ENFP/INFP

[Xander]

ah.. the little dom in cov??

No he's an INFP. And quit digging. It may become obvious later but I'm being confidential. NT... being sympathetic... a little help wouldn't go amiss!!

Well i'm not sure it's really sunk in that I'm going to have a fuc.... INTP wife soon!!!

I read that totally different and thought "I know... there's no need to broadcast though"

Eccentric cat ladies!

Are you admitting or just commenting ?

Well, seeing as both extraversion and feeling have a tendancy to be slightly more people-oriented functions, it makes perfect sense that an EF that doesn't like people would come off slightly more like an IT than typical.

Even to the point where they declare most people beneath them and not worth bothering with? I mean I empathise with this guy and that's just not right if he's an ENFP. I should be slapping him for being all illogical and stuff.

And there is also the difference affected by gender, as we all know females are, to a certain extent, permitted to be much more mushy and in day to day life than males.

So many people need to meet my sister ....

And if you look at the cognitive functions - ENFPs are NeFi... Ne is all about ideas, trains of thought, etc, so not nessecarily to do with people (although people are certainly a very interesting way to bounce your thoughts off). And Fi is all about internal values... again, feasibly requiring little influence from people to operate comfortable.

Ne...Fi... doesn't that equal the perfect concoction for "nobody likes me... it's a conspiracy too!!!" ?

ENFPs are about the most prone to be defined by others... mind you though I've yet to find a "normal" one

Anyway, I think the point I'm trying to say, is that although people may feasibly not be necessarily be the main focus of an ENFP (and merely a trifling amusement, for example), I think for an ENFP to have no interest in people whatsoever is beyond what I would consider a normal derivation from the norm...

I think he's too heavy an N and finds most people draining as he has to explain his hop, skip and jump style.

I agree, so it really depends on how 'nonsocial' this ENFP fellow is - just slightly standoffish? Absolutely normal. Completely asocial? Not so...

He hides in his house, is practically silent unless you are well known to him, doesn't express unless it's just me him and one other... very easy to accidentally make him go quiet and yet he seems to take offence at very little..

He's an oddball...

Ergo ENFP...

 

[Xander]

Introverts, from the original temperament observations have a longer response delay. So they build up anger more slowly then the extroverts, but then they will explode, sometimes violently. The "butler who did it" could have been a INFP who served his master faithfully, felt used, and then reacted in a murderous rage. The directing introverts will tend to hold grudges longer, but an informing introvert such as the INFP will hold them too if the issue is not resolved.

The informing extrovert is so people-oriented, they will want to get over conflict faster.

Good point. Sometimes you have to wonder if they want to get it over at all though. The ENFJ "well f' you and all your ancestors" is a prime example!

Btw, my problem ENFP has all four (or five if we're being technical) temperament elements except choleric. His strive for success has been chopped off. Any ideas?

 

[Dom]

ENFPs are about the most prone to be defined by others... mind you though I've yet to find a "normal" one

That is explained by the NeFi conflict, the Fi gives a solid idea of what our values are, the NE of all the possibilities of what the non-existent values of society could be, and thus conflict...

So definded by others, but only within a framework that the Fi agrees makes sense hence why we aren't really defined by others, just constrained by them.

 

[Dom]

His strive for success has been chopped off. Any ideas?

constrained or destroyed ego...

or failure in the past,

or both combining with a fear that if he were to try again and fail again even the life he has now would be deminished...

As a guess..

And I'm trying to respect you NT attempt at sympathy and discretion, though implicit in that is that I do know him...

 

[Xander]

That is explained by the NeFi conflict, the Fi gives a solid idea of what our values are, the NE of all the possibilities of what the non-existent values of society could be, and thus conflict...

So definded by others, but only within a framework that the Fi agrees makes sense hence why we aren't really defined by others, just constrained by them.

So damning and yet so true.

constrained or destroyed ego...

or failure in the past,

or both combining with a fear that if he were to try again and fail again even the life he has now would be deminished...

As a guess..

Correct. I know this bit What can I do about it?

And I'm trying to respect you NT attempt at sympathy and discretion, though implicit in that is that I do know him...

I was kidding... hullo. Losen up. Jeez, anyone would think you were getting married or something...

 

[Dom]

So damning and yet so true.

Was it damning? opps. honesty = damning for an enfp... shit better get back to self-delusion again quick...

Correct. I know this bit What can I do about it?

er nothing, except wait till he wants to do something or sounds like he may, then offer lots of advice and support (even if he does something you think is crazyish (obiovusly trying class a's shoudn't be supported) or not exactly what you suggest). Basically he'll only snap out of it once he is fed up with how he is now and decides he has to do something. Otherwise what ever you do to help him, becomes the reason for the changes, and thus his ego remains flat.. "Ok so i'm now the best film director in the world, but it wasn't me it was all xander really 15 years ago...." If you see what I mean? He needs to do things he wants and for it to be obvious that it is HIM that did it. That's why he hasn't done it yet, because if he tries and fails... OUCH

I was kidding... hullo. Losen up. Jeez, anyone would think you were getting married or something...

Oh I'm getting married? lol

Sorry I thought you were working on your Fe or something, I obviously want to encourage that!! lol

 

[arcticangel02]

Even to the point where they declare most people beneath them and not worth bothering with? I mean I empathise with this guy and that's just not right if he's an ENFP. I should be slapping him for being all illogical and stuff.

That sounds more like a defensive mechanism than real reason - I can't imagine a proper ENFP truly believing that most people are lesser and not worth bothering with, so it may be a reason he pulls up to cover what's really there? Hm...

So many people need to meet my sister ....

Not mushy at all? What type is she?

I should probably not use that example (gender stereotypes), but even as much as it's totally not relevant to some people, other times it explains a lot. So, worth considering, IMO. Even if it's just in the general brain dump of thoughts on an issue like this!

Ne...Fi... doesn't that equal the perfect concoction for "nobody likes me... it's a conspiracy too!!!" ?

Yes, yes it does.

ENFPs are about the most prone to be defined by others... mind you though I've yet to find a "normal" one

Isn't that interesting, considering that Fi as a function is all about your own set of values, your internal compass. And yet we ENFPs change opinion based on external approval/disapproval with alarming frequency. INFPs, on the other hand, I get the impression are very certain in what they believe. I wouldn't even know where to start finding out what I believe in that is so solid and certain.

I think he's too heavy an N and finds most people draining as he has to explain his hop, skip and jump style.

That would explain a lot, and is one of the main reasons I end up getting sick of people every now and again. I can imagine being a really extreme N could be similar to an extreme Introvert in the way that they are frustrated and exhausted by 'regular people'.

He hides in his house, is practically silent unless you are well known to him, doesn't express unless it's just me him and one other... very easy to accidentally make him go quiet and yet he seems to take offence at very little..

He's an oddball...

Ergo ENFP...

Haha, thanks. Such faith in our type, there.

Out of curiosity, though, what helped you to decide on ENFP for him, when he clearly isn't a very typical one?

Wait, am I supposed to be helping solve an issue? I just like discussing ideas.

 

[alcea rosea]

That's like a dog saying that it's not that they love food, they just love the taste

Yes, but there is a difference.
a) I'm not a dog
b) I'm not a dog.


Seriously speaking. I only love few people. I like people but even I don't like everybody. I like the interaction so it includes me and the other person/s. So I can say that I like social psychology over psychology.

 

[Dom]

Isn't that interesting, considering that Fi as a function is all about your own set of values, your internal compass. And yet we ENFPs change opinion based on external approval/disapproval with alarming frequency. INFPs, on the other hand, I get the impression are very certain in what they believe. I wouldn't even know where to start finding out what I believe in that is so solid and certain.

I'm not so sure, I think INFPs are uncertain just as much, they just present a concept as certain to the world. if you see what I mean?

We are Es and so find the idea of throwing a concept, we are unsure about, out into the wider world as acceptable and informative; it will be tested this way and thus improved or ruined appropriatly. Introverts feel they need to have it right when they through the concept to the world for exactly the same reason, though they see the testing as, well not negative but unplesant or personal, as do E's.

I think they still have as many unsures deep down, but feel it isn't a great idea to show that.

i don't think i change my opinions very often at all, let alone alarmingly frequently, but we share a type not a head lol! I see it that we have an internal compass, but we doubt it's validity and thus get buffetted by others approval/disapproval but in the end we still find ourselves returning to that compass eventually...

 

[arcticangel02]

I'm not so sure, I think INFPs are uncertain just as much, they just present a concept as certain to the world. if you see what I mean?

We are Es and so find the idea of throwing a concept, we are unsure about, out into the wider world as acceptable and informative; it will be tested this way and thus improved or ruined appropriatly. Introverts feel they need to have it right when they through the concept to the world for exactly the same reason, though they see the testing as, well not negative but unplesant or personal, as do E's.

I think they still have as many unsures deep down, but feel it isn't a great idea to show that.

That definitely makes sense. An INFP has to decide on where things stand before they present it to the world, wheras ENFPs are happy to throw the half-decided products out and alter it depending on the reception? Interesting...

i don't think i change my opinions very often at all, let alone alarmingly frequently, but we share a type not a head lol! I see it that we have an internal compass, but we doubt it's validity and thus get buffetted by others approval/disapproval but in the end we still find ourselves returning to that compass eventually...

Lol, of course. I exaggerate, as I often do, but I've noticed in myself the tendancy to fairly rapidly change my opinion on something to align with what another person's (often adamant) opinion is. It's not like I completely abandon my original stance, it's just I alter it (sometimes a fair bit) when faced with an alternate opinion. I mean, usually it's a fairly trivial issue ("Oh, I can't stand that type of shoe!" ) but I still do it to a certain extent with larger issues.

Actually, I just realised something. My little brother is an INFP, and I've noticed on occasion that he has a tendancy to spout our ESTJ father's opinions back out as his own. The ESTJ is naturally very certain and definite and logical about what he believes, and my brother would still be developing his ideals (he's 15), so he's possibly more affected by external opinion than I am.

Can I hazard a guess that an INFP eventually settles and decides on a solid value base, wheras an ENFP tends to keep theirs open?

Or maybe they both settle down into a solid set of values as they go on in life? I'm only 20, so it makes sense that my values are still in a state of fluidity.

 

[Eric B]

Good point. Sometimes you have to wonder if they want to get it over at all though. The ENFJ "well f' you and all your ancestors" is a prime example!

Well, ENFJ is directive, not informative. NJ and ST are directing, and NP and SF are informing. So yes, a directive will tend to have that kind of attitude, too. You had earlier mentioned something like this for an INFP/ The INFP might biuld up to that point and explode like that because of his introversion. The Directive type, whether introverted or introverted will tend to be more critical like that. Only thin, you still have the same dynamic of the introvert building up and exploding, so the IN-J's reaction may be worse than the EN-J who's been constantly barking at you, and perhaps almost getting a kick out of it.

Btw, my problem ENFP has all four (or five if we're being technical) temperament elements except choleric. His strive for success has been chopped off. Any ideas?

ENFP would be a Sanguine in the social area (Inclusion). This would correspond to the Get Things Going Interaction Style (extraverted, informing). It could also be a blend of Sanguine with Phlegmatic (which just tempers down the traits a bit).
NF sould seem to be closest to either a Phlegmatic in Control (which is very diplomatic like NF), or possibly even Supine, the fifth temperament. More likely, a Supine-Phlegmatic blend, as the pure Supine has dependency issues I don't see in most NF descriptions. (they can't make independent decisions, yet the Phlegmatic and Supine-Phlegmatic blend are more independent).
Then, in Affection, he could be anything, as that area doesn't seem well represented (at least not directly) in the type system. If he's Melancholy in that area, and the other three in the other areas, then he would be as you say, a blend of all temperaments except Choleric.

Has your brother taken the FIRO also like you and your father? Then we can get a better idea. As ENFP, I would expect a high e and w in Inclusion (People Gatherer, like you, but most likely with higher scores), moderate scores in Control (Matcher, like you, but with lower eC, or a Checker with even lower eC than Matcher, or maybe Loyal Lieutenant or Openly Dependant (low eC/higher wC), and perahaps a Pessimist in Affection (low e&w).

I had been typed as ENFP, and have been trying it on, yet there has always been questions about it. In addition to it apparently not matching the critical "Choleric" aspect of my personality as my APS score did (and an NTP type would seem to better fit), I have really been thinking about my function use. While some people say they have observed Fi and Te and I had at first accepted that, I think I might have learned those, in defense basically (due to coming from a very heavily "Te" STJ environment, who often hit you with it full force), but Ti "frameworks", "leveraging", "analyzing", etc. are really the more natural companions to my obvious Ne pref.

I am still in the process of fully understanding the archetypes, and I was also thinking about starting a thread in this sub-forum on my own type, but I wanted to think of more examples of my process use to show. I know some have said they read my pages on the correlation between the FIRO-APS system with the MBTI and Keirsey, and I have also discussed a lot of it here.
So those who have read my stuff, would you say it reflects more FP'ish "puer" Te and preferred Fi, or more TP'ish preferred Ti? Sometimes, it's hard to tell which are which. Like which are values, or "principles", and whether the thinking is being used "internally" or "externally".
I know I have used a framework (espressiveness and responsiveness matrices) in mapping the system together, yet I would imagine that the way I have actually spelled it out might come across as more Te-ish, especially with the tables and diagrams, and the length of it (Ti is supposed to be more "concise"). Again, I think that is just the way I have learned to express my thoughts, (and especially trying to break it down in to make people understand it); but it seems the actual internal processes might be more Ti. I have people say both ways. And ENFP's, from what I have seen, do not seem to be this much into theories and stuff, despite the dom. Ne and tertiary Te. I have joined several Yahoo groups, and do not seem to fit in. Their discussions are more like any other NF's.

 

[Xander]

Eric,
Try checking this thread out MBTI dissection - The Puddin' and see if that helps your dissection. I believe it's more along your lines of how to think about the MBTI.

Dom,
Knowing the joke hidden within your profile (they each have one btw) is always damning. It is a very wise observation though.

Alcea Rosea,
Precisely what's wrong with being a dog? Some of my favourite people are dogs!

What's nicer than having someone who's so happy just to see you return home for no other reason than it's you? (Well possibly the idea of food and being fed comes into it but I choose to delude myself )

 

[Dom]

What's nicer than having someone who's so happy just to see you return home for no other reason than it's you? (Well possibly the idea of food and being fed comes into it but I choose to delude myself )

I have that!! Though not in a canine form more in a Gen form...

 

[Xander]

Right INFPs versus ENFPs on certainty.. I think Dom's partially right in that an ENFP can and will throw the most random ideas out there just to see if they bounce (a nice parallel is ENFPs are dolphins ). What I disagree with is the idea that INFPs feel they have to be right before proceeding... both types have to feel it's right before moving. It's a question of instinct more than precision. Most INFPs I'd imagine do pay attention to if it's "right" or not but what they can and will do is back it up with their more forceful side.

I think that ENFPs have more force to use than INFPs but lack the focus to apply it correctly and vice versa. Hence Dom is almost there with learning off INTJs (not that he said as much) but I'd think that more could be learned from ESTJs. The reason being that INTJ is a little to close to the ENFP type (due to ESFP links) where as ESTJ should be markedly different and hence easier to pick up (a similar thing to it's easier to see that something is blue [and what shape it is] when you put it against red than if you stand it against turquoise and purple [that's way over simplified btw]).

 

[Xander]

I have that!! Though not in a canine form more in a Gen form...

A content and happy INTP is quite dog like. It's the whole innocent F thing. As one of these creatures, sometimes I'm just happy to see someone. I then try and think what to do to entertain them and so the indecision goes away. That when I go to find my new toy for us both to play with.

 

[Xander]

Well, ENFJ is directive, not informative. NJ and SF are directing, and NP and SF are informing.

I'm presuming that you should have said that ST is directing there.. would that be right?

So yes, a directive will tend to have that kind of attitude, too. You had earlier mentioned something like this for an INFP/ The INFP might biuld up to that point and explode like that because of his introversion. The Directive type, whether introverted or introverted will tend to be more critical like that. Only thin, you still have the same dynamic of the introvert building up and exploding, so the IN-J's reaction may be worse than the EN-J who's been constantly barking at you, and perhaps almost getting a kick out of it.

Oh hell yeah. When an introvert explodes they tend to go for the throat!

NF sould seem to be closest to either a Phlegmatic in Control (which is very diplomatic like NF),

Phlegmatic in control is diplomatic?

My instinct agrees that NF is phlegmatic in control but I'm not so sure if that's diplomatic or not. Wouldn't that be more the NF-ST "pernickety" side?

Then, in Affection, he could be anything, as that area doesn't seem well represented (at least not directly) in the type system. If he's Melancholy in that area, and the other three in the other areas, then he would be as you say, a blend of all temperaments except Choleric.

Well the melancholy is more imposed than natural I'd imagine. The inborn temperament is more sanguine, he's just been "squashed".

Has your brother taken the FIRO also like you and your father? Then we can get a better idea. As ENFP, I would expect a high e and w in Inclusion (People Gatherer, like you, but most likely with higher scores), moderate scores in Control (Matcher, like you, but with lower eC, or a Checker with even lower eC than Matcher, or maybe Loyal Lieutenant or Openly Dependant (low eC/higher wC), and perahaps a Pessimist in Affection (low e&w).

Oh he's not my brother, he's a friend. The brother ENFP is Dom (see above). Well kind of brother, more socially adopted than by blood (though the arguments are definitely sibling like ).

I had been typed as ENFP, and have been trying it on, yet there has always been questions about it. In addition to it apparently not matching the critical "Choleric" aspect of my personality as my APS score did (and an NTP type would seem to better fit), I have really been thinking about my function use. While some people say they have observed Fi and Te and I had at first accepted that, I think I might have learned those, in defense basically (due to coming from a very heavily "Te" STJ environment, who often hit you with it full force), but Ti "frameworks", "leveraging", "analyzing", etc. are really the more natural companions to my obvious Ne pref.

ENTP and ENFP should be fairly similar aside from the choleric part. Perhaps the result was skewed by your inclusion facet?

Make sure you check the link I posted earlier, it should illuminate a lot.

 

[Eric B]

I'm presuming that you should have said that ST is directing there.. would that be right?

Corrected

Phlegmatic in control is diplomatic?

My instinct agrees that NF is phlegmatic in control but I'm not so sure if that's diplomatic or not. Wouldn't that be more the NF-ST "pernickety" side?

Well, in Keirsey's theory, the NF is described as "Diplomatic skills set", while the others are "Strategic", "Logistical", and "Tactical".
Meanwhile, in APS, the Phlegmatic in Control is also described as a diplomat, and this is one big evidence of this correlation (Keirsey actually mixed them up and said NT was Phlegmatic, and NF was Choleric).
The Phlegmatic is described as a peacemaker, because he has low energy and takes "the path of least resistance". Hence trying to resolve disputes and stuff like that.

Well the melancholy is more imposed than natural I'd imagine. The inborn temperament is more sanguine, he's just been "squashed".

OK. The ENP part of it would be the Sanguine (in Inclusion). The Control might be Phlegmatic.

 

[arcticangel02]

Right INFPs versus ENFPs on certainty.. I think Dom's partially right in that an ENFP can and will throw the most random ideas out there just to see if they bounce (a nice parallel is ENFPs are dolphins ). What I disagree with is the idea that INFPs feel they have to be right before proceeding... both types have to feel it's right before moving. It's a question of instinct more than precision. Most INFPs I'd imagine do pay attention to if it's "right" or not but what they can and will do is back it up with their more forceful side.

I think that ENFPs have more force to use than INFPs but lack the focus to apply it correctly and vice versa. Hence Dom is almost there with learning off INTJs (not that he said as much) but I'd think that more could be learned from ESTJs. The reason being that INTJ is a little to close to the ENFP type (due to ESFP links) where as ESTJ should be markedly different and hence easier to pick up (a similar thing to it's easier to see that something is blue [and what shape it is] when you put it against red than if you stand it against turquoise and purple [that's way over simplified btw]).

That's interesting!

See, my father is an ESTJ, and I wonder if that's helped me be more focused in my life and work than an ordinary ENFP? Although I can be really disorganised and very good at convincing myself that such a thing really doesn't need to be done right now, I am never completely this out-of-control scattered chaos that sometimes seems to be assigned to this type...

I am continually in awe of his general efficiency and organisation (especially more recently when I've had to work with him on organising various things)... ask him to do something/check something out/call someone? Barring some major obstruction, he'll have it done within a few hours, or by the very next day at least.

Even if on a simply superficial level, it inspires me to be more organised myself.

 

[Eric B]

ENTP and ENFP should be fairly similar aside from the choleric part. Perhaps the result was skewed by your inclusion facet?

I'm leaning more towards what I would call a "passive ENTP", for now. ENTP sounds a bit too "rambunctious" to be me (It's a SanChlor, after all, and expressive in both Inclsuion and Control!) but as my Inclusion is what has been called a "passive Sanguine", then my interaction style could be called "passive Get Things Going" (I also look at it as "hyper-Behind the Scenes"), and the type therefore is "passive ENTP". Thus I also have the I/E ambiguities, but I can live with those much better than the T/F issues of trying to fit into an ENFP.

Try checking this thread out MBTI dissection - The Puddin' and see if that helps your dissection. I believe it's more along your lines of how to think about the MBTI.

... it should illuminate a lot.

OK; that's a discussion on the archetypes. Those are really interesting, and what were used to type me as ENFP. But I believe people looked at outward behavior only. Mostly, it was a so-called "personality type coach" who is fluent in Beebe's concepts who insisted on ENFP, but I'm seeing now that her motivation was that all my theorizing rubbing her the wrong way, and she picked up Te in my discussions, which is in her shadow, and said it must have been in the puer (tertiary) position, making me seem like an E-FP. I took her word for it, and I did seem to relate to both Fi and Te, but now I'm thinking those are less natural (and actually in my shadow) than Ti. She has a way of interpreting everything that I think might be Ti either as Te, or a "trickster" Ti. I am after all, working with a framework (FIRO's E/R), that I am using to compare the two systems. She claims all this putting things together "like jigsaw pieces" is Te. Maybe some of it is. But looking back on my whole lifetime of thought, I think Ti stuff is much more natural to me, and Te is just something I learned in order to deal with all the Te types I grew up with, and to express my ideas (and this same person points out that American society is basically modeled after the ESTJ. Makes a lot of sense).

Then, I also did a rough shortcut to the Step II subscales, which also suggested ENFP. But again, I think I may have graded them too highly on the "feeling" side, thinking that "values" were more important to me than they really are. It seems many things that seem like Fi values, with me really have some underlying intellectual framework behind them.

So again, do my writings seem more Ti or Te to everyone?

 

[Gabe]

Well, ENFJ is directive, not informative. NJ and ST are directing, and NP and SF are informing. So yes, a directive will tend to have that kind of attitude, too. You had earlier mentioned something like this for an INFP/ The INFP might biuld up to that point and explode like that because of his introversion. The Directive type, whether introverted or introverted will tend to be more critical like that. Only thin, you still have the same dynamic of the introvert building up and exploding, so the IN-J's reaction may be worse than the EN-J who's been constantly barking at you, and perhaps almost getting a kick out of it.

ENFP would be a Sanguine in the social area (Inclusion). This would correspond to the Get Things Going Interaction Style (extraverted, informing). It could also be a blend of Sanguine with Phlegmatic (which just tempers down the traits a bit).
NF sould seem to be closest to either a Phlegmatic in Control (which is very diplomatic like NF), or possibly even Supine, the fifth temperament. More likely, a Supine-Phlegmatic blend, as the pure Supine has dependency issues I don't see in most NF descriptions. (they can't make independent decisions, yet the Phlegmatic and Supine-Phlegmatic blend are more independent).
Then, in Affection, he could be anything, as that area doesn't seem well represented (at least not directly) in the type system. If he's Melancholy in that area, and the other three in the other areas, then he would be as you say, a blend of all temperaments except Choleric.

Has your brother taken the FIRO also like you and your father? Then we can get a better idea. As ENFP, I would expect a high e and w in Inclusion (People Gatherer, like you, but most likely with higher scores), moderate scores in Control (Matcher, like you, but with lower eC, or a Checker with even lower eC than Matcher, or maybe Loyal Lieutenant or Openly Dependant (low eC/higher wC), and perahaps a Pessimist in Affection (low e&w).

I had been typed as ENFP, and have been trying it on, yet there has always been questions about it. In addition to it apparently not matching the critical "Choleric" aspect of my personality as my APS score did (and an NTP type would seem to better fit), I have really been thinking about my function use. While some people say they have observed Fi and Te and I had at first accepted that, I think I might have learned those, in defense basically (due to coming from a very heavily "Te" STJ environment, who often hit you with it full force), but Ti "frameworks", "leveraging", "analyzing", etc. are really the more natural companions to my obvious Ne pref.

I am still in the process of fully understanding the archetypes, and I was also thinking about starting a thread in this sub-forum on my own type, but I wanted to think of more examples of my process use to show. I know some have said they read my pages on the correlation between the FIRO-APS system with the MBTI and Keirsey, and I have also discussed a lot of it here.
So those who have read my stuff, would you say it reflects more FP'ish "puer" Te and preferred Fi, or more TP'ish preferred Ti? Sometimes, it's hard to tell which are which. Like which are values, or "principles", and whether the thinking is being used "internally" or "externally".
I know I have used a framework (espressiveness and responsiveness matrices) in mapping the system together, yet I would imagine that the way I have actually spelled it out might come across as more Te-ish, especially with the tables and diagrams, and the length of it (Ti is supposed to be more "concise"). Again, I think that is just the way I have learned to express my thoughts, (and especially trying to break it down in to make people understand it); but it seems the actual internal processes might be more Ti. I have people say both ways. And ENFP's, from what I have seen, do not seem to be this much into theories and stuff, despite the dom. Ne and tertiary Te. I have joined several Yahoo groups, and do not seem to fit in. Their discussions are more like any other NF's.

oh come on. I am teaching myself vector calculus right now (so that I can understand theoretical meteorology) , I just wrote paper on a book I read about economic development in China, and I've probably read more material on psychological types than you plan to read in your lifetime. I also read Lee Smolin's book "The trouble with physics" last year. So what if you didn't fit in with a discussion group, those people are there because they identify with the stereotype of ENFP. And I bet that only some are actually ENFPs.

Now read the type caption under my name. Do you trust that?