Type my (possible, maybe) boyfriend

[Mal12345]

I think that's a bit of a generalised and stereotypical observation.

I said "tend to," so I deleted the rest of your response just because I wanted to make that point clear.

 

[Cellmold]

I said "tend to," so I deleted the rest of your response just because I wanted to make that point clear.

Well in that case I believe I ought to have my made my point clearer, it is the terminology you used that is a problem. No matter how you wish to spin it, shun, as a word has negative connotations. It implied that....to put it simply, introverts dont like other people and that their greater need for alone time stems from this. Some may not do of course, but there are plenty of sociopathic, anti-social extroverts although they of course are not the majority, in any case it is poor choice of word.

If you had simply said 'introverts tend to prefer more alone time' it would have been more apt.

I expect that this will not be satisfying as a reason since you might see your stance as technically correct since the word tend opts out of certainty, however it is a quantifier of regularity in that it implies that what is contained within the sentence happens more often than not, which cannot be known for certain.

 

[Mal12345]

Well in that case I believe I ought to have my made my point clearer, it is the terminology you used that is a problem. No matter how you wish to spin it, shun, as a word has negative connotations. It implied that....to put it simply, introverts dont like other people and that their greater need for alone time stems from this. Some may not do of course, but there are plenty of sociopathic, anti-social extroverts although they of course are not the majority, in any case it is poor choice of word.

If you had simply said 'introverts tend to prefer more alone time' it would have been more apt.

I expect that this will not be satisfying as a reason since you might see your stance as technically correct since the word tend opts out of certainty, however it is a quantifier of regularity in that it implies that what is contained within the sentence happens more often than not, which cannot be known for certain.

I did not know I was back in college here.

 

[Cellmold]

I did not know I was back in college here.

Ahah I am lecturing like a fool arent I? Isn't normal for me, but it was something I had strong values for.

 

[Mal12345]

Ahah I am lecturing like a fool arent I? Isn't normal for me, but it was something I had strong values for.

So that explains it. Actually, I already know about the whole pc witch-hunt. I would have put the critique concerning "shun" differently because I don't treat others like some kind of "witches," even if they really are. For one thing, I would never define introversion as a type of social shunning or avoidance, that's for the severe types. For another thing, I am an introvert and I have in the past shunned social company. Nowadays the case is that I simply don't prefer it because it takes too much energy.

 

[Mal12345]

I guess everybody's just out to get someone these days, even as the Randroids go hunting Kantians. The reason they will always fail is that Randroids don't understand Kant, pc types don't understand racism or stereotyping. Every failure that I can think of, for example, the US in Vietnam during the 1960s, was due to simplistic demonizing based out of a lack of understanding.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

I guess everybody's just out to get someone these days, even as the Randroids go hunting Kantians. The reason they will always fail is that Randroids don't understand Kant, pc types don't understand racism or stereotyping. Every failure that I can think of, for example, the US in Vietnam during the 1960s, was due to simplistic demonizing based out of a lack of understanding.

Or lack of empathy and compassion.

Our lack of love.

 

[Cellmold]

So that explains it. Actually, I already know about the whole pc witch-hunt. I would have put the critique concerning "shun" differently because I don't treat others like some kind of "witches," even if they really are. For one thing, I would never define introversion as a type of social shunning or avoidance, that's for the severe types. For another thing, I am an introvert and I have in the past shunned social company. Nowadays the case is that I simply don't prefer it because it takes too much energy.

What do you mean by pc witch hunt?

This is personal to me...not an indoctrination of some mass created crowd system we should all adhere to. As for shun...why would you have critiqued it differently.....that's what it means...to avoid others that you dislike. In that sentence it is an implication that most introverts would avoid people out of dislike.

I guess everybody's just out to get someone these days, even as the Randroids go hunting Kantians. The reason they will always fail is that Randroids don't understand Kant, pc types don't understand racism or stereotyping. Every failure that I can think of, for example, the US in Vietnam during the 1960s, was due to simplistic demonizing based out of a lack of understanding.

Well I wasn't trying to demonise you...merely get you to consider what you had said. This is all about perspectives isn't it?

People often misuse the term PC these days far too much. My personal values are based upon both an experience and prediction of what leads to what.

A lot of people do adhere to PC reasoning without any understanding of what is governed by it as you said. Lots of people understand racism as being wrong....but they dont understand why it might be wrong...or what thoughts lead to such an idea in the first place. I suppose we could each write an essay upon the complexities of this, but please dont misjudge me for some shortsighted thug trying to push an agenda that is not his own.

Normally I avoid shoulds and oughts for this reason....in this case I overstepped my own boundries.

 

[Mal12345]

What do you mean by pc witch hunt?

This is personal to me...not an indoctrination of some mass created crowd system we should all adhere to. As for shun...why would you have critiqued it differently.....that's what it means...to avoid others that you dislike. In that sentence it is an implication that most introverts would avoid people out of dislike.

There's the better critique I was looking for. Do most (>50%) introverts do this avoidance out of dislike? Or is it maybe 49%? We don't really know. Avoidance may be a shunning or it may be a matter of preference (due to being shy). But if her boyfriend likes to go to parties, then he's obviously neither shunning nor shying away, and I would say he's an extravert. The better question is whether or not these events energize him or sap his strength like they do me.

Well I wasn't trying to demonise you...merely get you to consider what you had said. This is all about perspectives isn't it?

I don't buy into your implication that word choice means something sinister. I do enough self-editing as it is here to avoid the common attacks I've seen on forums. Not that you've been attacking me.

People often misuse the term PC these days far too much. My personal values are based upon both an experience and prediction of what leads to what.

I'd say you're an Fi-dom or -aux based on that. If you are a 6w7 as it says in your bio, I would highly recommend considering ENFP as your MBTI type, although INFP is possible too. ENFP seems to be the hardest self-type to make. It also goes along well with your fear of judging others implied in the critique of stereotyping.

A lot of people do adhere to PC reasoning without any understanding of what is governed by it as you said. Lots of people understand racism as being wrong....but they dont understand why it might be wrong...or what thoughts lead to such an idea in the first place. I suppose we could each write an essay upon the complexities of this, but please dont misjudge me for some shortsighted thug trying to push an agenda that is not his own.

Normally I avoid shoulds and oughts for this reason....in this case I overstepped my own boundries.

There's ENFP again.

I can see a definite generational gap in the language we respectively use. I was not trained to use PC lingo, that was after my time.

 

[Mitsuko Souma]

This is very interesting - i was also quite sure i sometimes notice introverted feeler in him
but i noticed Fe as the most expressed cuz of hundred sentences he said that were exactly Fe
example: what is right for the other person, i wanna make them happy, all it matters is that you are happy i came here, there is nothing better to me then make other people happy and comfortable around me, im a giver...many many Fe sentences out of his mouth - very expressed Fe but seems as Fi often, but it's mostly when i put attention on that aspect in him cuz im Fi dominant (i mean on the effect)

he is an N person cuz he looks meaning of the songs, looking in different things symbols of his own inner state - like for example posting lyrics which exactly refer to some kind of state of mind of his or situation, he is very good at picking up meanings - for me he is clear Ni user

Alright, then my guess is ENFJ. ENFJs though do tend to have an "introvert" side if you will. The Ni being their secondary function kinda gives them that type of feeling, especially if its well developed. You should let him take the MBTI test or the cognitive functions test to be sure though. Best of luck.

 

[Cellmold]

I'd say you're an Fi-dom or -aux based on that. If you are a 6w7 as it says in your bio, I would highly recommend considering ENFP as your MBTI type, although INFP is possible too. ENFP seems to be the hardest self-type to make. It also goes along well with your fear of judging others implied in the critique of stereotyping.

I have no fear of judging others, I do it all the time as all people do.

There's ENFP again.

I can see a definite generational gap in the language we respectively use. I was not trained to use PC lingo, that was after my time.

.......Yeah I can see we arent on the same page, I was not trained to use 'PC' lingo. What generational gap do you see?

All I see is me using language to precisely put across what I want to convey. I see no difference in the language I use to yours. It almost sounds as if you wish to justify ignoring variables and cognitive bias's by claiming that anyone who tries to put forth an opinion against generalising or stereotyping is part of an indoctrinated political correctness mindset. Although it could just be that you are tired of the 'calling out' of stereotyping that goes on so often, which I can understand. Not all generalising is bad, afterall, the human mind needs catagorisation in order to make the world easier to understand. But it is important to recognise what it is that you are generalising, if anything it's more about precision than being polite or nice. Some things generalised are of no consequence....some are.


Shall I simplify what I said before? Lots of people go along with being politically correct, they argue and fight with passion for any little thing which they see as 'injustice' or what they have been taught is injustice, but going back with what I said above, there is a time and a place. I see and hear casual prejudice all the time in my own town....do I get on a high horse about it? Do I go around trying to force people to my mindset? No I dont. In fact I dont even dislike those people, why should I? Just because they project a bit of prejudice? Is it about someone being black or indian or chinese etc..? Or women or men? Or being gay or bisexual? But the thing is they are not bad people and I recognise that most of them wouldn't act on their opinions anyhow.

I dont have to like those opinions, but it isn't my job to go around telling others how to think, like an opinion police force. I did sound like that to you because I didn't choose my words correctly, I normally would have advised not told.

My aversion to generalising is my own, no one elses, my parents did not bring me up to recnognise it, the kids I grew up with definitely did not share my same mindset and teachers and other adults were of no consequence.

This is something I came to from an observation of others, how people will hide behind anything that is an all covering blanket term and simplification of something that is not in the least bit simple. It's the sign of a lazy mind and people who are 'PC' are just as guilty as those who are not.

I suspect I just see things in an unnecessarily complex way, but then again that in itself is subjective, you might see it as such but I might not and another person might perceive things differently again.

Ah well sorry for what probably looked like an outburst. I should have simply said: I see introversion as more complex than that because different introverted types can display extroversion and be quite outgoing depending upon what functions they possess.

 

[Presumptuous Pepper]

Alright, then my guess is ENFJ. ENFJs though do tend to have an "introvert" side if you will. The Ni being their secondary function kinda gives them that type of feeling, especially if its well developed. You should let him take the MBTI test or the cognitive functions test to be sure though. Best of luck.

I did that...he was once ENFJ and once he was an INFJ...then i aksed him what is his personal opinion which type is he....and he said - i think i am an ENFJ but im trying to be an introvert aka INFJ...but i think im an extrovert and ENFJ

 

[Mitsuko Souma]

I did that...he was once ENFJ and once he was an INFJ...then i aksed him what is his personal opinion which type is he....and he said - i think i am an ENFJ but im trying to be an introvert aka INFJ...but i think im an extrovert and ENFJ

Sounds like the most likeliest one for now. Have fun with your "soon to be boyfriend."

 

[Presumptuous Pepper]

Sounds like the most likeliest one for now. Have fun with your "soon to be boyfriend."

he is a boyfriend now...we were going out only when i posted the thread - we are together now *romantic mood*

 

[Mal12345]

I have no fear of judging others, I do it all the time as all people do.

I'm too tired to correct the inconsistencies in your statements.

.......Yeah I can see we arent on the same page, I was not trained to use 'PC' lingo. What generational gap do you see?

It might not be literal training. PC lingo is embedded in our language even though it hasn't done a thing to cure racism or stereotyping. It's like the DARE program, which is attractive only to the kids who would never use drugs anyway.
http://www.dare.com/home/default.asp

All I see is me using language to precisely put across what I want to convey. I see no difference in the language I use to yours. It almost sounds as if you wish to justify ignoring variables and cognitive bias's by claiming that anyone who tries to put forth an opinion against generalising or stereotyping is part of an indoctrinated political correctness mindset. Although it could just be that you are tired of the 'calling out' of stereotyping that goes on so often, which I can understand. Not all generalising is bad, afterall, the human mind needs catagorisation in order to make the world easier to understand. But it is important to recognise what it is that you are generalising, if anything it's more about precision than being polite or nice. Some things generalised are of no consequence....some are.

It's more of a cultural indoctrination, but it's stronger in college. In my mind I am constantly recalling a friend of mine after he graduated from grad school. He kept correcting every god damn thing I was saying... But it wasn't factual-based correcting, it was values-based correcting. Things he, as an INFP, felt strongly about, to use your own terms. But when values are confused with facts, it's called DOGMA.

Shall I simplify what I said before? Lots of people go along with being politically correct, they argue and fight with passion for any little thing which they see as 'injustice' or what they have been taught is injustice, but going back with what I said above, there is a time and a place. I see and hear casual prejudice all the time in my own town....do I get on a high horse about it? Do I go around trying to force people to my mindset? No I dont. In fact I dont even dislike those people, why should I? Just because they project a bit of prejudice? Is it about someone being black or indian or chinese etc..? Or women or men? Or being gay or bisexual? But the thing is they are not bad people and I recognise that most of them wouldn't act on their opinions anyhow.

I dont have to like those opinions, but it isn't my job to go around telling others how to think, like an opinion police force. I did sound like that to you because I didn't choose my words correctly, I normally would have advised not told.

My aversion to generalising is my own, no one elses, my parents did not bring me up to recnognise it, the kids I grew up with definitely did not share my same mindset and teachers and other adults were of no consequence.

This is something I came to from an observation of others, how people will hide behind anything that is an all covering blanket term and simplification of something that is not in the least bit simple. It's the sign of a lazy mind and people who are 'PC' are just as guilty as those who are not.

I suspect I just see things in an unnecessarily complex way, but then again that in itself is subjective, you might see it as such but I might not and another person might perceive things differently again.

Ah well sorry for what probably looked like an outburst. I should have simply said: I see introversion as more complex than that because different introverted types can display extroversion and be quite outgoing depending upon what functions they possess.

A PC person is one type of Nazi, a racist is another type of Nazi. The PC crowd uses certain non-violent social tactics employed by Nazis and communists. Professionals of various kinds not only have to do the jobs they trained for, they also have to act as narcs sniffing out signs of evil in the world around them. Not that they seem to mind. But it's just not the kind of world I was raised in. Those who were born into that kind of world are just used to the way things are. At least racism was out in the open, now it has been driven underground where is continues to thrive, and always will. And it has transferred to the non-white communities where, by some twist of logic, it's not considered racism because only white people can be racists.

There is a cure for this situation in the not-so-distant future. By the year 2030 the Earth will have reached its limit of sustainability. So by that time, childish social causes will be the least of our worries.

 

[Cellmold]

I'm too tired to correct the inconsistencies in your statements.

Think of it in terms of subjective subtleties rather than inconsistencies. I see most things on a relative level. Everyone is judging everyone else, it's automatic, how a person walks, their language body and verbal, what they say, how they say it, even the abstraction of their ideas is being evaluated by others.....etc..etc...

Only the most naive of people will deny judgement in themselves towards others. I shouldn't have used the words stereotype or generalise in this thread, I merely want people to be more complex in their outlook of things and stop buying into a cognitive bias of convenience because it takes too much effort for them to try and look at all the variables or implications.

Judging others is not a negative unless you run with it in a negative way, then it becomes judgemental. I recognise myself being a part of this even as I talk about it.

It might not be literal training. PC lingo is embedded in our language even though it hasn't done a thing to cure racism or stereotyping. It's like the DARE program, which is attractive only to the kids who would never use drugs anyway.
http://www.dare.com/home/default.asp

Actually what I said doesn't have to be literal, I was referencing influences from a person's environment. But I agree about the DARE program, that's actually a perfect comparison.

It's more of a cultural indoctrination, but it's stronger in college. In my mind I am constantly recalling a friend of mine after he graduated from grad school. He kept correcting every god damn thing I was saying... But it wasn't factual-based correcting, it was values-based correcting. Things he, as an INFP, felt strongly about, to use your own terms. But when values are confused with facts, it's called DOGMA.

Quite true. However I was never refuting this. Cultural indoctrination was actually what I was talking about as well. Is it impossible for me to have developed an individual view of my own? Does everything I do have to be a product of a cultural indoctrination?

Environment has it's influences of course, but a person can also evaluate those own influences if they are introspective enough to do so.

A PC person is one type of Nazi, a racist is another type of Nazi. The PC crowd uses certain non-violent social tactics employed by Nazis and communists. Professionals of various kinds not only have to do the jobs they trained for, they also have to act as narcs sniffing out signs of evil in the world around them. Not that they seem to mind. But it's just not the kind of world I was raised in. Those who were born into that kind of world are just used to the way things are. At least racism was out in the open, now it has been driven underground where is continues to thrive, and always will. And it has transferred to the non-white communities where, by some twist of logic, it's not considered racism because only white people can be racists.

Basically what I was alluding to.

There is a cure for this situation in the not-so-distant future. By the year 2030 the Earth will have reached its limit of sustainability. So by that time, childish social causes will be the least of our worries.

Hah cant deny that. People are repetitive....things go round and round and no one really learns anything.

The biggest problem with anything idealistic is that it starts at a single point filtered down from many different points...then it snowballs and gains traction, soon others are adhereing to that idealism but the more who do, the less it means as it is diluted beyond all recognition. The original meaning is lost, bowled over by rumour and misguided nonsense. Eventually we end up with some simplistic gibberish that lots of people live their lives by, but it is a ghost...a pale shadow, nothing but a big sheet with which to cover all reason.

Incidentally on the subject of my type, I dont put it on my profile out of a combination of laziness and the fact that too many people have a limited understanding of this theory and so see a person's types and functions as a reflection of that person individually.

Id rather have people simply read what im saying rather than read it through a filter of misappropriated jargon that they believe the cognitive functions are.

 

[Presumptuous Pepper]

But if her boyfriend likes to go to parties, then he's obviously neither shunning nor shying away, and I would say he's an extravert. The better question is whether or not these events energize him or sap his strength like they do me.

Here is what i think about it - when he is home alone i can see low energy - when he is hanging out - i can see high energy! So yeah i do think he is Fe dom with strong Ni as aux.
And without seeing where he gets his energy - his Fe is pretty much very dominant so it is also noticable there.
I know i asked the question and now i am acting like im sure, but i work through the problems usually, think about it alone myself and so i get my responses in my head. i got the the feeling he is an extrovert

Also about the whole introversion and extroversion thig. I don't think we are duscussing here smth really - cuz just because he said "to shun social interactions" - i don't think it's very impossible for I person to do so. I think you both think the same and are sharing an information which is well known. Personally both parts here are right. To shun social interaction is really a consequence of low energy.
I also personally think that one person knows is he or she an I or E...and when smth is wrong with their type i think one person know he or she is mistyped. I don't personally think Is don't wanna hang out, i just think that they come in a position when they really need time alone, and god , they can't help themselves. And yes it requires an energy and i know myself i sometimes just can't be present in the conversation cuz i don't have that kind of an energy myself. I feel beaten up to be honest.

Also AffirmitiveAnxiety is Fi aux or dom but ESFP also has aux. Fi. If we are gonna discuss her type then we shoudl discuss is she an Se or Ne, Si or Ni.
Fi is certain really and therefore Te.

 

[Mal12345]

But introverts tend to shun social contact. I say ENFJ.

For the person who repped me, I've already been taken to task over the word "shun." It was an exaggeration. Many introverts desire social contact at intervals, others may shun it entirely. And others may take an attitude of quiet indifference to it.

 

[Mal12345]

Here is what i think about it - when he is home alone i can see low energy - when he is hanging out - i can see high energy! So yeah i do think he is Fe dom with strong Ni as aux.
And without seeing where he gets his energy - his Fe is pretty much very dominant so it is also noticable there.
I know i asked the question and now i am acting like im sure, but i work through the problems usually, think about it alone myself and so i get my responses in my head. i got the the feeling he is an extrovert

Also about the whole introversion and extroversion thig. I don't think we are duscussing here smth really - cuz just because he said "to shun social interactions" - i don't think it's very impossible for I person to do so. I think you both think the same and are sharing an information which is well known. Personally both parts here are right. To shun social interaction is really a consequence of low energy.
I also personally think that one person knows is he or she an I or E...and when smth is wrong with their type i think one person know he or she is mistyped. I don't personally think Is don't wanna hang out, i just think that they come in a position when they really need time alone, and god , they can't help themselves. And yes it requires an energy and i know myself i sometimes just can't be present in the conversation cuz i don't have that kind of an energy myself. I feel beaten up to be honest.

Also AffirmitiveAnxiety is Fi aux or dom but ESFP also has aux. Fi. If we are gonna discuss her type then we shoudl discuss is she an Se or Ne, Si or Ni.
Fi is certain really and therefore Te.

The whole I/E question can be a difficult call to make because introverts can employ a kind of 'practiced' extraversion when the situation requires it.

 

[Cellmold]

For the person who repped me, I've already been taken to task over the word "shun." It was an exaggeration. Many introverts desire social contact at intervals, others may shun it entirely. And others may take an attitude of quiet indifference to it.

lol Yah, I should have just said I saw it as more complex than that and left the words generalise and stereotype in the gutter where they belong. Sorry about that.

ps: The usage of the term 'personal values' was a bit of a red herring. I just thought it would accompany the apology as a decent reason.