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  1. #11
    ~dangerous curves ahead~
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carebear View Post
    Made an edit above by the way.



    Bolding the parts that could be INFJ. (Yes, many could also be INTJ or other types, but some still strike me as more INFJ than INTJ. You'll never know if he's INFJ or INTJ before you get inside his defenses though, and it's not a quick process with either type.)

    Hm... also realized you said he doesn't judge people, but don't suffer fools gladly, indicating that he does indeed judge people, but pretends not to. Sounds like a typical INFJ. My intuition still tells me XNTP though. And no, I don't have any questions right now. I feel I know enough to jump to conclusions.
    Edits cheat... *mumbles*

    If you get inside the defenses of an INTJ or an INFJ, what is the differentiator to you, of the difference between the two?

    Perhaps the doesn't suffer fools gladly comes from a walls thing, vs a judgement thing. One protects something inside. The other is externally directed. Interesting point there though.

    Could you verbalise the Ne that is giving you xNTP?

    And jumping to conclusions is an INFP trait?

  2. #12
    a white iris elfinchilde's Avatar
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    carebear, not likely INFJ, because an INFJ in a debate will always get emotionally involved, and argue on and on and on, getting :steam: and :steam: -ier. FJs are flameballs by nature, not banked fire.
    You gave me hyacinths first a year ago;
    They called me the hyacinth girl.
    Yet when we came back, late, from the Hyacinth garden,
    Your arms full, and your hair wet, I could not
    Speak, and my eyes failed, I was neither
    Living nor dead, and I knew nothing,
    Looking into the heart of light, the silence.

    --T.S Eliot, The Wasteland

  3. #13
    a white iris elfinchilde's Avatar
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    INTJ/INFJ.

    the difference is the warmth. An INTJ's emotive connections are longer lasting than an INFJ, because to get into his/her inner circle, you'd have had to break past the shackles of control. ie, touch the blind side of F by slipping past T. That is also why it's very hard to break through an INTJ's confrol, vs an INFJ, who tends to let you in pretty fast. but because the Fe makes them aware of intentions, it is difficult to get close beyond a certain point.

    INFJs love deeply, but fleetingly. They can let go better than INTJs, when it comes to deep connections.

    (just my impression. caveat applies.)
    You gave me hyacinths first a year ago;
    They called me the hyacinth girl.
    Yet when we came back, late, from the Hyacinth garden,
    Your arms full, and your hair wet, I could not
    Speak, and my eyes failed, I was neither
    Living nor dead, and I knew nothing,
    Looking into the heart of light, the silence.

    --T.S Eliot, The Wasteland

  4. #14
    ~dangerous curves ahead~
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    nice discussion now

    Re: slipping into the skin.

    Fe comes across as a card of manipulation to many here. But it is also a card of attachment. Difficulty in letting go. I question that "INFJs love fleetingly". If you get past the Fe, you reach a Ti. A clear-eyed love, if you will.

    An INTJ: Te-Fi. A value-laden love. Does it exist because it fits with what they want. In which case, how clear-eyed is that? How easily can it be cut, if it no longer fits / the values change.

    Ne is the card of connections. Ni, of inner change.
    Si, of persistence in memory. Se, of sensations.

    Name the cards of the other 4.

    Does a Rational love without thinking it through? Thought and emotion cannot be divorced so cleanly. That which is called love, is not a single string, but a web of attachments. Feelings alone will not create a livable love? Thought alone will kill love?

    Which are the cards of attachment; which, of detachment?

  5. #15
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    You write extremely well, Aelan.

    If he is INTJ, I'd wager he's (for good or bad, I suppose) highly unlike most other INTJs on this board.

  6. #16
    a white iris elfinchilde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    nice discussion now
    come home and help the fry with his maths! i'm dying! maths ISN"T my strongest subject!

    oh, and i've downloaded ventrilo. if you're nice enough to me, i may let you use my laptop at times.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    Re: slipping into the skin.

    Fe comes across as a card of manipulation to many here. But it is also a card of attachment. Difficulty in letting go. I question that "INFJs love fleetingly". If you get past the Fe, you reach a Ti. A clear-eyed love, if you will.

    An INTJ: Te-Fi. A value-laden love. Does it exist because it fits with what they want. In which case, how clear-eyed is that?
    We need the INFJs to comment here. duckie???? Or kiddo. My intuition, actually, is because it is Fe and not Fi, the INFJ actually has an easier time letting go. Fe bends to others, isn't it?

    Am more familiar with INTJs really, of the two. Wouldn't a value laden love be held deeper than a rational laden one? ie, in the core. You should be looking at 4th function, not second.

    nono, sis. if an INTJ falls in love, they do so unwittingly, because the love has stolen past their Te barrier. ie, they will love in spite of themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    Ne is the card of connections. Ni, of inner change.
    Si, of persistence in memory. Se, of sensations.

    Name the cards of the other 4.
    Why does everything have to be cards to you.

    Te of exerted will, Ti of internal will.
    Fe of external attachment (to outsiders), Fi of internal attachment (to values within).


    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    Does a Rational love without thinking it through? Thought and emotion cannot be divorced so cleanly. That which is called love, is not a single string, but a web of attachments. Feelings alone will not create a livable love? Thought alone will kill love?

    Which are the cards of attachment; which, of detachment?
    Love is below the barrier of 20 hertz, for a rational. When struck (ie, beneath the secondary function), they would feel first, then struggle to rationalise it.

    A feeler would think first, then choose to feel.

    edit: if it's cards you're talking about, like with the Tarot, it's never the single card, it's the interpretation of them all, in their positions, that gives the full picture.
    You gave me hyacinths first a year ago;
    They called me the hyacinth girl.
    Yet when we came back, late, from the Hyacinth garden,
    Your arms full, and your hair wet, I could not
    Speak, and my eyes failed, I was neither
    Living nor dead, and I knew nothing,
    Looking into the heart of light, the silence.

    --T.S Eliot, The Wasteland

  7. #17
    Senior Member Dom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carebear View Post
    From your description he really seems like a perfect mix between INTP and ENTP. His results seem to confirm this. (About balanced Ti and Ne). In addition he's balanced Ne+Ti with Ni+Te, making him more rounded but more difficult to type.

    So XNTP is my guess, and if forced to lose the X, I'd say INTP.
    this would be my assestment too, having intp and entp best friends.

  8. #18
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Why on earth would you get him to do the cognitive functions test but not an actual MBTI test? Do you enjoy mystery? Were you trying to conceal your intense interest?

    How old is this guy? How well do you know him? Do you get any chances to watch him interacting with other people?

    To be honest, your description of him is just too vague and resembles just about any given smart, polite person on a good/bad day. More information needed!


    *considers*


    Is this some kind of test? Like a Forer thing or a Rorschach test? Let's take a closer look:

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    • He is very self-contained, does not show much impatience, nor emotion.
    • Me.

      Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    • He can appear cold, yet he cares deeply about things. But the revelation comes in a few words, or a sentence. Never excessive emotionalities. I think you'd never see him lose his temper.
    That sounds like me too, even with people I know moderately well.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  9. A gentleman of the old school, in all senses of the word. Always courteous to ladies, never going into ugly fights/behaviours. Seems to understand boundaries and rules innately.
That's so me. What do you mean by understanding rules innately, though? Social rules? If so, that's me too.

Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • A master wordsmith. Extremely well-read, can hold his own on any debate on personality, philosophy, religion, politics and sociology.
  • Totally me.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • An observer of human nature, but he does not judge them. Seems to enjoy poking them for reactions, though uncomfortable being poked himself.
  • Me also.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • A quiet sense of humour and a sense of fun that can be sparked, but the play seems to come as a response vs an initiative, but it could be because I'm not in his inner circle.
  • Me.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • If irritated/frustrated, it shows via class sarcasm, for want of a better word. Does not suffer fools gladly, simply ignores most or take veiled stabs at them. But always with a smile.
  • "With a smile"? That's the key phrase, showing that it's all me.

    "Class sarcasm"? Sarcasm related to a particular socio-economic class, or schoolboy sarcasm? Or did you mean "classy sarcasm"? If you did, that's clearly me.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • Has a presence that fills a room. Interaction with him feels like circling a banked fire. Something is simmering inside, but you do not really know what.
  • Well, that's really just a verbose and coy way of saying you think he's hot. Not a lot to do with type there.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • And yes, he is good-looking, dresses well, takes care of his body and makes me feel, exquisitely female.
  • I'd say the bulk of healthy, goodlooking people dress pretty well and take care of their bodies. Because it's so much more rewarding that it is for non-goodlooking people to do the same. Plus, goodlooking people as a rule tend to have more vanity than non-goodlooking people. So this part really just says that he's good-looking and knows it. Making you "feel, exquisitely female" is probably just a result of being goodlooking.

    This part isn't me much, but it was definitely me when I was in my veryearly-twenties and thought I might still turn out goodlooking if I tried harder.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
  • I'm never able to rid myself of the feeling that he sees me as an amusing little chit. Like a birdie he'd let sit on his finger on a sunlit day, just to see if I'd fly or stay.
  • Definitely me.
    Reply With Quote Reply With Quote Do him, would you? Send PM  

  • #19
    will make your day Carebear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elfinchilde View Post
    carebear, not likely INFJ, because an INFJ in a debate will always get emotionally involved, and argue on and on and on, getting :steam: and :steam: -ier. FJs are flameballs by nature, not banked fire.
    No. Maybe many INFJs will, but I've met several INFJ guys who won't, at least until you're far far inside their defenses. I still don't think he's INFJ, but the picture drawn fits my experience with male INFJs much better than my experience with male INTJs.

    Quote Originally Posted by aelan View Post
    Edits cheat... *mumbles*

    If you get inside the defenses of an INTJ or an INFJ, what is the differentiator to you, of the difference between the two?
    The main difference is that then you see that one is T and one is F. Many INFJ guys don't show much of the F before you get beneath their skin, so they end up looking like Ts.

    Ever heard of the warm and fuzzy theory (probably called something completely different really):

    INTJs are cold on the outside, cold on the inside.
    INTPs are warm and fuzzy on the outside, but cold as rocks on the inside.
    INFJs are cold as rocks on the outside, but warm and fuzzy on the inside.
    INFPs are warm and fuzzy inside and out.


    Perhaps the doesn't suffer fools gladly comes from a walls thing, vs a judgement thing. One protects something inside. The other is externally directed. Interesting point there though.
    Hm. Could be. Good distinction.

    Could you verbalise the Ne that is giving you xNTP?
    No. It just fits patterns I've observed in a lot of INTPs and ENTPs, and if you combine the two types I see nothing that I can't see neither an INTP nor an ENTP potentially doing.

    Some of the things you mentioned that are typical of the INTPs and ENTPs I know:
    # A master wordsmith. Extremely well-read, can hold his own on any debate on personality, philosophy, religion, politics and sociology.(ENTP and INTP)
    # An observer of human nature, but he does not judge them. Seems to enjoy poking them for reactions, (ENTP and INTP) though uncomfortable being poked himself. ( INTP)
    # A quiet sense of humour and a sense of fun that can be sparked, but the play seems to come as a response vs an initiative, but it could be because I'm not in his inner circle. (INTP)
    # If irritated/frustrated, it shows via class sarcasm, for want of a better word. Does not suffer fools gladly, simply ignores most or take veiled stabs at them. But always with a smile.(INTP and some ENTPs)
    And jumping to conclusions is an INFP trait?
    Absolutely. Or rather... jumping to hypotheses and testing them. But it will look like jumping to conclusions for others.

    As for the edit being unfair: I did it right after posting before there were any replies, so if you hadn't been so eager on stalking your own threads and wearing out your F5, it would all have been good.
    I have arms for a fucking reaosn, so come hold me. Then we'll fuvk! Whoooooh! - GZA

  • #20
    Wild Card Atomic Fiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elfinchilde View Post
    carebear, not likely INFJ, because an INFJ in a debate will always get emotionally involved, and argue on and on and on, getting :steam: and :steam: -ier. FJs are flameballs by nature, not banked fire.
    Actually that depends on the debate, if it were something personal, then yes we would lose our cool, because we'd feel you were talking about something that had nothing to do with you, but we aren't so touchy that we'd just snap over a debate about politics or something petty like that, in fact that isn't the sign of an F at all. That is just a sign of emotional immaturity. I'd like to believe that someone with Dominant or Auxillary feeling, would know how to control it after using it for all of there waking life. NFJs understand that debates aren't anything personal, just a way that some prefer to gain understanding, though many may still attempt to avoid them, as it's just not the way we gain understanding, often times we already know what we believe, or at least have a good idea.

    Also, I think your guy is INFJ also, a very mature one too. INFJs can give the illusion of being more mature then they actually are, until you get them to open there mouth and they say something completly off the wall. It's a good measure, not if they say something off the wall, because I assure you they probably will, but what they say.

    Basically what I'm trying to say is aelen, to take that horse to a quiet field and ride him.

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