Type 6 or 9?

[Hazashin]

Alright, so I'm having doubts about my Enneatype again. It has been brought to my attention by [MENTION=5356]Speed Gavroche[/MENTION] that I do not express/act like a typical 6. I am more easy-going, low-key, and accepting than most 6s, and I seem to have an agreeable quality to me. I also dislike upsetting people (though not because I fear conflict but because I just care about my friends and people too much for them to get hurt) and I am often compliant.

On the flip side, I fear being without support or guidance, I am very loyal (especially with those who gain my trust), I am sometimes dependent, I am constantly doubting myself, I am afraid of taking action in problematic situations because of potential negative consequences, I worry a LOT, and I am sometimes a very conflicting person.

To help out, I have copied (and modified) here a list of qualities of myself that I had used in a previous thread of mine.

- Often dependent and inefficient with original thought, but VERY opinionated (an awful paradox of mine) and not group-oriented
- Often obsessive, but sometimes flighty and scatter-brained
- Passionate with things I care about, but unenthusiastic about most things
- Very loyal, especially with close friends and friends
- Lazy and undutiful with things I find unnecessary, but loyal and responsible with things I find necessary.
- Sometimes uncreative and unoriginal, but inquisitive and curious
- Almost completely deliberating -- too much so to the point of almost paralyzed indecisiveness
- Temperamental and emotional, but reserved most of time
- Very sensitive, but not defensive more often than not
- Mostly low-key, but periodically energetic
- Focused a lot on others, but sometimes too detached to have motivation to help them or simply cannot figure out ways to help them, whatever the situation may be
- Cooperative and compliant more often than not, but have my own values that I strongly stick to and do not conform
- Extremely guilty-conscious, but not necessarily 'responsible-feeling'
- Liking and loving of people, but not drawn to them for the most part
- Not very disciplined, but considerably determined and perseverant
- Persistent, but mostly passive due to wanting to take the best course of action as to avoid negative consequences
- Usually non-proactive, but not necessarily reactive
- Pacifistic and non-confrontational, but argumentative
- Detailed, meticulous, and perfectionistic of own work, but very accepting and understanding of others to the point of feeling like everybody should be pardoned for their faults
- Wishing well of others, but often self-pitying
- Very competitive, but always feeling bad for winning
- Rule-abiding, but usually not rule-agreeing
- Treating everyone as equals, but regularly feeling inferior
- Unsociable, but friendly and warm with everyone who engages (though most of the time I'm very awkward) (also correlates with the Supine temperament)
- Sometimes very longing (but most of the time not), but feel guilty of it and do not ask others to get me whatever it is (if it is something that can be given) more often than not
- Considerably cautious and tentative, but sometimes unaware
- Mostly responsible, though sometimes forgetful
- Uncaring of success in the big sense in the word, as in fame and prestige, but very afraid of failing in individual things (e.g. "I must not lose this game," "I must not do this incorrectly," etc.), especially letting people I care about most down
- Mostly see good in everyone in the big sense of the word, but sometimes doubtful of them and their abilities if not proven so
- Almost entirely modest, though I do like compliments and being loved very much
- Emotionally expressive for the most part in private and people I'm close to (though sometimes emotionally void for some reason), but much more reserved in public as to not embarrass myself
- Very shy and timid, but open up rather easily and become interested to those who approach me (95% of my friends approached me first)
- Anxious and nervous quite frequently, but more calm and easy-going when not
- Somewhat idealistic, but not visionary and ambitious about it that much at all
- Very intimate and affectionate with those I'm close to, but only if they are comfortable with it
* EXTREMELY self-critical, self-conscious, insecure, and shameful

 

[Silveresque]

- Often dependent and inefficient with original thought, but VERY opinionated (an awful paradox of mine) and not group-oriented leaning toward 6
- Often obsessive, but sometimes flighty and scatter-brained
- Passionate with things I care about, but unenthusiastic about most things
- Very loyal, especially with close friends and friends
- Lazy and undutiful with things I find unnecessary, but loyal and responsible with things I find necessary.
- Sometimes uncreative and unoriginal, but inquisitive and curious
- Almost completely deliberating -- too much so to the point of almost paralyzed indecisiveness leaning slightly toward 6
- Temperamental and emotional, but reserved most of time
- Very sensitive, but not defensive more often than not leaning toward 9
- Mostly low-key, but periodically energetic
- Focused a lot on others, but sometimes too detached to have motivation to help them or simply cannot figure out ways to help them, whatever the situation may be
- Cooperative and compliant more often than not, but have my own values that I strongly stick to and do not conform
- Extremely guilty-conscious, but not necessarily 'responsible-feeling'
- Liking and loving of people, but not drawn to them for the most part (possibly) 9
- Not very disciplined, but considerably determined and perseverant
- Persistent, but mostly passive due to wanting to take the best course of action as to avoid negative consequences
- Usually non-proactive, but not necessarily reactive
- Pacifistic and non-confrontational, but argumentative
- Detailed, meticulous, and perfectionistic of own work, but very accepting and understanding of others to the point of feeling like everybody should be pardoned for their faults strongly 9w1
- Wishing well of others, but often self-pitying Nine
- Very competitive, but always feeling bad for winning
- Rule-abiding, but usually not rule-agreeing leaning slightly toward 6
- Treating everyone as equals, but regularly feeling inferior
- Unsociable, but friendly and warm with everyone who engages (though most of the time I'm very awkward) (also correlates with the Supine temperament) possibly 9
- Sometimes very longing (but most of the time not), but feel guilty of it and do not ask others to get me whatever it is (if it is something that can be given) more often than not very nineish
- Considerably cautious and tentative, but sometimes unaware
- Mostly responsible, though sometimes forgetful
- Uncaring of success in the big sense in the word, as in fame and prestige, but very afraid of failing in individual things (e.g. "I must not lose this game," "I must not do this incorrectly," etc.), especially letting people I care about most down
- Mostly see good in everyone in the big sense of the word, but sometimes doubtful of them and their abilities if not proven so
- Almost entirely modest, though I do like compliments and being loved very much
- Emotionally expressive for the most part in private and people I'm close to (though sometimes emotionally void for some reason), but much more reserved in public as to not embarrass myself
- Very shy and timid, but open up rather easily and become interested to those who approach me (95% of my friends approached me first) sp/sx, maybe?
- Anxious and nervous quite frequently, but more calm and easy-going when not
- Somewhat idealistic, but not visionary and ambitious about it that much at all
- Very intimate and affectionate with those I'm close to, but only if they are comfortable with it
* EXTREMELY self-critical, self-conscious, insecure, and shameful

[MENTION=13609]Hazashin[/MENTION],

The ones I didn't mark as 6 or 9 don't necessarily indicate type. Anyways, something else that might help is to look at the themes and dichotomies of each type and decide which applies to you more often.

Six
-fear vs. courage
-trust vs. suspicion
-struggle with doubt, worry, and indecision
-rely too much on outside sources for security

Nine
-action vs. inaction/inertia
-comfort/peace of mind vs. discomfort/disturbance
-struggle with inattentiveness, anxiety, and passivity/giving in
-become lazy/indolent in order to remain peaceful and comfortable

I just made these up, so I'm not sure how helpful they'll be. I can't tell you whether you're a 6 or a 9--that's something only you can decide. But I hope my response is at least somewhat helpful.

 

[VagrantFarce]

Which are you more guilty of - inertia, or anxiety? Does your mind move too quickly, or does your body relax too easily?

6s are in the head triad - they are defined by their relationship to their minds. They have an over-active "internal radar" that causes them, at the worst of times, to be hyper-vigilant and overly-anxious about anything and everything that can go wrong.

9s are in the body triad - they are defined by their relationship to their gut. They have an under-active relationship to the world and themselves, easily becoming inert and self-forgetting in favour of remaining calm and peaceful.

 

[garbage]

Hi, I'm a 6. I'll shed some things from my perspective, some of which might stick.

Bolded are the things that I relate to; strikethrough are those that I don't relate to at all.

- Often dependent and inefficient with original thought, but VERY opinionated (an awful paradox of mine) and not group-oriented
- Often obsessive, but sometimes flighty and scatter-brained
- Passionate with things I care about, but unenthusiastic about most things
- Very loyal, especially with close friends and friends
- Lazy and undutiful with things I find unnecessary, but loyal and responsible with things I find necessary.
- Sometimes uncreative and unoriginal, but inquisitive and curious
- Almost completely deliberating -- too much so to the point of almost paralyzed indecisiveness
- Temperamental and emotional, but reserved most of time
- Very sensitive, but not defensive more often than not
- Mostly low-key, but periodically energetic
- Focused a lot on others, but sometimes too detached to have motivation to help them or simply cannot figure out ways to help them, whatever the situation may be
- Cooperative and compliant more often than not, but have my own values that I strongly stick to and do not conform
- Extremely guilty-conscious, but not necessarily 'responsible-feeling'
- Liking and loving of people, but not drawn to them for the most part
- Not very disciplined, but considerably determined and perseverant
- Persistent, but mostly passive due to wanting to take the best course of action as to avoid negative consequences
- Usually non-proactive, but not necessarily reactive
- Pacifistic and non-confrontational, but argumentative
- Detailed, meticulous, and perfectionistic of own work, but very accepting and understanding of others to the point of feeling like everybody should be pardoned for their faults
- Wishing well of others, but often self-pitying
- Very competitive, but always feeling bad for winning
- Rule-abiding, but usually not rule-agreeing
- Treating everyone as equals, but regularly feeling inferior
- Unsociable (at times), but friendly and warm with everyone who engages (though most of the time I'm very awkward) (also correlates with the Supine temperament)
- Sometimes very longing (but most of the time not), but feel guilty of it and do not ask others to get me whatever it is (if it is something that can be given) more often than not
- Considerably cautious and tentative, but sometimes unaware (I'm hyper-vigilant, myself)
- Mostly responsible, though sometimes forgetful
- Uncaring of success in the big sense in the word, as in fame and prestige, but very afraid of failing in individual things (e.g. "I must not lose this game," "I must not do this incorrectly," etc.), especially letting people I care about most down
- Mostly see good in everyone in the big sense of the word, but sometimes doubtful of them and their abilities if not proven so
- Almost entirely modest, though I do like compliments and being loved very much
- Emotionally expressive for the most part in private and people I'm close to (though sometimes emotionally void for some reason), but much more reserved in public as to not embarrass myself
- Very shy and timid, but open up rather easily and become interested to those who approach me (95% of my friends approached me first)
- Anxious and nervous quite frequently, but more calm and easy-going when not
- Somewhat idealistic, but not visionary and ambitious about it that much at all
- Very intimate and affectionate with those I'm close to, but only if they are comfortable with it
* EXTREMELY self-critical, self-conscious, insecure, and shameful

I'd describe myself as very analytical, responsible for self-improvement (to the point where my super-ego rules me), feeling pulled to be responsible/dutiful for things and people outside myself, vigilant. I do, however, care very much about success and I fear insignificance.

 

[Hazashin]

[MENTION=13609]Hazashin[/MENTION], [...] I just made these up, so I'm not sure how helpful they'll be. I can't tell you whether you're a 6 or a 9--that's something only you can decide. But I hope my response is at least somewhat helpful.

I've gone through and bolded what I relate to:

Six
-fear vs. courage
-trust vs. suspicion
-struggle with doubt, worry, and indecision
-rely too much on outside sources for security

Nine
-action vs. inaction/inertia
-comfort/peace of mind vs. discomfort/disturbance
-struggle with inattentiveness, anxiety, and passivity/giving in
-become lazy/indolent in order to remain peaceful and comfortable

 

[Hazashin]

Which are you more guilty of - inertia, or anxiety?

Wait, do you mean which one am I more guilty of doing, or which one I am more guilty about? I am more guilty of anxiety, but I am guilty of both. However, I feel more guilty about not taking action rather than being anxious.

Does your mind move too quickly, or does your body relax too easily?

My mind moves to quickly.

6s are in the head triad - they are defined by their relationship to their minds. They have an over-active "internal radar" that causes them, at the worst of times, to be hyper-vigilant and overly-anxious about anything and everything that can go wrong.

Well, I worry, but I wouldn't say I'm hyper-vigilant or overly-anxious (for most things). I do imagine all things that could go wrong, but I don't dwell on them.

9s are in the body triad - they are defined by their relationship to their gut. They have an under-active relationship to the world and themselves, easily becoming inert and self-forgetting in favour of remaining calm and peaceful.

Ehh, that doesn't really sound like me. I do, however, become passive and inert out of fear. I also fear conflict (but mostly because I care too much about people and my friends/family and do not want anyone to get hurt), and I intensely dislike upsetting people (especially those close to me).

Also, is it worth noting that my anxiety feels more in my "gut" rather than my head? When I get nervous or anxious, while my head does "spin" a little, I mostly get "butterflies in my stomach". Does that mean anything?

 

[Silveresque]

I've gone through and bolded what I relate to:

The parts in 9 you bolded could easily apply to type 6. Your struggle with doubt, worry, and indecision could be why you relate to the action/inaction dichotomy. Anxiety obviously applies to sixes as well, and passivity could easily fit too.

 

[Hazashin]

The parts in 9 you bolded could easily apply to type 6. Your struggle with doubt, worry, and indecision could be why you relate to the action/inaction dichotomy. Anxiety obviously applies to sixes as well, and passivity could easily fit too.

Do you think 6s can be more low-key, pacifistic, easy-going, and accepting as me? While I do worry and doubt, I, for the most part, I am not hyper-vigilant, I am sometimes absent-minded, I do not have high energy (though I do every so often gets spouts of energy), I am afraid of conflict, and I intensely avoid upsetting anyone because I do not want to hurt people's feelings/get them upset. I just care about people too much.

 

[SilkRoad]

I struggled a lot between 6 and 9 too. Lately I've started to feel that I couldn't be much more of a 6! But I think more easy-going/compliant 6s can look like 9s. And I am generally pretty easy-going and compliant - where I don't care about things, I really don't care, but where I do care, I care insanely and am enthusiastic, passionate, angry or combative, depending on the situation.

I find that the kind of person I am/how my personality manifests itself makes a great deal of sense with the dovetailing of enneagram type 6, and MBTI type INFJ. I'm really not sure in your case, but I just don't think it's surprising that you're having a hard time deciding between 6 and 9. I figured out I wasn't a 4 waaaaayyyyy before I figured out I wasn't a 9.

 

[Hazashin]

I struggled a lot between 6 and 9 too. Lately I've started to feel that I couldn't be much more of a 6! But I think more easy-going/compliant 6s can look like 9s. And I am generally pretty easy-going and compliant - where I don't care about things, I really don't care, but where I do care, I care insanely and am enthusiastic, passionate, angry or combative, depending on the situation.

I find that the kind of person I am/how my personality manifests itself makes a great deal of sense with the dovetailing of enneagram type 6, and MBTI type INFJ. I'm really not sure in your case, but I just don't think it's surprising that you're having a hard time deciding between 6 and 9. I figured out I wasn't a 4 waaaaayyyyy before I figured out I wasn't a 9.

Do you know if it's possible to be both easy-going/laid back and worrying at the same time? I'd say about 70% of the time, I am laid back/easy-going/"chill", and even when I am getting upset/uptight/anxious, I don't become all frantic and panicky (95% of the time), I mostly internalize it. Like, I guess you could say that when I do feel worried, it's mostly going on in my mind (though sometimes it converts to physical actions of my body if it's really bad, such as sweating, shaking, dizziness, etc.), and I mostly maintain a stable composure. Although it is often easy to tell if something is worrying me, I react calmly. I don't freak out unless I'm angry about something. If I'm feeling very afraid, it permeates throughout my body, and my heart starts to beat insanely fast. I've even almost passed out a few times (these were times when I was approaching my crush to talk to her or give her a gift).

Also, can 6s be very attentive to not upsetting people? I get DISGUSTED if I upset anyone/hurt anyone's feelings.

Am I making sense?

 

[Silveresque]

Do you think 6s can be more low-key, pacifistic, easy-going, and accepting as me? While I do worry and doubt, I, for the most part, I am not hyper-vigilant, I am sometimes absent-minded, I do not have high energy (though I do every so often gets spouts of energy), I am afraid of conflict, and I intensely avoid upsetting anyone because I do not want to hurt people's feelings/get them upset. I just care about people too much.

I do think this is possible. Every 6 is different, and as long as you feel that it's the best fit overall, the details don't matter too much.

 

[garbage]

The parts in 9 you bolded could easily apply to type 6. Your struggle with doubt, worry, and indecision could be why you relate to the action/inaction dichotomy. Anxiety obviously applies to sixes as well, and passivity could easily fit too.

Yeah, here's highlander's take on this and the part that I bolded, which especially highlights this phenomenon.

Anxiety to the point of indecision and existential crisis occurs for me, especially at my worst.

Also, can 6s be very attentive to not upsetting people? I get DISGUSTED if I upset anyone/hurt anyone's feelings.

I know that 9 is stereotypically the type that strives for harmony, but I also highly, highly prioritize not upsetting people. I tend to want everyone to have an amicable solution, all the time. Most importantly, I don't want to be the cause of conflict.

I don't mean to sway you toward 6.. just giving you the stuff that I identify with.

 

[Elfboy]

Yeah, here's highlander's take on this and the part that I bolded, which especially highlights this phenomenon.

Anxiety to the point of indecision and existential crisis occurs for me, especially at my worst.


I know that 9 is stereotypically the type that strives for harmony, but I also highly, highly prioritize not upsetting people. I tend to want everyone to have an amicable solution, all the time. Most importantly, I don't want to be the cause of conflict.

I don't mean to sway you toward 6.. just giving you the stuff that I identify with.

this sounds much more 6w7 than 6w5

 

[SilkRoad]

Do you know if it's possible to be both easy-going/laid back and worrying at the same time? I'd say about 70% of the time, I am laid back/easy-going/"chill", and even when I am getting upset/uptight/anxious, I don't become all frantic and panicky (95% of the time), I mostly internalize it. Like, I guess you could say that when I do feel worried, it's mostly going on in my mind (though sometimes it converts to physical actions of my body if it's really bad, such as sweating, shaking, dizziness, etc.), and I mostly maintain a stable composure. Although it is often easy to tell if something is worrying me, I react calmly. I don't freak out unless I'm angry about something. If I'm feeling very afraid, it permeates throughout my body, and my heart starts to beat insanely fast. I've even almost passed out a few times (these were times when I was approaching my crush to talk to her or give her a gift).

Also, can 6s be very attentive to not upsetting people? I get DISGUSTED if I upset anyone/hurt anyone's feelings.

Am I making sense?

Honestly, you do sound quite a lot like me, except based on your self-descriptions you sound more anxious and more timid, and with more self-esteem issues than I have. (I'm really sorry if that sounds mean, I'm just being honest! ) I think you are quite a bit younger than me though (I'm early thirties) so much of that will probably work itself out.

But yeah, I somehow manage to be both laid-back and anxious. It's an odd one. A lot of things don't faze me, but those which do can faze me A LOT. I look visibly calm - I speak fairly slowly and deliberately, etc. I regularly get told I seem very calm. But sometimes, if I am genuinely struggling with anxiety, it's almost like a coping mechanism. I think that there are an awful lot of things I just let go and am easy-going about partly because I know that when things DO get me upset, stressed and anxious, it can be very destructive. So I don't want to experience that more than necessary.

People are often surprised at how anxious I can be, though, because mainly they've seen the calm exterior. I'm actually being more direct with people about that. (Not sure if it has made much difference so far!). If it is appropriate/useful, I will say things like "I know I look calm, and a lot of things genuinely don't bother me, but you should know that I am a lot more sensitive and anxious than I look." Like you I internalize a lot, but sometimes that makes me physically ill, and if under major emotional stress I can shake, have a racing heart, nausea etc. (It has to be pretty bad though). I also suffer from a couple of phobias (not to an extreme level, but still bad enough) and generally my mind generates loads of possibilities for what may go wrong. I come from a family of worriers. Whenever I tell my parents I'm making a major-ish change in my life, even if I've given it serious thought, they always get anxious and go "but what about this? but did you think about that?". They know I'm pretty responsible and that I've probably thought it through! But it's almost automatic. It makes us conscientious and responsible, but also anxious and a bit too tentative/non-spontaneous.

I'm also very loyal but I worry about betrayal and unreliability. I certainly do worry about hurting people's feelings too, I can really feel it in myself if I've said something careless or hurtful. Although - if someone has hurt my feelings enough or seems unpleasant enough, I can get quite cold, numb and hard and say hurtful things without caring much. It's not really "me" but it's one side of me under unpleasant circumstances. With most people I'd be tactful, kind and fairly cautious about what I say.

Have you looked into the whole phobic/counterphobic thing? I tend to think any 6 can swing both ways but you're more inclined to one or the other. I'd be mainly phobic but I can feel myself swing to one side or another. I can be fairly aggressive if I feel angry and threatened, at least if I'm pushed far enough.

Hope some of this helps! I am still not sure which one you are, 6 or 9. But they certainly can resemble each other. I'm slightly leaning toward 6 for you but I would, wouldn't I?

 

[Snow Turtle]

Do you think 6s can be more low-key, pacifistic, easy-going, and accepting as me? While I do worry and doubt, I, for the most part, I am not hyper-vigilant, I am sometimes absent-minded, I do not have high energy (though I do every so often gets spouts of energy), I am afraid of conflict, and I intensely avoid upsetting anyone because I do not want to hurt people's feelings/get them upset. I just care about people too much.

I'd like to describe myself as pacifistic, easy-going and accepting. Not sure about low key though... I tend to be a little odd in that sense where I'm afraid that I'll screw up completely (making me want to hide) and getting a sudden determination to confront things (speaking in public). This is how the whole fear - courage thing manifests in my number 6 anyway. I want to prove that I'm capable of courage or something? Then again maybe I've got a bit of a wanna-be hero complex. (see below) Haha... Oh dear =.=

But, usually I'm in a low key passive mode unless I'm pushed or annoyed. It also manifests in my desire to support to underdog, where I'll suddenly gain a lot of courage in order to protect and back up people. I would have figured that this sort of thing might be typical of 6s though, at least those with a feeling bent.

 

[FDG]

Eh the majority of your descriptors are like

"Sometimes very X, but ALMOST NEVER X"

it's not really easy to deal with this information format

 

[SilkRoad]

Eh the majority of your descriptors are like

"Sometimes very X, but ALMOST NEVER X"

it's not really easy to deal with this information format

Makes him sound 6ish though, wouldn't you say?

 

[Viridian]

Although I sadly lack any useful advice whatsoever, I simply want to say: Boy, do I relate. Another 6/9 fence-sitter here.

(Curiously, I used to fancy myself a 5...)

Oh, by the way, have you looked into the strength/beauty dichotomy of the Sexual 6? It can shed some light on the phobic thing...

 

[Speed Gavroche]

If he is an 6, he's not a Sx-dom, not enough intense and reactive and power-seeker. He is a Self-pres 6: warmth and cordiality, very 9ish.

 

[Hazashin]

If he is an 6, he's not a Sx-dom, not enough intense and reactive and power-seeker. He is a Self-pres 6: warmth and cordiality, very 9ish.

But Speed, I took the official test on the Enneagram Institute's website, and this is what I got:

I think Sp and So are close enough that it could swing one way or the other (and I lean toward Sp, from what I know about myself), but it seems apparent that I am an Sx-dominant. I am just a phobic Sx-dominant 6.