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  1. #21
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Change your actual type? No.
    Change your expressed type? Well unless you are restricted or retarded then yes you should do this anyway.
    Yep, that's right. The true type doesn't change, but the expressed one, the faces and the shadow can all change their surface pressure.

  2. #22
    Enigma Nadir's Avatar
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    I wonder what true type is.
    Oh, yes -- it must be the true type. ;)
    Not really.

  3. #23
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadir View Post
    I wonder what true type is.
    Oh, yes -- it must be the true type.
    Ha, fair question. The one determined by your functional preferences!

  4. #24
    Enigma Nadir's Avatar
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    Do you want to pursue the deep darkness that is the shadow of seemingly happy-go-lucky and alight MBTI theory, Geoff? What is a functional preference? Who, or what, determines functional preferences? Who, or what determines the determined functional preferences' correctness? Is there anything that can be said about MBTI that absolves it from being a system of make-believe? Have fun!
    Not really.

  5. #25
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadir View Post
    Do you want to pursue the deep darkness that is the shadow of seemingly happy-go-lucky and alight MBTI theory, Geoff? What is a functional preference? Who, or what, determines functional preferences? Who, or what determines the determined functional preferences' correctness? Is there anything that can be said about MBTI that absolves it from being a system of make-believe? Have fun!
    Oh, you've got me there

    I'd settle for the type being that which flows from

    1) the answers given from a naive taking of the MBTI test (ie before you understand the significance of the questions)
    2) verification by way of an interview
    3) verification by way of observational dynamics over a day or so

    (this was the system used by a registered MBTI practicioner when I was tested, while naive, at work)

  6. #26
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jen View Post
    I know this has been discussed before, but is it possible? Can another person influence your type change?

    I think my Husband has rubbed off on me over the years because I keep scoring INTJ whenever I take an MBTI test online. I think the kids have made me less J and my Husband has brought out my Thinking side.
    I responded a couple of times to this inquiry and maintain that our native dominant function remains intact. Jung seems explicit that one function will always dominate, however from the book "Gifts Differing", Isabel Briggs Myers makes some interesting comments that some of us are born with what she refers to as a clean slate by stating,
    "If in fact, some people are born without any disposition to be one type or another, then outer circumstances one might conjecture, would have a free hand in determing which if any attitudes and processes would be developed." [p. 181]
    But prior to making this disclaimer, she agrees with Jung by starting the "Pressures of Environment" section off in saying,
    "The finest examples of type development result when children's immediate environment encourages their their native capacities. However, when an environment squarely conflicting with their capacities forces children to depend on unnatural processes or attitudes, the result is a "falsification of type", which robs its victims of their real selves and makes them into inferior, frustrated copies of other people". [p.181]
    This section does provide an interesting caveat to any claim of rare type. Myers-Briggs mentions rarity of type in defining a person who has not developed their auxiliary properly. Jung lays similar claims in stating that no one is a pure type, but on rare occasion there will be someone who may be limited to a specific general and cognitive function. This seems to imply that for those claiming to be rare, are essentially admitting to rigidity of their dominant function, thus are bordering on personality disorder.

    "Gifts Differing" goes on to further say that,
    "Western civilization has inclined men toward thinking, women toward feeling, and both sexes toward extraversion and the judging attitude. The pressure of outer circumstances itself would seem to be toward sensing. Thus, anyone who came into the world as a clean slate would be likely to be marked ESTJ or ESFJ fairly promptly by the collective slate pencil, which may explain why there are so many ESTJs and ESFJs in the general population."
    Last edited by "?"; 06-10-2008 at 08:20 AM.

  7. #27
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Type isn't even real. Cognitive processes are.
    Yes and no, both Myers-Briggs and Jung refer to their theories in using cognitive processes, but based on one's preference they label us as types. "Gifts Differing" has a sub title of "Understanding Personality Type" and chapter X of his work, Jung calls personality type. So type is simply the result of which cognitive process is preferred, which is why people like us stop using four letter codes and use our cognitive processes to show our type.

  8. #28
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadir View Post
    I wonder what true type is.
    Oh, yes -- it must be the true type.
    The true type of a person is the one they use when they're not trying to compensate for anything. It could be considered their relaxed state but often that's confused with a fun state which leads people to see ESFP when they should see the INTJ.

    I'd hoped to be able to come up with an analogy but I'm failing at present.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  9. #29
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    Can you switch types?
    I know this has been discussed before, but is it possible? Can another person influence your type change?


    I don't believe anybody can change their type. A person is able to help in balancing other persons type (or unbalance) by "teaching" a different way to behave/think/act etc. and when this happens it can LOOK like you changed your type.

  10. #30
    Senior Membrane spirilis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alcea Rosea View Post
    Can you switch types?
    I know this has been discussed before, but is it possible? Can another person influence your type change?


    I don't believe anybody can change their type. A person is able to help in balancing other persons type (or unbalance) by "teaching" a different way to behave/think/act etc. and when this happen it can LOOK like you changed your type.
    that is pretty much my opinion of type too. I think our type forms fairly early on, ie in childhood and adolescence and more or less sets the stage for much of our personality development later on.

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