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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by sworm09 View Post
    Hmm LII it is then (though the whole Ni thing has me a little curious)
    Yeah that's weird. How well do you relate to Ti-Ne vs Ni-Te in LII vs ILI desc's?

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Yeah that's weird. How well do you relate to Ti-Ne vs Ni-Te in LII vs ILI desc's?
    Ni-Te (I think)

    My consciousness is guided by my imagination and inner conception of things rather than searching out logical inconsistencies in the world. I understand ideas through inner visual perception of them. I'm able to notice trends and connections without trying.

    When I actually decide to do something with my inner perception of things, I always present my perception as fact and I'll gather facts and real world examples of things to explain my perceptions. Accuracy is a big deal to me, but only within the context of my interests. I can be a rigid perfectionist in certain things.

    With Ti, I only use that to attack other people's ideas. Ne is just annoying to me as a sense of doubt.

    In my thread about my type with the video someone said they saw a lot of Ti usage.

  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Yeah that's weird. How well do you relate to Ti-Ne vs Ni-Te in LII vs ILI desc's?

    Also as a possible add on to that, I see Te work within the context of my own interests as well.

    For example I'm interested in Tarot cards. I'll devour tons of books of the subject and then I'll get this burning passion to test the ideas within the books out to see if they work with clarity. I'll throw down the cards only to (usually) find that it doesn't work nearly as clearly as it does theoretically. Then I'll get frustrated and start to see if there are new ways of using them to make them work more objectively. So then I'll change my perspective on how to use them and try again to see if it works. If it works better then I won't dismiss it; but consistent failures only make me more skeptical.

    With typology it has been a similar process of myself getting pissed off because I'd like to be able to directly observe the theory. With MBTI I'd typed myself as INTP and I'd learned the functions, so then I wanted to "watch" those functions work in real life to see if my typing was accurate. When it didn't match up perfectly I dismissed INTP and then moved on to dismiss most of MBTI only to come to Socionics, which appears to be a little bit more clear. For me to truly know that something is right, I have to be able to see it work; that's why LII doesn't really resonate with me....my logic doesn't really work within a vacuum, I always have to go outside of myself to find out what's correct. If I can't directly observe something working I'll do tons and tons of research on it and then try and see a application of it to see if it works.

    This is why romance is difficult for me btw. I don't really believe anything that I say myself and I often need things proved to me before I'll take something. For example today in class I had a girl make a concentrated effort to look specifically at me and then turn away when I looked back. That's relatively strange looking at how we were in a lecture hall with about 50-60 people. The way my thought process works, I can always say what she may have been thinking, but until I see something else to leads me in a different direction, I can only speculate. I'll probably find myself creating an elaborate fantasy (Ni?) but I won't take it seriously unless something happens in reality that conforms with it.

    Going back to the topic of Tarot, that seems to show this weird Ni/Te relationship. Ni loves looking at all of the symbols and using it to interpret trends and see patterns, but my Te always requires that those patterns have enough outward evidence to back them up. I'll read things in Tarot and then take them with a grain of salt because I can't be sure that what I'm seeing is true. I'm plagued by self doubt because I need things proven to me. I'll spend hours, days, months obsessively gathering information and then testing them (through observing them) to see if they're accurate. Thus I spend a great deal of time doing absolutely nothing practical

    Up above I mentioned how I'm not warm and friendly unless people show me that they want me to be. I need objective evidence or information from outside of myself to justify my behaviors. That's also why I keep going to type forums asking people what they think my type is; I can't figure it out myself because of all of the subjective factors and I'm trying to get information from others (while simultaneously doubting it).

    To take yet another shot at my Fe usage (I've been observing myself today) I've come to the conclusion that I see people as an annoyance, but still care as to how they feel. Paradox? I don't think so.

    What I realized is that the essential thing that I crave from other people is respect. I want to be admired, I want to be told by other people how awesome I am, and I want to accomplish things that other people can see and enjoy. I often beat myself up when I compare myself with other people because they seem to have visible accomplishments while I don't; thus I feel like I don't deserve attention or respect, something that I desperately crave. Thus there's this awkward love hate relationship with people; I like people to pay attention to me but after an extended period of time I find myself annoyed, spiteful, and jealous. It's nothing that I'm proud of, but that's how it is

    What's more is that most of my fear from other people comes from me not wanting other people to think ill of me. I want them to look up to me and like me...and I think that I'm (willingly?) misinterpreting that as genuine empathy. This often manifests as me wanting people around, but having an inner lack of concern with them or their personal concerns as long as they aren't thinking ill of me or hurting my feelings. I'm not very proud of this, but in the past I've found it very easy to lie to people and play two sides of a conflict. Fe creatives probably would explode from doing something like that. The only time when I'll actually feel bad for lying to someone or the people that I actually care the most about are my closest contacts; parents, sister, close family members, long time friends...and even then the difference in warmth and empathy is a small one.

    I guess what makes it hard for me to type myself is that my psyche seems to have worked extremely hard to obscure the main aspects of my personality....probably out of guilt.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by sworm09 View Post
    Ni-Te (I think)

    My consciousness is guided by my imagination and inner conception of things rather than searching out logical inconsistencies in the world. I understand ideas through inner visual perception of them. I'm able to notice trends and connections without trying.
    I guess you're definitely N-lead then


    When I actually decide to do something with my inner perception of things, I always present my perception as fact and I'll gather facts and real world examples of things to explain my perceptions. Accuracy is a big deal to me, but only within the context of my interests. I can be a rigid perfectionist in certain things.

    With Ti, I only use that to attack other people's ideas. Ne is just annoying to me as a sense of doubt.
    Ni isn't giving you uncertainty then? Or what did you mean? In the last sentence about Ne.


    Quote Originally Posted by sworm09 View Post
    For example I'm interested in Tarot cards. I'll devour tons of books of the subject and then I'll get this burning passion to test the ideas within the books out to see if they work with clarity. I'll throw down the cards only to (usually) find that it doesn't work nearly as clearly as it does theoretically. Then I'll get frustrated and start to see if there are new ways of using them to make them work more objectively. So then I'll change my perspective on how to use them and try again to see if it works. If it works better then I won't dismiss it; but consistent failures only make me more skeptical.
    &

    With typology it has been a similar process of myself getting pissed off because I'd like to be able to directly observe the theory. With MBTI I'd typed myself as INTP and I'd learned the functions, so then I wanted to "watch" those functions work in real life to see if my typing was accurate. When it didn't match up perfectly I dismissed INTP and then moved on to dismiss most of MBTI only to come to Socionics, which appears to be a little bit more clear. For me to truly know that something is right, I have to be able to see it work; that's why LII doesn't really resonate with me....my logic doesn't really work within a vacuum, I always have to go outside of myself to find out what's correct. If I can't directly observe something working I'll do tons and tons of research on it and then try and see a application of it to see if it works.
    Yeah kind of N > T. And definitely some reliance on something extraverted


    This is why romance is difficult for me btw. I don't really believe anything that I say myself and I often need things proved to me before I'll take something. For example today in class I had a girl make a concentrated effort to look specifically at me and then turn away when I looked back. That's relatively strange looking at how we were in a lecture hall with about 50-60 people. The way my thought process works, I can always say what she may have been thinking, but until I see something else to leads me in a different direction, I can only speculate. I'll probably find myself creating an elaborate fantasy (Ni?) but I won't take it seriously unless something happens in reality that conforms with it.
    Could be Ni-Te...


    Going back to the topic of Tarot, that seems to show this weird Ni/Te relationship. Ni loves looking at all of the symbols and using it to interpret trends and see patterns, but my Te always requires that those patterns have enough outward evidence to back them up. I'll read things in Tarot and then take them with a grain of salt because I can't be sure that what I'm seeing is true. I'm plagued by self doubt because I need things proven to me. I'll spend hours, days, months obsessively gathering information and then testing them (through observing them) to see if they're accurate. Thus I spend a great deal of time doing absolutely nothing practical
    Seems the same thing


    Up above I mentioned how I'm not warm and friendly unless people show me that they want me to be. I need objective evidence or information from outside of myself to justify my behaviors.
    That's a bit E-ish (extraversion)


    That's also why I keep going to type forums asking people what they think my type is; I can't figure it out myself because of all of the subjective factors and I'm trying to get information from others (while simultaneously doubting it).

    To take yet another shot at my Fe usage (I've been observing myself today) I've come to the conclusion that I see people as an annoyance, but still care as to how they feel. Paradox? I don't think so.

    What I realized is that the essential thing that I crave from other people is respect. I want to be admired, I want to be told by other people how awesome I am, and I want to accomplish things that other people can see and enjoy. I often beat myself up when I compare myself with other people because they seem to have visible accomplishments while I don't; thus I feel like I don't deserve attention or respect, something that I desperately crave. Thus there's this awkward love hate relationship with people; I like people to pay attention to me but after an extended period of time I find myself annoyed, spiteful, and jealous. It's nothing that I'm proud of, but that's how it is

    What's more is that most of my fear from other people comes from me not wanting other people to think ill of me. I want them to look up to me and like me...and I think that I'm (willingly?) misinterpreting that as genuine empathy. This often manifests as me wanting people around, but having an inner lack of concern with them or their personal concerns as long as they aren't thinking ill of me or hurting my feelings. I'm not very proud of this, but in the past I've found it very easy to lie to people and play two sides of a conflict. Fe creatives probably would explode from doing something like that. The only time when I'll actually feel bad for lying to someone or the people that I actually care the most about are my closest contacts; parents, sister, close family members, long time friends...and even then the difference in warmth and empathy is a small one.

    I guess what makes it hard for me to type myself is that my psyche seems to have worked extremely hard to obscure the main aspects of my personality....probably out of guilt.
    That actually sounds a bit Image type-ish in Enneagram. (If we must stick with socionics, Fe-HA almost, too. Doesn't sound like Fe-DS to me.)

    I'm not sure all Fe-creatives are saints either

    You making a distinction between types of relationships sounds Fi > Fe (socionics).

  5. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    I guess you're definitely N-lead then




    Ni isn't giving you uncertainty then? Or what did you mean? In the last sentence about Ne.




    &



    Yeah kind of N > T. And definitely some reliance on something extraverted




    Could be Ni-Te...




    Seems the same thing




    That's a bit E-ish (extraversion)




    That actually sounds a bit Image type-ish in Enneagram. (If we must stick with socionics, Fe-HA almost, too. Doesn't sound like Fe-DS to me.)

    I'm not sure all Fe-creatives are saints either

    You making a distinction between types of relationships sounds Fi > Fe (socionics).
    Hmm I see...but I'm relatively sure that I'm N>T through all of that. I intuit things and then I rely on thinking to justify them.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by sworm09 View Post
    Hmm I see...but I'm relatively sure that I'm N>T through all of that. I intuit things and then I rely on thinking to justify them.
    yes that one is for sure.

    in socionics that leaves only two types, ILI and ILE, did you see ILE? I know that's an extraverted type... still, your Fe could pass for HA maybe but again it would have to be a neurotic Fe-HA, which isn't impossible though

    I did ask you about what you meant by this: "Ne is just annoying to me as a sense of doubt", so what was that?

    if you don't relate to Ne in ILE, then I would say ILI with Ti demonstrative explaining the Ti.

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    yes that one is for sure.


    in socionics that leaves only two types, ILI and ILE, did you see ILE? I know that's an extraverted type... still, your Fe could pass for HA maybe but again it would have to be a neurotic Fe-HA, which isn't impossible though

    I did ask you about what you meant by this: "Ne is just annoying to me as a sense of doubt", so what was that?

    if you don't relate to Ne in ILE, then I would say ILI with Ti demonstrative explaining the Ti.
    When I said Ne pops up as a sense of doubt I meant that I can never stick with a decision due to myself always being open to a "what if."

    Typing myself has been difficult because as soon as I think I've come to a conclusion, something within me always asks "What if you're wrong?" and then I go back to devouring information to try to make a decision. ..in a cycle.

    I relate to Ne in ILE mostly in that I hate seeing things through and I almost never stick to anything. I get tired of people that I see often in favor of new contacts, I get tired of projects after they're done being new, and I'm always dipping my feet into more things than I can usually handle. I'm impatient and always looking for something exciting or rather... interesting and intellectually fresh to me.

    Yet, I'm not that goofy like a lot of ILEs are and I'm very reserved. Perhaps I'm a Ti subtype of ILE?

    I think the most interesting thing about ILE that I saw was that their emotions rapidly fluctuate due to factors in the environment. That fits me to a tee.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by sworm09 View Post
    When I said Ne pops up as a sense of doubt I meant that I can never stick with a decision due to myself always being open to a "what if."
    Did you check out Judicious/Decisive dichotomy?

    You sound like a bit Ne-ish here but maybe it's Ni, I don't know, a Ni-ego type would have to chime in to tell about how they approach decisions.


    Typing myself has been difficult because as soon as I think I've come to a conclusion, something within me always asks "What if you're wrong?" and then I go back to devouring information to try to make a decision. ..in a cycle.
    Well I can see this being any N.


    I relate to Ne in ILE mostly in that I hate seeing things through and I almost never stick to anything. I get tired of people that I see often in favor of new contacts, I get tired of projects after they're done being new, and I'm always dipping my feet into more things than I can usually handle. I'm impatient and always looking for something exciting or rather... interesting and intellectually fresh to me.
    If you are good at switching to something new often that sounds like Ne > Ni. Ni-lead types - supposedly - tend to need external influence to find a new interest (Se).


    Yet, I'm not that goofy like a lot of ILEs are and I'm very reserved. Perhaps I'm a Ti subtype of ILE?
    That actually reminds me of when you criticized goofiness and silliness. Why? What is your problem with it? To me that then seemed devaluing of Alpha quadra stuff. (ILE is Alpha)


    I think the most interesting thing about ILE that I saw was that their emotions rapidly fluctuate due to factors in the environment. That fits me to a tee.
    Well that's just one thing but sure Fe-HA could fit...


    I guess you aren't going to be any stereotypical type but that's not a problem :p

    I thought of Ni-lead for you originally because of you seeming to prefer all that Ni stuff ("Ni is generally associated with the ability to recognize the unfolding of processes over time (how one event leads to another), have visions of the past and future, develop mental imagery, and see intangible hints of relationships between processes or objects").

    Do you have trouble deciding if you prefer Ni or Ne, then?

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Did you check out Judicious/Decisive dichotomy?

    You sound like a bit Ne-ish here but maybe it's Ni, I don't know, a Ni-ego type would have to chime in to tell about how they approach decisions.




    Well I can see this being any N.




    If you are good at switching to something new often that sounds like Ne > Ni. Ni-lead types - supposedly - tend to need external influence to find a new interest (Se).




    That actually reminds me of when you criticized goofiness and silliness. Why? What is your problem with it? To me that then seemed devaluing of Alpha quadra stuff. (ILE is Alpha)




    Well that's just one thing but sure Fe-HA could fit...


    I guess you aren't going to be any stereotypical type but that's not a problem :p

    I thought of Ni-lead for you originally because of you seeming to prefer all that Ni stuff ("Ni is generally associated with the ability to recognize the unfolding of processes over time (how one event leads to another), have visions of the past and future, develop mental imagery, and see intangible hints of relationships between processes or objects").

    Do you have trouble deciding if you prefer Ni or Ne, then?
    I feel like I'm an Ni dominant; I can use Ne but it's sort of ignored alot. It's like my intuitive leaps are pretty definite, but I remain mildly open to new info

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by sworm09 View Post
    I feel like I'm an Ni dominant; I can use Ne but it's sort of ignored alot. It's like my intuitive leaps are pretty definite, but I remain mildly open to new info
    guess model-A doesn't fit everyone

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