Enneagram experts and wannabes, E9s and E7s come hither! TYPE ME!!

[Kasper]

I'm guessing 7 because of these:

7s are a part of the head triad (detachment) and even though they are considered clasically extraverted, they are Idealists who are not focused on reality as it is. 9s are Positive Outlookers like 7s, but they don't view the world in terms of potentially emotionally fulfilling possibilities that need to be manifested (chased after, whether literally or metaphorically); they simply reframe it into a place where negativity is minimized, and they are unperturbed. 7s are also part of the "aggressive" grouping (3, 7, 8) who identify with their own desires and directly pursue them. Whether or not the 7 is a true extrovert or not, they still have an essentially active way of seeing the world as opposed to the 9's very passive one.

No one has ever confused me for an Extrovert; of course life experience led me to a very withdrawn and internal place which may not have occurred naturally otherwise. I don't relate to the term "aggressive", replacing it with "embracing" as per the below link I can work with though. The re-framing to minimise negativity is more true for me than chasing desires, but I do embrace positivity when it comes my way.

7s appear to be moving towards people but their focus is really leaning away from them.
9s appear to be moving away from people (withdrawing) but their focus is really leaning towards them ("merging").

(http://www.9types.com/writeup/Theory20.htm)

I very much struggle to see myself and how I would fit into that, toward on the surface and away underneath sounds more accurate but I don't feel very aware about that aspect.

Copied from http://www.personalitynation.com/enneagram/2891-fauvres-tritype-archetypes.html

Not sure if it is right at all but thought it might be worth looking at.

Based on that I do think 793 combo is still correct, not the 794.

9s are more stable and linear(on the outside) than this.

How do you mean?

 

[Kasper]

Looking at the parenting v child Enneagram:

Active: demanding, assertive, bossy, outspoken, intimidating, egocentric, expressive, willful.
Responsive: supportive, responsive, engaging, affectionate, friendly, sympathetic, cooperative.
Neutral: avoidant, withdrawn, indifferent, apathetic, absent, reserved, ignoring, neglectful.

Active child vs. Responsive parent: This scenario is thought to produce Enneagram type 7

The demands and concerns of the Active child are usually received with benevolence and a supportive, encouraging attitude. This creates a tolerant environment in which the child can express himself openly and receive attention without much effort from his part. The Active child becomes self-confident, carefree and expects his interactions to be positive and favorable to his needs. The Responsive parent is sympathetic and loving, thus stimulating the child's playful, self-expressive side and giving him a good deal of personal freedom.

This childhood scenario promotes a cheerful, optimistic type who knows how to charm and manipulate others into easily getting his way. Entertaining and expressive, such a child may later expect instant gratification for all his needs and desires and avoid investing time and effort into long-term goals.


Neutral child vs. Active parent: This scenario is thought to produce Enneagram type 9

The Neutral child is often overwhelmed and frightened by the controlling, domineering Active parent. Lacking self-assertion skills, he prefers to withdraw and stay out of the way, minimizing his own needs and avoiding the parent as much as possible. On the few occasions the child reaches out to the caretaker, he ends up feeling rejected and bullied around for no apparent reason, which causes him to withdraw again. The loneliness, however, also feels like rejection and soon enough the youngster will be ambivalent towards both being alone and being with others.

Most of the time, a compromise will be made. This type will seek out company but will not invest themselves in it, preferring to keep in the background and go with the flow, partly removed from their actual situation. When alone, they will avoid introspection, which will bring about old feelings of depression and rejection, instead they'd rather numb themselves out with food, TV or other unimportant routines to avoid emotional pain.

Don't know if this holds much weight or not but the scenario described to produce E9 is pretty indicative of my relationship with my mum growing up. I can see my mum as responsive, but even she agrees that I did not get that kind of interaction with her as the marriage was getting worse and worse as I was growing up, she was def active in my mind. I did feel dominated and I did withdraw, literally physically withdrew. I never really cared if I was on my own or with others. When alone I would numb myself with mindless things.

 

[Rasofy]

How do you mean?

They're not as random and impulsive as 7s can be, since they get schizoidish at unhealthy levels, while 7s get bipolarish. They are more grounded and realistic, but usually more boring and less imaginative.

 

[Kasper]

They're not as random and impulsive as 7s can be, since they get schizoidish at unhealthy levels, while 7s get bipolarish. They are more grounded and realistic, but usually more boring and less imaginative.

Ah kay.

I am random, I am a Ne dom, but I tend to tone it down in person so as to not draw attention, I have to trust you a lot to let the random loose, and I am impulsive in an avoidant way, I chase good feelings.

When I was in depression I did not have high highs, I was still able to be happy n stuff but schizoid would fit better over bipolar as a descriptive view on how I presented then. I withdrew and shut out the world.

Now I can prolly relate better to bipolar as a descriptive view as I have more highs than lows so am generally up.

 

[FDG]

Damn. 1 @ activity level in Big-5 E?

I get 99 XD

 

[Kasper]

Damn. 1 @ activity level in Big-5 E?

I get 99 XD

Tell me about it!! It's the one way that I am not extroverted. To have fun I prefer to be out and about but I'm rather passive about it, with someone who encourages my incorrigibility I can get active but left to my own accord I'm pretty meh.

 

[Mal12345]

Ah kay.

I am random, I am a Ne dom, but I tend to tone it down in person so as to not draw attention, I have to trust you a lot to let the random loose, and I am impulsive in an avoidant way, I chase good feelings.

When I was in depression I did not have high highs, I was still able to be happy n stuff but schizoid would fit better over bipolar as a descriptive view on how I presented then. I withdrew and shut out the world.

Now I can prolly relate better to bipolar as a descriptive view as I have more highs than lows so am generally up.

It's revealing that Riso correlates the type 7 with Se, but his type description sounds like Ne ("possibilities"). What he calls Te correlates better with 8 than with 1.

The only real question here is your wing-type. Since you are concerned with self-presentation, until you trust someone anyway, then that indicates a 6-wing, "The Entertainer."

Whilst 5 is your type's direction of integration, the types will draw from the characteristics and energies on either side of their direction of integration or disintegration.

 

[wildflower]

you sound like a 9 to me, especially being a bass player. the two 7 musicians i know are drummers. 7s are typically very high energy and when stressed get rather manic. 9s are more chill and go with the flow. they withdraw when stressed.

 

[Kasper]

The only real question here is your wing-type. Since you are concerned with self-presentation, until you trust someone anyway, then that indicates a 6-wing, "The Entertainer."

I relate (and score) in the following order:
9/7 <- me
5/8
3/4
[slight gap]
2
[sizable gap]
6
1 <- anti me

I'm definitely a w8 weather I'm a 7 or a 9.

I automatically trust people, I'm not okay with vulnerability is all so if it's something a little bit raw then I will withhold, not because I don't trust the other person, or even cause I care if it's repeated to others but because I need to keep it to myself until I reconcile with it. I'm not okay with emotional vulnerability.

you sound like a 9 to me, especially being a bass player. the two 7 musicians i know are drummers. 7s are typically very high energy and when stressed get rather manic. 9s are more chill and go with the flow. they withdraw when stressed.

Sounds scientific The high energy part is the main reason I'm getting more and more uncomfortable with typing as 7w8 though, I'm just not. I do withdraw when stressed.

 

[wildflower]

Sounds scientific The high energy part is the main reason I'm getting more and more uncomfortable with typing as 7w8 though, I'm just not. I do withdraw when stressed.

what can i say i dated a few musicians back in the day. bass players are super chill. drummers bounce off the walls. both can be optimistic and fun though.

 

[Kasper]

Righto, help me!

This is a list of the E9/E7 stuff that I feel does and does not fit, whaddya recon?


My issues with 7/Support of 9:

- I don't fear boredom, maybe in part because my mind can always entertain me but also partly because I don't need to be doing anything I'm happy to sit there and ponder things.
- I am not high-energy, I'm actually decidedly low energy.
- Anger is the one thing in other people that I withdraw from faster than anything as I seriously cannot handle it, if you show me anger I will never trust you again.
- I consider myself more ballsy than assertive, although I can be when I need to be.
- I am highly introspective and have always lived in my head.
- I do not have a strong sense of self as separate from others.
- I tend to go with the flow rather than create my own path against resistance.
- I don't really have goals, and can't generally be fussed with setting any, every once in a while I'll try to set some but it is short-lived.
- I avoid confrontation. I hate confrontation. It's the reason I stopped modding elsewhere and I cringe if there are disagreements here.
- I am usually quiet, I listen more than I talk, but I do have my excited moments.
- I am used to being on my own, and am comfortable there.
- I have faith that all things will work out.
- I don't like to draw attention - but I can handle it fine.
- I do not use force to assert myself.
- The statement "a lot of my excitement goes on in my imagination" is very much true.
- I don't feel as though anxiety is an issue for me.
- I seek to remain neutral in conflict. I'm very active in this pursuit much of the time!
- I can idealise others.
- Burying ones head in the sand is a past time for me.
- While people can see my ENTP need to debate as argumentative I will never raise my voice and take a conversation personal, which is my definition of an argument. I have never argued with a romantic partner, ever.
- I think I'm softer 'round the edges than the average ENTP. As much as I enjoy devils advocating I could never be a troll.


My issues with 9/Support of 7:

- I enjoy high emotions and elation.
- I see myself more as a head type than gut type - but then 9s are often out of harmony with their gutness.
- I am highly impulsive.
- I play fun and work hard, generally in that order.
- When I am motivated by something I will get it hell or high water (unless I'm distracted by something shinier).
- Short attention span; I has them.
- I am comfortable taking the lead when I feel competent and no one else is. I sought out a management position.
- I can be quite competitive.
- I do not believe I am seen as too accommodating, even if I am.
- I love stimulation, adventure, excitement and variety.
- I can be assertive - but then I am a w8.
- I resist commitment and stability, in favour of keeping options open and wanting change.
- I'm all for instant gratification.
- I do not deny myself what I want. Get an idea in my head: need it instantly.
- I'm a quick thinker.
- I'm aware of, and comfortable owning my strengths, and I can also downplay my weaknesses, although I will still own them.
- I do not equate self-assertion with aggression, I see the former as very positive.
- Sp/So E9s can be seen as the least assertive of all the enneagram types, I'm not.

 

[Asterion]

I think you could be a 6. Have you considered that type? Actively seeking security could look quite like a 7 actively securing their needs. One does it out of fear of not having support, the other to avoid the feeling of being deprived.

You do say that you aren't an anxious type, but I can only see you as being an anxious/head type. I can't see you as a 9, like I said before, you're too assertive, I really don't think it fits.

 

[Kasper]

I think you could be a 6. Have you considered that type? Actively seeking security could look quite like a 7 actively securing their needs. One does it out of fear of not having support, the other to avoid the feeling of being deprived.

You do say that you aren't an anxious type, but I can only see you as being an anxious/head type. I can't see you as a 9, like I said before, you're too assertive, I really don't think it fits.

I don't seek security, I'd rather take risks and win big as even if I lose I have eternal faith that it will all work out. I'll read up more on 6 but it's one of the two types that I have really struggled to identify with.

Why do you see me as a head type? I mean I feel I am too as I am future orientated, but I'm curious as to why you think that if you can articulate it.

 

[Asterion]

I don't seek security, I'd rather take risks and win big as even if I lose I have eternal faith that it will all work out. I'll read up more on 6 but it's one of the two types that I have really struggled to identify with.

Why do you see me as a head type? I mean I feel I am too as I am future orientated, but I'm curious as to why you think that if you can articulate it.

I had originally written an explanation, but retracted it for some reason, I was probably not happy with it, . By elimination:

1 - no
2 - no
3 - no
4 - no
5 - ?
6 - ?
7 - ?
8 - no
9 - no

Those three stand out to me as potential fits for you. All happen to be head types, I can't see you as any other, it doesn't match up. You don't seem like a security seeker to me either. I was thinking you might be a 5 though, it's highly likely, have you seen the polls on this forum? It almost looked like 4 in 5 were 5s, most likely so because the internet fits them like a glove. It should be easy to eliminate five and 9 in one go for you. When at your worst (eg. Depressed, stressed etc.), do you go gather more and more stuff?

My brother is a 7 and just keeps wanting more when under stress, he wants a new TV, an Iphone, every game he sees, a new mouse, new bed, new furniture, more food. I tell him to stop and think, "do you need it? You're getting ripped off, why don't you actually think about it?". He really drives me up the wall, often trying to manipulate me to try to get what he 'needs'.

My mother, a 9 will fully withdraw. She stopped doing anything, and eventually fell apart, in the same way that I did once, I think it's similar for all withdrawing types (459), there are slight differences as far as I can tell.

 

[Rasofy]

Righto, help me!

This is a list of the E9/E7 stuff that I feel does and does not fit, whaddya recon?

I think you are actually a w6. 7w6.
Interesting quote from a 7w6 vs 7w8 thread:

6/6wing: accept...acceptable to society...being accepted by others others...acceptance as a theme...acceptable means being "good" and "reasonable"...more concerned about belonging...being presentable...being relatable...lack of a "dark side"/true badassness

http://63.246.1.31/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14317&whichpage=1

 

[Mal12345]

I relate (and score) in the following order:
9/7 <- me
5/8
3/4
[slight gap]
2
[sizable gap]
6
1 <- anti me

I'm definitely a w8 weather I'm a 7 or a 9.

I automatically trust people,

"I tend to tone it down in person so as to not draw attention, I have to trust you a lot to let the random loose"

I'm not okay with vulnerability is all so if it's something a little bit raw then I will withhold, not because I don't trust the other person, or even cause I care if it's repeated to others but because I need to keep it to myself until I reconcile with it. I'm not okay with emotional vulnerability[....] I do withdraw when stressed.

Withdrawing is a type 8 stressing at 5.

7w8: "Persons of this subtype are aggressive in two ways: in the demands they make on the environment [7] and in the strength of their egos to enforce those demands [8]. No one frustrates people of this subtype without hearing about it."

 

[Kasper]

Those three stand out to me as potential fits for you. All happen to be head types, I can't see you as any other, it doesn't match up. You don't seem like a security seeker to me either. I was thinking you might be a 5 though, it's highly likely, have you seen the polls on this forum? It almost looked like 4 in 5 were 5s, most likely so because the internet fits them like a glove. It should be easy to eliminate five and 9 in one go for you. When at your worst (eg. Depressed, stressed etc.), do you go gather more and more stuff?

My brother is a 7 and just keeps wanting more when under stress, he wants a new TV, an Iphone, every game he sees, a new mouse, new bed, new furniture, more food. I tell him to stop and think, "do you need it? You're getting ripped off, why don't you actually think about it?". He really drives me up the wall, often trying to manipulate me to try to get what he 'needs'.

My mother, a 9 will fully withdraw. She stopped doing anything, and eventually fell apart, in the same way that I did once, I think it's similar for all withdrawing types (459), there are slight differences as far as I can tell.

Both in a way, at my worst I go to my room, block out the world and do nothing that involves leaving there unless I have to (ie work). At my worst I won't even get food delivered unless I can order it online as I do not want to talk to anyone. In that space I don't care about getting new things, I only care about having things around me that will distract me from reality (ie movies/internet). I sleep, I do things that distract me and I occasionally eat or drink.

At the same time I frequently buy things that I want without limiting myself by reality such as 'can I afford it' or 'are there other things I should be spending money on first', but I do that even if I'm not stressed.

If my stress is specifically about money I will not spend, but I also will not check my bank balance, it's totally stupid cause knowledge is key, but rather than facing reality I choose instead to metaphorically cover my eyes so I can't see something and believe that means it can't see me. It's not happening.

This stuff however, is stuff that I would not normally reveal. I'm embarrassed about this side of me so I minimise that as well.

I did start out thinking I may be 5 back when I was unsure of my MBTI type, I figured the reason I scored so high on 7 (and 8) was because that was my E-type under stress (growth), but I'm simply not internal in the 5 intellectual way, I'm an over thinker as opposed to a deep thinker. I don't stay on one thing long enough to go deep, I skim things and go for breadth instead.

I think you are actually a w6. 7w6.
Interesting quote from a 7w6 vs 7w8 thread:

http://63.246.1.31/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14317&whichpage=1

I don't really care about acceptance, I've never been bothered if people don't like me, although to be honest I rarely know if people like me unless told, same goes for not liking me. I am happy being individual even though I don't seek to stand out. I would rather go against the grain in order to be true to myself then fit other people's expectations. It's more a matter of I want harmony around me, both in my relationship with others, and in their relationships with each other. So I tend not to make waves unless it's what I have to do in order to be true to myself, but even then I will minimise them as much as I possibly can.

I never disregard anything, and I will look deeper on it but I struggle to see w6 as an option.

"I tend to tone it down in person so as to not draw attention, I have to trust you a lot to let the random loose"

Those bits sounds contradictory don't they

To explain: I trust that people have good intentions, I do not presume the worst in anyone unless they give me reason.

I do not however trust many people to let my walls down as I'm not okay with showing raw emotion, I am not okay with not being in control. Even when drunk off my ass I'm the person that others will approach to ask me if I ever get drunk as they've never seen me drunk, I do not lose control. I'm always me but I don't really know how to let my guard down, part of that is that I am a very open person with most things and if something is being kept behind my wall it's something that I probably don't want to face myself.

Withdrawing is a type 8 stressing at 5.

7w8: "Persons of this subtype are aggressive in two ways: in the demands they make on the environment [7] and in the strength of their egos to enforce those demands [8]. No one frustrates people of this subtype without hearing about it."

Well to make that point murkier: If you frustrate me you will probably never hear about it, I'll swallow it and move on to happier thoughts. I'll also see my frustration as my issue, not yours so feel I have no right to push that on you.

 

[Owfin]

Well to make that point murkier: If you frustrate me you will probably never hear about it, I'll swallow it and move on to happier thoughts. I'll also see my frustration as my issue, not yours so feel I have no right to push that on you.

Moving on to happier thoughts? Sounds like a 7 to me.

 

[Speed Gavroche]

7: self-absorbed and focused on their own agenda for pleasure and pleasant project above all, are afraid that people prevent him to take his own decisions.

9: merge with other people needs and diffuse his awareness in substitute actions and pleasure, is afraid to act on his own on a focused action.

 

[Flux]

I think my friend is a 7(probably w6) and is more like Tigger. I had trouble figuring out my enneagram but I believe its 9w8. We are both 'laid-back' but he has more outward effervescent type of energy while I joke that mine is stored. He is more bouncy while I am more like a bear. I'm more than content to eat and scrounge for berries until you threaten my cubs (friends or loved ones). It is an oversimplification, but I think the description works.

When relating to the opposite sex he enjoys the company of women who take care of him and meet his needs. He is good at getting people to take care of him.

I relate to the part about 9s meandering when speaking, I can be pretty spacey and absentminded and sometimes I even forget what I was saying mid-sentence. I can't tell you your type but I hope this helps you compare a bit more. I think you are a 7 (of some sort) who was just withdrew for w/e reason as a child.