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  1. #41
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Do you think so? If you dont mind me asking, could you elaborate?

    Incidentally my criticism of David Keirsey far pre-dates the idea of me being an ISFJ.
    Well, I knew that you were an Fe user and after that it was just a matter of finding out whether you used Si or Ni. Type yourself based on cognitive functions not on Kiersey: Kiersey temperaments suck.

  2. #42
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    op: you started out with an apology. that probably rules out INTJ.

    you ooze Fe, in a way that reminds me of INFjs.

    "friends and family come and go but i exist." <- i find that quite beautiful but do you?
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


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  3. #43
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by agentfurrina View Post
    op: you started out with an apology. that probably rules out INTJ.

    you ooze Fe, in a way that reminds me of INFjs.

    "friends and family come and go but i exist." <- i find that quite beautiful but do you?
    I dont know really, I just thought it was the best way to describe how I felt at the time. I felt it was my fault for not following people up more or holding on to relationships for longer. It sounds poetic but it's really just a description of something very literal in my mind.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Well, I knew that you were an Fe user and after that it was just a matter of finding out whether you used Si or Ni. Type yourself based on cognitive functions not on Kiersey: Kiersey temperaments suck.
    Agreed, they do indeed suck.
    Last edited by Cellmold; 05-16-2012 at 03:18 AM.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  4. #44
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    You know ive realised that in reality I have no idea any more, the more information I receive the more convoluted my thought processes become. Complexity into obscurity with no practical use. The multitudinousness of my ideas is actually headache inducing, ive realised that many people with a seemingly concrete grasp of this theory and it's interpretations often dont question it the way I do and do not consider the variables the way I feel compelled to do, arrogant as that sounds it isn't intented that way.

    My understanding of his work and this theory is based almost entirely on a series of eureka moments built upon accumulated information, that comes like a match flare in the dark but which then soon fades away, leaving a bare imprint, but taking everything of use.

    The problem is I want set answers and I wont get them from a heuristic model which acknowledges the fluidity of people. To this end im not sure if MBTI or JCF were ever of serious use to me, I was never unhappy before, merely curious and my curiousity grabbed me and pulled me down the rabbit hole. But the rabbit hole is confusing and just when you think you have caught up with the rabbit, away he speeds again down some new avenue of understanding. I think it is a sobering fact that I am just limited in my intelligence and imagination and there is nothing I can do about that but accept it.

    Connecting patterns in a useful manner is not my talent, I can only correlate with baseless stereotypes. People have always been too variable, too....specific for me. And this is a mode of thinking ive had since being a child, there is no indoctrination or internal war of projected self-doubt, this is just the way ive always seen things and to not do so is to not be myself.

    But this very mode of cognition is also anathema to a theory such as this and all it's interpretations. Catagorisation is not wrong, nor has it ever been, but if there is to be a catagorisation then it has to be absolutist in my mind. This is a product of black and white thinking in myself that may never be undone, seeing as how it wasn't 'done' in the first place.

    Afterall, how does a person go against the true, unadulterated, nature of their personality?
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  5. #45

  6. #46
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Heh, the only problem with descriptions is they can get filtered down to vague traits that anyone could possess, like "INTJ's are stubborn and rude arseholes who want to rule the world, or think they can" or "ESFP's are airheaded party animals who have no concept of introspection or deep evaluation".
    Straw dog. Try evaluating a real type description instead of one you made up that circularly verifies your belief. I guess what you said above about your adherence to facts being subjective is true. Except that one was objective, so actually you have control over your subjectivity.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  7. #47
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    Straw dog. Try evaluating a real type description instead of one you made up that circularly verifies your belief. I guess what you said above about your adherence to facts being subjective is true. Except that one was objective, so actually you have control over your subjectivity.
    Whose argument was I pre-supposing here?

    I said others filter the descriptions down not that the descriptions themselves will always result in that hence the word CAN. It's a weakness in the way many descriptions are put across.

    If you want evidence I can spend hours upon hours going over forums to gather information. The way in which people's biases and perceptions are formulated etc...
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  8. #48
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Whose argument was a pre-supposing here?
    It's circular to declare that type descriptions are all bad, and then create one that contains the word "arsehole" among other oddities that seem very, very out of place for a type description.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  9. #49
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    It's circular to declare that type descriptions are all bad, and then create one that contains the word "arsehole" among other oddities that seem very, very out of place for a type description.
    Where did I say they were all bad? I said it was a problem, a fault. You are assuming a great deal here.

    Those 'ones I created' as you put it are merely stereotypes put forth by people, who often cite type descriptions as their source of information. At most it was a simplistic and exaggerated summing up.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  10. #50
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Where did I say they were all bad? I said it was a problem, a fault. You are assuming a great deal here.

    Those 'ones I created' as you put it are merely stereotypes put forth by people, who often cite type descriptions as their source of information. At most it was a simplistic and exaggerated summing up.
    "the only problem with descriptions is they can get filtered down to vague traits that anyone could possess."

    Your original description of the problem was also vague compared to your new one.

    Besides, Jung provided type descriptions which can suffer the same filtered-down fate.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

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