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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Sorry, I didn't notice someone actually posted! :P Thanks.

    Well ENTJ is a possibility, sure.

    As for your points:

    1. Well, I can think things out on my own too. Yes I do keep up certain mental activity longer if I talk to others. But if it's about problem solving, I'm better off thinking on my own, well I can ask others for ideas, but otherwise it would just get in the way talking to others.
    2. No, I don't gather much information on stuff before doing it. Where did you get that impression? I usually just start and figure out things later. I do feel like I'm starting "from nothing" but it's okay.
    3. Yeah if I'm motivated. Is ISTP not good at this?
    4. Same. Is ISTP never goal oriented?
    5. I do have an inner world, but yes, the outer world as well, hmmm, this I or E question is actually pretty hard for me :/

    What do you think? For you, was it obvious you were an introvert?
    ISTPs can be motivated but it's almost a requirement for ENTJs to be.

    Yea it's obvious I'm an introvert. I have talked to some ENTJs that say they come close to looking like introverts since they spend a lot of time alone. Try and figure out if you use Ti or Te. Te usually uses seemingly objective information in the world. Stuff that is popular and accepted. Ti uses it's own logic and can ignore popular and accepted ways of doing things. It's much more independent and contained.

    Oh and I like planning for concrete things, like, plan a day out with tasks needing to be sorted
    Sounds ENTJ. ISTPs and ESTPs aren't really big planners. More of improvisers.

    Yes, I easily nitpick, criticize arguments and theories, I get really anti-social doing this. Rude, arrogant, whatnot. Yes, I do like seeing things inside the framework of the right system.
    This sounds more like Te needing logic to work in the external world. Ti doesn't need to change other people's opinions. So yea I would bet on ENTJ.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger055 View Post
    ISTPs can be motivated but it's almost a requirement for ENTJs to be.
    So do you mean ISTPs sometimes don't really do anything "productive"? Certainly not all the time, right? Me either. :/

    My impression is that ENTJs are always busy with productive work or whatever... I find that terribly admirable but it's just not me. I'm either doing something or I'm not at all doing much.


    Yea it's obvious I'm an introvert. I have talked to some ENTJs that say they come close to looking like introverts since they spend a lot of time alone. Try and figure out if you use Ti or Te. Te usually uses seemingly objective information in the world. Stuff that is popular and accepted. Ti uses it's own logic and can ignore popular and accepted ways of doing things. It's much more independent and contained.
    Well based on that I'm Ti.


    Sounds ENTJ. ISTPs and ESTPs aren't really big planners. More of improvisers.
    So, here's an example, when you know you have to go to three places, you don't really try to figure out which route you want to go to them? Do you just simply get up, go out the door and while on your way, figure where to go first? (Assume that you're free to decide in what order, at what time of the day, and how you get to these places.)

    This sort of thing - what tasks to do and where to go on a given day - is what I plan out though I like changing the plan as well. :p Otoh, if it's just a specific task, I just start doing it. Figure out stuff while doing it. That is, I improvise.


    This sounds more like Te needing logic to work in the external world. Ti doesn't need to change other people's opinions. So yea I would bet on ENTJ.
    So if someone is being illogical, you don't really care?

    By being illogical I mean their opinion makes no sense. Otoh I don't really care what way someone does a task.


    Anyway, sure I'll think about the ENTJ, it's been an option before. I just identify with Ti more. I have wondered if it was Ni instead lol. Though it's not too likely. Do you see the Ni aux too?


    Also, for me it's not obvious if I'm I or E. Why is it obvious in your case?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    So do you mean ISTPs sometimes don't really do anything "productive"? Certainly not all the time, right? Me either. :/

    My impression is that ENTJs are always busy with productive work or whatever... I find that terribly admirable but it's just not me. I'm either doing something or I'm not at all doing much.




    Well based on that I'm Ti.




    So, here's an example, when you know you have to go to three places, you don't really try to figure out which route you want to go to them? Do you just simply get up, go out the door and while on your way, figure where to go first? (Assume that you're free to decide in what order, at what time of the day, and how you get to these places.)

    This sort of thing - what tasks to do and where to go on a given day - is what I plan out though I like changing the plan as well. :p Otoh, if it's just a specific task, I just start doing it. Figure out stuff while doing it. That is, I improvise.




    So if someone is being illogical, you don't really care?

    By being illogical I mean their opinion makes no sense. Otoh I don't really care what way someone does a task.


    Anyway, sure I'll think about the ENTJ, it's been an option before. I just identify with Ti more. I have wondered if it was Ni instead lol. Though it's not too likely. Do you see the Ni aux too?


    Also, for me it's not obvious if I'm I or E. Why is it obvious in your case?
    Depends on how important the three things are but I'm most likely just to say fuck it and figure it out as I go. If given a choice I want no plan.

    Yea I could care less what someone thinks unless it affects me directly somehow. I might call them an idiot just because I want to verbally hit them in the face but I won't get hung up over it. I have my own world that's not affected by them.

    I do math solutions without having to consider concrete steps mechanically, I just let the unconscious do the work.
    That's Ni. I can't do that.

    Well I just don't get the ISTP vibe from you. Usually it's pretty obvious and ENTJs are the type I feel are closest to ISTPs. I think it's the way you talk. ISTPs are efficient simple speakers and we get to the point.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger055 View Post
    Depends on how important the three things are but I'm most likely just to say fuck it and figure it out as I go. If given a choice I want no plan.
    Actually, it was a crap example, because in my case I don't have a choice - at the latest, after I step out the gate, I have to decide which bus to take... and so it does matter in what order I do the visits. Unless I don't mind a lot of wasted time going around. Would you mind spending 3 hours instead of 2 hours on stuff?


    Yea I could care less what someone thinks unless it affects me directly somehow. I might call them an idiot just because I want to verbally hit them in the face but I won't get hung up over it. I have my own world that's not affected by them.
    I wouldn't want to call anyone an idiot before I first at least try reasoning with them....


    That's Ni. I can't do that.
    Then how do you do it, just try a step-by-step solution that you learned mechanically before and hope that it actually works? :o


    Well I just don't get the ISTP vibe from you. Usually it's pretty obvious and ENTJs are the type I feel are closest to ISTPs. I think it's the way you talk. ISTPs are efficient simple speakers and we get to the point.
    Well English isn't my native language, though I don't think I'm much better with words in my native language. I'm just not a verbal type... I read it's Te that can efficiently sum up points logically. I'm anything but that.

    Anyway ok, if I'm ENTJ then I just have to figure out why P gets the strongest score in tests out of all four dichotomies. Because of stuff like, not doing anything until deadline comes up but then work very intensely; having a disorganized life style; like improvising stuff; etc. etc... Where I like planning is the above example and also like training plans in sport. That's where I'm not P-ish at all, though a little P does come out because I change the training plan too quickly if I think the previous one wasn't efficient enough. :p

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Actually, it was a crap example, because in my case I don't have a choice - at the latest, after I step out the gate, I have to decide which bus to take... and so it does matter in what order I do the visits. Unless I don't mind a lot of wasted time going around. Would you mind spending 3 hours instead of 2 hours on stuff?
    Yea efficiency is not a big concern for me. Simplicity is though.

    Then how do you do it, just try a step-by-step solution that you learned mechanically before and hope that it actually works? :o
    Yea I solve it in a sequential way. I know that INTJs and ENTJs can usually let their intuition do the work which I'm jealous of.

    Well English isn't my native language, though I don't think I'm much better with words in my native language. I'm just not a verbal type... I read it's Te that can efficiently sum up points logically. I'm anything but that.

    Anyway ok, if I'm ENTJ then I just have to figure out why P gets the strongest score in tests out of all four dichotomies. Because of stuff like, not doing anything until deadline comes up but then work very intensely; having a disorganized life style; like improvising stuff; etc. etc... Where I like planning is the above example and also like training plans in sport. That's where I'm not P-ish at all, though a little P does come out because I change the training plan too quickly if I think the previous one wasn't efficient enough. :p
    Te likes planning but your tertiary Se likes spontaneity. I wouldn't concern yourself too much with the J/P thing.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    Actually, it was a crap example, because in my case I don't have a choice - at the latest, after I step out the gate, I have to decide which bus to take... and so it does matter in what order I do the visits. Unless I don't mind a lot of wasted time going around. Would you mind spending 3 hours instead of 2 hours on stuff?
    Yea efficiency is not a big concern for me. Simplicity is though.

    Then how do you do it, just try a step-by-step solution that you learned mechanically before and hope that it actually works? :o
    Yea I solve it in a sequential way. I know that INTJs and ENTJs can usually let their intuition do the work. In highschool I was jealous of people who could do it that way.

    Well English isn't my native language, though I don't think I'm much better with words in my native language. I'm just not a verbal type... I read it's Te that can efficiently sum up points logically. I'm anything but that.

    Anyway ok, if I'm ENTJ then I just have to figure out why P gets the strongest score in tests out of all four dichotomies. Because of stuff like, not doing anything until deadline comes up but then work very intensely; having a disorganized life style; like improvising stuff; etc. etc... Where I like planning is the above example and also like training plans in sport. That's where I'm not P-ish at all, though a little P does come out because I change the training plan too quickly if I think the previous one wasn't efficient enough. :p
    I find that ENTJs talk in a more general way than ISTPs. They have a harder time summing up things and getting to the point. Not all of them though.

    Te likes planning but your tertiary Se likes spontaneity. ENTJs are well known for being laid back on how things get done as long as they get done. I wouldn't concern yourself too much with the J/P thing.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger055 View Post
    Yea efficiency is not a big concern for me. Simplicity is though.
    I don't believe you'd be willing to travel 3 hours instead of 2 hours. You said simplicity is important, well, this would be complicating things unnecessarily, taking five bus lines instead of three bus lines. So no, unless you explicitly say you like messing around, complicating things and not only that but missing other more fun things in the process, I don't think you'd be doing that. Pretty unrealistic.


    Yea I solve it in a sequential way. I know that INTJs and ENTJs can usually let their intuition do the work which I'm jealous of.
    Well it can only be properly solved in a sequential way. Or it's not an actual proof. But I do that after I know where to start from because of the intuitive thingie. I see the whole thing, I usually just need to explicitly calculate the numbers after that. So I was actually asking you if you were doing random trial and error to figure what way to start to solve it. Do you do that, then? Must be pretty frustrating, isn't it? It would be for me. I mean, e.g. trying three times knowing nothing about the right direction and just by luck hit upon the right way to solve the question.


    Te likes planning but your tertiary Se likes spontaneity.
    Maybe I am ESFP then because then I can say my tertiary Te likes planning. Planning in general is about like that, it doesn't feel like a dominant function, 'cause I don't plan all the fucking time.


    I wouldn't concern yourself too much with the J/P thing.
    Why not? Are there ENTJs who are highly P, then? Or you mean, you think my two strongest functions are Te Ni but dichotomy wise I'm not ENTJ?


    I find that ENTJs talk in a more general way than ISTPs. They have a harder time summing up things and getting to the point. Not all of them though.
    That makes no sense to me, Te is supposedly excellent at getting to the point.

    I might not be excellent at it, true.


    ENTJs are well known for being laid back on how things get done as long as they get done.
    Okay.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by valaki View Post
    I don't believe you'd be willing to travel 3 hours instead of 2 hours. You said simplicity is important, well, this would be complicating things unnecessarily, taking five bus lines instead of three bus lines. So no, unless you explicitly say you like messing around, complicating things and not only that but missing other more fun things in the process, I don't think you'd be doing that. Pretty unrealistic.




    Well it can only be properly solved in a sequential way. Or it's not an actual proof. But I do that after I know where to start from because of the intuitive thingie. I see the whole thing, I usually just need to explicitly calculate the numbers after that. So I was actually asking you if you were doing random trial and error to figure what way to start to solve it. Do you do that, then? Must be pretty frustrating, isn't it? It would be for me. I mean, e.g. trying three times knowing nothing about the right direction and just by luck hit upon the right way to solve the question.




    Maybe I am ESFP then because then I can say my tertiary Te likes planning. Planning in general is about like that, it doesn't feel like a dominant function, 'cause I don't plan all the fucking time.




    Why not? Are there ENTJs who are highly P, then? Or you mean, you think my two strongest functions are Te Ni but dichotomy wise I'm not ENTJ?




    That makes no sense to me, Te is supposedly excellent at getting to the point.

    I might not be excellent at it, true.




    Okay.
    I get the feeling you are arguing against me just cause you like arguing so you're on your own. Cya.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by badger055 View Post
    I get the feeling you are arguing against me just cause you like arguing so you're on your own. Cya.
    You don't need to take it personally that my style is like this. I do like arguing but I genuinely expected answers to my questions.

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    Well alright maybe someone can analyse the uh, communication that was happening here. Nice chance for experts to hone typology related analytical skills

    Was this then really a Ti - Te conflict here?

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