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  1. #1
    Wandering... Emperor Enigma's Avatar
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    Default ENTP or INTP? The Eternal Dilemma

    I have a conundrum that has been driving me insane for the past week or so.

    What distinguishes an Ne-dominant from a Ti-dominant? And how introverted can an ENTP seem? Because I was behaving like an absolute loner today (although, I think my social anxiety is reprehensible for this). I felt as if my brain had shut down, I also became passively misanthropic, I felt as if I am invisible and devoid of purpose. I kept wandering around the high school campus like a shadowy wraith in a graveyard.

    I'm very hypersensitive in social situations, if that's the right word. I often feel as if I'm on an invisible pedestal or stage and everyone in the room is watching me. This is one reason why I can be really socially anxious. I also care about how other people perceive me. I'm also very nostalgic. When I reminisce about the past, I feel these mysterious bodily sensations and sometimes catch a fragment of a song playing simultaneously.

  2. #2
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    I'm an ENP and I have moments like these a lot too, and I'm a total extrovert. I don't see how being devoid of purpose is more of an introverted quality, but behaving a loner, becoming pseudo-misanthropic, I relate to having moments like that. A lot of the time they aren't really even caused by anything external, but some sort of rupturing on the inside that's hard to explain - maybe it's the inner sense of emptiness that 7s feel.

    Maybe ENPs need more time alone with their thoughts because we're N-dominant - it really sucks when you have some sort of Nish realization and then one of your friends cuts you off to talk about something else or they think your idea is pointless or stupid.

    Edit: Hmm, well if you really do have social anxiety then that could explain your hypersensitivity to social situations. I am pretty socially anxious as a social 7 and I have a desire for social ease (Maitri), but it's not as apparent to others. I'm nostalgic and sentimental in the way you described, songs from a while ago bringing back certain feelings, memories of a certain place from my childhood bringing back certain smells, etc.

    I think most people tend to go back and forth between extroverted and introverted moments (not cognitively, but socially).
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  3. #3
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    I learned the rule of thumb a long time ago that if you're waffling between ENP and INP, you're ENP.

    But to be more exact, the real difference would be whether you lead with N and follow with T (ENTP) or whether you lead with T and follow with N (INTP). Do you take in gobs of information first, then check them out for validity, or do you look at everything with a critical eye, then expand outward into possibilities?

  4. #4
    Wandering... Emperor Enigma's Avatar
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    Can you provide an example? I usually take in the information, repeat it mentally or verbally in order to summarize it, inquire for explicit details and then think about its impact (the last two steps can be interchangeable or even simultaneous). I tend to jump into conclusions pretty quickly, only to change my mind a minute later. I can be very gullible sometimes because of my "anything is possible" mental approach. I am only critical with pieces of information that resemble pieces of information I have already been acquainted with in the past.

    I tend to employ cynicism in my humorous ventures but I actually dislike cynicism. I prefer waiting and speculating to making quick judgements. It really irks me whenever a new idea is introduced and people immediately start assaulting it with a critical eye. Just wait and see what happens, damnit! Then, you can judge all you want. However, at times, I can be extremely cynical and pessimistic, especially in the company of my parents (their ideas tend to be detrimental for me).

    By the way, I have an INTJ friend who's quite sociable. He can socialize much better than I can.

    I think I tend to be reclusive and aloof because I'm afraid of people judging me. I'm recalling my early adolescent years. It's not that I don't want to meet new people. I'm just apprehensive about meeting them.

  5. #5
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfAwesome View Post
    I have a conundrum that has been driving me insane for the past week or so.

    What distinguishes an Ne-dominant from a Ti-dominant? And how introverted can an ENTP seem? Because I was behaving like an absolute loner today (although, I think my social anxiety is reprehensible for this). I felt as if my brain had shut down, I also became passively misanthropic, I felt as if I am invisible and devoid of purpose. I kept wandering around the high school campus like a shadowy wraith in a graveyard.

    I'm very hypersensitive in social situations, if that's the right word. I often feel as if I'm on an invisible pedestal or stage and everyone in the room is watching me. This is one reason why I can be really socially anxious. I also care about how other people perceive me. I'm also very nostalgic. When I reminisce about the past, I feel these mysterious bodily sensations and sometimes catch a fragment of a song playing simultaneously.
    If you have to dissect everything down to the cellular level, you might be an INTP.
    If you often get into arguments over semantics, you might be an INTP.

  6. #6
    Member Debaser's Avatar
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    I don't buy this "If you use 'Ne' more than 'Ti'" or "If you intuit more than you think" you are an ENTP crap. It's crap. You are an extrovert if you are an extrovert and you are an introvert if you are an introvert. That's the way I see it anyway. Don't overthink it, and definitely don't take the functions too literally. If you do, you will end up going down rabbit holes and looping around in circles, unsure of your type. The fact is that your type code is supposed to hit on what is most characteristic of you MOST of the time. The only person it helps is you after all; why go after a type that doesn't really describe you? You're not going to find 1 out of 16 boxes to perfectly fit you like a glove anyway. If someone was 100% of every letter, they'd be nuts. They would be a caricature, not a person. Especially when it comes to I/E (the least important letter in my opinion), there are such things as ambiverts you know. You might be one. Or you might just be an introvert who sometimes acts more extroverted or vice versa. So I say, call yourself whatever feels most comfortable. Be it INTP, ENTP or even ANTP. But then, I don't worship Jung or follow function dogma the way some people do. I find the system works best when you actually make it so that the 4 letters you have are the closest matches to how you are most of the time. So what I would do is take a breather, go back to the fundamentals, and ask yourself which of these sets describes you better most of the time:

    - I am seen as “outgoing” or as a “people person.”
    - I feel comfortable in groups and like working in them.
    - I have a wide range of friends and know lots of people.
    - I sometimes jump too quickly into an activity and don’t allow enough time to think it over.
    - Before I start a project, I sometimes forget to stop and get clear on what I want to do and why.

    OR

    - I am seen as “reflective” or “reserved.”
    - I feel comfortable being alone and like things I can do on my own.
    - I prefer to know just a few people well.
    - I sometimes spend too much time reflecting and don’t move into action quickly enough.
    - I sometimes forget to check with the outside world to see if my ideas really fit the experience.

    If the first, ENTP. If the second, INTP. I really think the system is a lot more reliable if you treat it as that simple.

  7. #7
    Wandering... Emperor Enigma's Avatar
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    I identify with both the descriptions. I think I'm an extrovert with social issues, but then I also enjoy solitude at times..
    For the past three years, I have been identifying myself as an ambivert.
    So, which type does my way of taking in information resonate with?

  8. #8
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Well, you are struggling not to understand the external theory, but to identify your own internal characteristics, which would, to me, indicate E over I.

    I tend to jump into conclusions pretty quickly, only to change my mind a minute later. I can be very gullible sometimes because of my "anything is possible" mental approach. I am only critical with pieces of information that resemble pieces of information I have already been acquainted with in the past.

    I tend to employ cynicism in my humorous ventures but I actually dislike cynicism. I prefer waiting and speculating to making quick judgements. It really irks me whenever a new idea is introduced and people immediately start assaulting it with a critical eye. Just wait and see what happens, damnit! Then, you can judge all you want. However, at times, I can be extremely cynical and pessimistic, especially in the company of my parents (their ideas tend to be detrimental for me).
    This sounds more ENTP to me - being more engaged with the external before retreating into the mind to examine it.

    It's not that I don't want to meet new people. I'm just apprehensive about meeting them.
    Yes, you sound overall ENTP to me.

    In general ENTPs have a more exploratory outlook, while INTPs have a more intensely logical one. Both of course are keen to watertightness of logic, but ENTP is more focused on using their logic to innovate and discover the novel, while INTP is more into breaking systems down, analyzing them, and rebuilding them to be better. ENTPs are more get-up-and-go while INTPs are more driven. ENTPs are more enterprising while INTPs are more perseverant. ENTPs prioritize getting their ideas out into the world. INTPs prioritize perfecting what they're working on.

    @Debaser, while I agree with most of your points, I think it's odd to refer to utilizing function theory as "dogma" and "worship" - what makes it so different from the MBTI? As far as I see it function theory is just another tool to be employed as far as it is useful. And at least in the case of INxP versus ENxP the N<T/F or J>T/F pattern seems to hold very true. If MasterOfAwesome identifies himself as an ambivert and desires to choose either I or E, but has not yet found a discriminating line, it seems reasonable to approach the question from another angle.

  9. #9
    Wandering... Emperor Enigma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    Well, you are struggling not to understand the external theory, but to identify your own internal characteristics, which would, to me, indicate E over I.



    This sounds more ENTP to me - being more engaged with the external before retreating into the mind to examine it.



    Yes, you sound overall ENTP to me.

    In general ENTPs have a more exploratory outlook, while INTPs have a more intensely logical one. Both of course are keen to watertightness of logic, but ENTP is more focused on using their logic to innovate and discover the novel, while INTP is more into breaking systems down, analyzing them, and rebuilding them to be better. ENTPs are more get-up-and-go while INTPs are more driven. ENTPs are more enterprising while INTPs are more perseverant. ENTPs prioritize getting their ideas out into the world. INTPs prioritize perfecting what they're working on.

    @Debaser, while I agree with most of your points, I think it's odd to refer to utilizing function theory as "dogma" and "worship" - what makes it so different from the MBTI? As far as I see it function theory is just another tool to be employed as far as it is useful. And at least in the case of INxP versus ENxP the N<T/F or J>T/F pattern seems to hold very true. If MasterOfAwesome identifies himself as an ambivert and desires to choose either I or E, but has not yet found a discriminating line, it seems reasonable to approach the question from another angle.
    Alright, thank you for your assistance!

  10. #10
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfAwesome View Post
    Alright, thank you for your assistance!
    You're welcome! I would encourage you to continue doing more of your own research, but I rest assured that as an NTP you will be doing so anyway.

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