able to control certain impulses more at will". The desire for certain things however acts against the desire to control impulses. A never-ending fight in this way. Otoh I'm not big on self-criticism so I don't hate myself for it even though I don't happily accept this issue. Did you mean this lack of being hard on myself by positivity?


    My tip: Leave out all the extravert bias parts in E7 descriptions and tell me if you see yourself having those traits.
    Not sure which traits you mean. Let me know.

    For a start, I took the traits from the enneagraminstitute description;

    Extrovert - well, ambivert more, but you know that already
    Optimistic - In a sense of having confidence for doing things, yes I'm optimistic. I don't really justify the confidence, it just "is". Though I don't expect things to automatically turn out good, I have to take care of it myself. I don't believe in luck :/
    Versatile - In a sense yes. I'm good at acquiring skills but only focus on one thing over a time period.
    Spontaneous - Well, not quite always. Sometimes I am and sometimes not.
    Playful - If I'm in a mood for it then I am playful.
    High-spirited - Same.
    Practical - Yeah
    Overextended - no, I focus on one thing at a time.
    Scattered - no, same answer
    Undisciplined - half of the time, yes very much. The other half of the time I got control.
    Impatience - yes!
    Impulsiveness - Yeah

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by infinity- View Post

    Yeah that's what I meant. This "racing mind" stuff to me sounds like a really unsubstantial and unsatisfying thing. It's like... a too "light" kind of stimulation.
    Yes there is an ESTP on here with the same tritype as you. He talks about how he likes intense things and intense experiences like climbing a mountain. It's similar to a 7 but more intense. I like intense things too but it's not a requirement.


    What I exactly meant was I prefer acting without having to stop to think and consider stuff. Instead it's integrated in the action.
    Ah I see. It's more fun doing it that way but I'm a head type so it's not really natural to rely on my instincts that much. That looks ballsy to me.

    The pickiness is an ISTP thing eh? Going fast is good btw yeah. I wonder if we perceive speed the same way :p.
    The pickiness we owe to sx/sp. Things are either part of us or they are not. Very off or on. Social instinct has all the tolerance and we have none of that haha.

    I don't know how do you perceive speed? I see my natural state as being in some kind of flow state. I would probably think my best and be the most calm flying a fighter jet a few feet off the ground. Oh right I also have a thing for chaos so that's part of it (784 thing). If I play a game I'm always the fastest character because nobody can compete with me on speed and reaction times. My favourite attributes are speed and then secondly power shots.


    I see. I don't get anxious much when nothing is going on. A bit bored or feeling less alive, sure. But that's about it. I do prefer activity over inactivity but not like you describe.

    In general do you forget about anxiety by simply focusing on whatever fun stuff?
    Yes but I know I'm bullshitting myself. The only thing that I feel like is strong enough to make it really go away is a promising future where I fulfil my purpose. A place where I will finally be able to do what I have always belonged doing.

    edit: Just realized you said by focusing and not actually doing. Sort of yes but it should be already gone once I have the plan in place. I don't really need to think about it too much the positive feeling will already be there. I still need to entertain myself with other stuff though.


    I don't think I work like that, denial works much better for me. Sometimes I do use rationalization too, and that's 7-ish, but I don't use distraction in this fashion. Especially not, if I have some problem that I'm upset about. Me feeling upset or angry is not going to go away by just trying to involve myself with something fun. Doing away with the problem is what works. If it can't be done immediately then a plan of action to fix it also works. But until I have that, I'm going to stay irritated, upset or angry or raging... nice scale of emotional intensity haha.
    Yea 8s use denial as their defense mechanism. The 7 defense mechanism is saying "I don't care".

    "Psychological defenses: Eights use the defense mechanism of denial to avoid vulnerability and maintain a self-image of being "strong." (Denial is a kind of forceful re-directing of attention and feeling based on willfulness and control."
    http://www.enneagramwork.com/type_8_protector.html


    The same with the escaping to promising future. I don't do that much, it wouldn't feel satisfying like actual reality is. It's just not real, not grounded... I think that's the best word for it. In your case, you being an Se type too, how can you be future oriented like a 7? I'm not sure I understand that.
    I'm not sure. I guess it's kind of tough figuring the best future I want. I spend a lot of time experimenting with different stuff. It's like a puzzle to me that I need to solve. I guess it's kind of contradictory cause if I'm just going around my normal business I won't even think past my next meal. The mentality is sort of like: if right now sucks then later will be better for these reasons and that makes it ok to do what you are doing now. It's like if you were on fear factor eating all these bugs but that's ok because you are going to get 50 thousand dollars at the end.


    Yeah ok 8 and with line to 5, maybe I believe it's 5's who value intellectual power a lot.
    That's more your Ti being combined with your 8. I know of an ENTJ 8 with a similar thing. She said knowing more than other people was the source of her power.

    Oh yeah wait where did you see 3w4 exactly? Explain that a bit more? I agree with the rest of your description/comparison.
    Well you could be a 4w3 fix but I was seeing a lot more 3w4 stuff. When you said you wanted your own jet and a private island that's typical 3 stuff. I kind of relate to that and I will get confused sometimes and think I want that typical 3 stuff but I find out the hard way later that I see that as inauthentic and not being true to myself.

    You also seem like the typical 873 tritype which is called the mover and shaker and are almost always entrepeneurs. You said you would rather achieve something great than be something great which is more indicative of 3. You have trouble showing your emotions I'm guessing because you want people to see your 3 image and not your 4 but that could just be an 8 thing with not wanting to be vulnerable. 4s don't usually have trouble with being self revealing but I don't know I hate using my emotions too. If you were a 4w3 fix you would probably be more grandiose.

    The war thing for you, that's because you got a 8 wing? 7 by default doesn't see life that way, right?
    Yea 7 is not typically like that. 7 is usually head in the clouds stuck in positivity land. It's different for ISTPs a typical ISTP 7w8 would be a rockstar probably. It's cause of my inferior Fe and all my 8 influence and my 4 fix makes it so I'm not scared of negative things. I still have a positive outlook but that's mostly only for myself. Inferior Fe with 7w8 is like "your destruction is my entertainment".

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger055 View Post
    Yes there is an ESTP on here with the same tritype as you. He talks about how he likes intense things and intense experiences like climbing a mountain. It's similar to a 7 but more intense. I like intense things too but it's not a requirement.
    Oh climbing a mountain is good. Btw it's a good example too, the intensity often does come from physical exertion. Either that, or just intense and exclusively focused interest. That's what some people see as me coming on too strong even when I'm not actually attacking anyone.


    The pickiness we owe to sx/sp. Things are either part of us or they are not. Very off or on. Social instinct has all the tolerance and we have none of that haha.
    Ah, heh, ok.


    I don't know how do you perceive speed? I see my natural state as being in some kind of flow state. I would probably think my best and be the most calm flying a fighter jet a few feet off the ground. Oh right I also have a thing for chaos so that's part of it (784 thing). If I play a game I'm always the fastest character because nobody can compete with me on speed and reaction times. My favourite attributes are speed and then secondly power shots.
    Yes I'm familiar with the flow state Flow is about concentration, attention being all "there", no wandering, acting from instinct and implicit/automatic knowledge, with the amount of challenge being just at the right level. You can just about meet the challenge without it being boringly easy.

    Going fast gives a feeling of intensity and it's just great. You have to put in force to get up to speed.


    Yes but I know I'm bullshitting myself. The only thing that I feel like is strong enough to make it really go away is a promising future where I fulfil my purpose. A place where I will finally be able to do what I have always belonged doing.
    I do relate to the hope that there is always a chance in future to achieve what you want.


    Yea 8s use denial as their defense mechanism. The 7 defense mechanism is saying "I don't care".
    Elaborate on the "don't care" thing? Is a 7 willing to easily let go of things? Don't they really want things?


    I'm not sure. I guess it's kind of tough figuring the best future I want. I spend a lot of time experimenting with different stuff. It's like a puzzle to me that I need to solve. I guess it's kind of contradictory cause if I'm just going around my normal business I won't even think past my next meal. The mentality is sort of like: if right now sucks then later will be better for these reasons and that makes it ok to do what you are doing now. It's like if you were on fear factor eating all these bugs but that's ok because you are going to get 50 thousand dollars at the end.
    Hmm well I like having goals myself but it doesn't really come from such experimentation.

    Hey I'll take the 50 thousand dollars :P


    Well you could be a 4w3 fix but I was seeing a lot more 3w4 stuff. When you said you wanted your own jet and a private island that's typical 3 stuff. I kind of relate to that and I will get confused sometimes and think I want that typical 3 stuff but I find out the hard way later that I see that as inauthentic and not being true to myself.
    Lol that stuff is not because of the social standards you referred to. I just liked the idea of having an island to myself, actually owning it. I would have only the things on there that I wanted. And the jet, it's again about owning it, and it'd take me to places fast, wherever I wanted. Tbh though, I don't think about this sort of stuff often, I'm really really no daydreamer. If I actually have the money for it then sure I'll think about it more.


    You also seem like the typical 873 tritype which is called the mover and shaker and are almost always entrepeneurs. You said you would rather achieve something great than be something great which is more indicative of 3. You have trouble showing your emotions I'm guessing because you want people to see your 3 image and not your 4 but that could just be an 8 thing with not wanting to be vulnerable. 4s don't usually have trouble with being self revealing but I don't know I hate using my emotions too. If you were a 4w3 fix you would probably be more grandiose.
    Yeah the "being something great" part, I didn't pick that because I don't really think about identity questions. I suppose a 4 does that a lot. This personality typing for me is also not easy because of that.

    As for not revealing myself, I don't see it connected to 3 because I don't try to project an image instead. So yeah more like 8.


    Yea 7 is not typically like that. 7 is usually head in the clouds stuck in positivity land. It's different for ISTPs a typical ISTP 7w8 would be a rockstar probably. It's cause of my inferior Fe and all my 8 influence and my 4 fix makes it so I'm not scared of negative things. I still have a positive outlook but that's mostly only for myself. Inferior Fe with 7w8 is like "your destruction is my entertainment".
    Lol you're suck a dark 7 :P

    I'm not scared of negative things either but I don't have any obsession of focusing on them. I'm actually fairly positive except that I don't take luck for granted and I tend to see the glass as half empty. I just believe in being alive and I have the confidence that I can do things, now and in future too. And the common cognitive bias as well, along the lines of "nothing truly bad can happen to me". Which is ironic because some truly bad thing already happened to me in life. And then I think I do have a 7-ish rationalization for that: "it happened once so it can't happen again". It's a somewhat cynical rationalization at the same time, heh. If that makes sense.

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    That site you linked to is pretty interesting about "Somatic patterns".

    It says about 8 that "Their armor shows up as tension or density more or less evenly distributed around the body". That's totally me, it's scarily accurate, ha-ha.

    It says about 7 that they're flexible and loose, are you like that @badger055? It says "They are often quite loose and flexible physically. Instead of muscular tension, their challenge is "being in" their bodies and becoming grounded."

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    Glanced at it and skimmed it some, xSFP form what I can gather. I'm inclined to put forward ISFP, especially with your precision of information and terse wording that might be indicative of Ji leading. Evidence for Se valuing is rife.

    Could be xSTP?

    I'll have to read closer later.
    I'm still curious to hear why you saw Fi > Ti.

    Did I seem like an F type?

    Not trying to say I'm averse to the idea, heh. Just want to understand why you wrote that.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by infinity- View Post
    I'm still curious to hear why you saw Fi > Ti.

    Did I seem like an F type?

    Not trying to say I'm averse to the idea, heh. Just want to understand why you wrote that.
    Mostly due to the ambiguity complemented by the terseness of the information you have provided, in which case Fi would be a reasonable explanation.

    However, I was rather torn whether or not you were a Ti or Fi type, and the reasoning above showcases the entire basis of my initial typing. With the presence of more information and openness, it might be more discernible.

    When I initially reviewed your questionnaire, my first instinct was Ti, but I became skeptical of my instinct.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    Mostly due to the ambiguity complemented by the terseness of the information you have provided, in which case Fi would be a reasonable explanation.

    However, I was rather torn whether or not you were a Ti or Fi type, and the reasoning above showcases the entire basis of my initial typing. With the presence of more information and openness, it might be more discernible.

    When I initially reviewed your questionnaire, my first instinct was Ti, but I became skeptical of my instinct.
    Which reasoning?

    Apparently my inferior Fe is quite obvious but I'd like to hear about how you generally make a difference between Ti and Fi.

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    Quote Originally Posted by infinity- View Post
    Which reasoning?
    The little scrap above that, that your lack of fleshed out information could be directed at Fi-valuing. (Which could be easily as true of an Fe inferior)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    The little scrap above that, that your lack of fleshed out information could be directed at Fi-valuing. (Which could be easily as true of an Fe inferior)
    Yeah so how do you make a difference between the two?

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    Quote Originally Posted by infinity- View Post
    Yeah so how do you make a difference between the two?
    The difference would be that the Fi lead would conceal information yet be comfortable with it.

    The Fe inferior would be either too lacking in self-awareness or find too much detailed information about themselves to be uncomforting to release.

    Then of course, there is the natural tendency that we all have to suspicion and privacy with information, though one would be less suspecting of this on a personality type forum that is characterized by anonymity.

    For another point, I need to learn to trust my instinct more (development of inf. Se, for me), so I say with clarity now that you are most likely Ti-valuing and that Ti is either your dominant or auxiliary function. I'm inclined to put forth ISTP.

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