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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    There's no excuse for this mistake. Introversion and extroversion are the hardest to judge because there are gradations between them. P and J are one of the easiest. The problem here must be JCF, because it doesn't type directly for P or J. They are arrived at indirectly through determining function relationships.
    So for example an Ni Dominant must be a J type, assuming the dominant is correct. And that's a big assumption to weigh the last letter on.
    Here's why P and J aren't easy for some people though. I have seen for example some people stereotype ISFPs as very easy going, completely unobtrusive people...but um, Jung actually said it's the Si type who is this, a person who can even be taken advantage of because of his or her unobtrusive inner world...and then they are sometimes repelled when the Si type suddenly acts with Fe or Te to "make the too high a little lower, the too low a little higher"...it talks about the Si dom being abused. This would be ISFJs, then. Jung also said the Si type made great artists.

    Most people call that ISFJ. Except in Socionics. Socionics is the theory that calls this Si dom the ISFp....except most people here aren't going by Socionics, so I'm baffled by it. Especially since in Socionics Si has so much to do with comfort and health.

    I am very P. I am a big huge P, on most tests I score P the highest letter, and my life is very much evidence to this Pe perception. But because of my sometimes rigid Fi judgments some people think I seem J. And it's kind of like, NO, you see me as "J like" when I make rigid Fi or Te judgments because I'm seeming then more TJ-like, not FJ-like.

    I remember Simulated World trying to explain this to somebody, that FJs look more outwardly rigid, but that FPs are actually more inwardly rigid because of Fi, despite their external flexy-ness.

  2. #62
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    I used my understanding of MBTI functions compared with my actual behavior to justify my Fi aux. that has little to do with functions and much to do with having an understanding of Jung coupled with self awareness
    It's your personal understanding of Jung, however. And as far as JCF is concerned, Fi could just as well be your tertiary type. (?) It's hard to say when using a theory in which anything can be justified because it can be manipulated so many different ways regarding the evidence (e.g., your actual behavior).

    JCF is the indirect route to determining type. Start with determining your levels of P and J in the traditional MBTI.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  3. #63
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    It's your personal understanding of Jung, however. And as far as JCF is concerned, Fi could just as well be your tertiary type. (?) It's hard to say when using a theory in which anything can be justified because it can be manipulated so many different ways regarding the evidence (e.g., your actual behavior).
    JCF is the indirect route to determining type. Start with determining your levels of P and J in the traditional MBTI.
    I already know my type lol
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
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    Sunburst!
    "You are a gay version of Gambit" Speed Gavroche
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  4. #64
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    I already know my type lol
    Yet the Perceptive P comes from your assumption that an Ne-dom has P as the last letter. This has never been proven directly.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  5. #65
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    Ne and Ji and like having a multiple-choice question. Few possibilities, which one is true for you [either logically(Ti) or emotionally(Fi)]
    I N V I C T U S

  6. #66
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    @Mane I know my enneagram is wrong (I'm just too lazy to change it- that and I don't really "get" enneagram as well as I do MBTI so I'm not sure about the wings and whatevers) but I'm curious to know what you think I am instead of a 4. Which I'm pretty sure I'm not, now.
    6 Six siX SIX 6 6 SiX sIX

    Errrrm, dunno, maybe consider 6, or something....




    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    I'm not sure what type "anger" is.
    8-9-1 =p

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Such Irony View Post
    I've seen a bit of P/J mistyping, mostly as INFP mistyping as INFJ and INTP mistyping as INTJ.
    hrm, i think i've seen 3 of the former in my time here, but i don't think i've ever seen INTP/INTJ mistypings. do you remember their retyping discussions? i'd like to have a look.

  8. #68
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    they are almost always along the same lines:

    S mistyping as N
    F males mistyping as T
    T females mistyping as F
    EN mistyping as IN
    IS mistyping as ES

    by far P/J mistypings seem to be the rarest... and yet I/E is the only one accepted by behavioral psychology, "cause of test consistency"... how the fuck did that happen? go figure.
    True, good points! And certain Enneatypes can create confusion, too. 1 looks like J, 2 looks like FJ, 3 looks like Fe or T, 4 looks like FP, 5 looks like TP, 6 looks like SJ, 7 looks like ExxP, 8 looks like ExxJ, and 9 looks like IxxP...

    i don't think i've ever seen INTP/INTJ mistypings. do you remember their retyping discussions?
    They occur with some frequency with new, young (teen) INTP members in particular - maybe check the Type Me section. I think there's a tendency with some young INTPs to idealize the INTJ descriptions.

    There's definitely a tendency with ENFPs to misunderstand cognitive extraversion and assess their social extraversion, and wind up misidentifying as INFP as a result.

  9. #69
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    Yet the Perceptive P comes from your assumption that an Ne-dom has P as the last letter. This has never been proven directly.
    Neither has anything anyone has ever said on typology ever. With the exception of I and E.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    They occur with some frequency with new, young (teen) INTP members in particular - maybe check the Type Me section. I think there's a tendency with some young INTPs to idealize the INTJ descriptions.
    Darn it, this is the 2nd time you have made me look like a complete Typology ignoramous (well at least ISTP has also been a big part of that mix... with some ENTP on the side)! I'm forever cursed to be singled out as the prime mistyped member of this forum. @AffirmitiveAnxiety is up there too as well (considering pretty much every F type in existence), so takes some pressure off of me.

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