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My answers to Limit's questionnaire

Elfboy

Certified Sausage Smoker
Joined
Nov 26, 2008
Messages
9,625
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
5w4
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I dunno if I'm an Sx-dom... Intimacy is a bit of a problem with me. :peepwall:

What changed your mind to INFP? :)

I've thought so for a few months actually. recently I've begun to understand the INFP personality a lot more intimately. before I assumed they were much more like myself except more gentle and introverted, but now I'm beginning to understand some of the differences between Fi dom and Fi aux, and also taking into account my enneagram vs the enneagram of most INFPs. as most INFPs are 9s, 4s and 6s, it's understandable that being a 7w8 they'd be much different from me. INFPs tend to put a lot of emphasis on tolerance, acceptance, harmony, peace. for this reason I frequently mistook them for Fe users and typed them as INFJ or ISFJ
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
I have an idea. Describe your F function (Fi/Fe). How does it work? What does it allow you to do? What are the easiest/hardest parts of it? Think of how you experience empathy/sympathy and how it helps you interact with others.
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
I've thought so for a few months actually. recently I've begun to understand the INFP personality a lot more intimately. before I assumed they were much more like myself except more gentle and introverted, but now I'm beginning to understand some of the differences between Fi dom and Fi aux, and also taking into account my enneagram vs the enneagram of most INFPs. as most INFPs are 9s, 4s and 6s, it's understandable that being a 7w8 they'd be much different from me. INFPs tend to put a lot of emphasis on tolerance, acceptance, harmony, peace. for this reason I frequently mistook them for Fe users and typed them as INFJ or ISFJ

Yeah, I think Enneagram plays a big part. :yes: (Although I think 4s care less about harmony and more about authenticity of feelings.)

I have an idea. Describe your F function (Fi/Fe). How does it work? What does it allow you to do? What are the easiest/hardest parts of it? Think of how you experience empathy/sympathy and how it helps you interact with others.

For the most part, it:

* Impels me to consider the impact my words and actions have on the feelings of others;

* Allows me to adhere to a few personal principles/guidelines without being overt or outspoken about it (partly due to my shyness);

* Increases my sensitivity to others' expectations and opinions of me (also allowing me to be less judgmental, by the same token);

* Encourages me to avoid conflict and squabbling;

* Leads me to identify and respect personal "barriers" (that is to say, I avoid invading others' personal space and expect the same).

Now, useful life skills like deep understanding, caretaking, upholding values, teaching, counseling or building bonds? Zero, nada, zippo, squat. :doh:
 

Noon

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Jul 23, 2010
Messages
790
Now, useful life skills like deep understanding, caretaking, upholding values, teaching, counseling or building bonds? Zero, nada, zippo, squat. :doh:

But these are all good examples of the bolded:

Impels me to consider the impact my words and actions have on the feelings of others
Increases my sensitivity to others' expectations and opinions of me (also allowing me to be less judgmental, by the same token)
Encourages me to avoid conflict and squabbling
Leads me to identify and respect personal "barriers" (that is to say, I avoid invading others' personal space and expect the same).
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
For the most part, it:

* Impels me to consider the impact my words and actions have on the feelings of others;

* Allows me to adhere to a few personal principles/guidelines without being overt or outspoken about it (partly due to my shyness);

* Increases my sensitivity to others' expectations and opinions of me (also allowing me to be less judgmental, by the same token);

* Encourages me to avoid conflict and squabbling;

* Leads me to identify and respect personal "barriers" (that is to say, I avoid invading others' personal space and expect the same).

Now, useful life skills like deep understanding, caretaking, upholding values, teaching, counseling or building bonds? Zero, nada, zippo, squat. :doh:

I'm not sure whether these would fit more into Fi or Fe. I suppose they're all skills that I have as well, as a Fi user, but I think a Fe user might be just as likely to fit those descriptions. :shrug:

I perceive Fe as spreading out and taking everyone in, and Fi as reaching out toward one person of focus to connect deeply. When someone is sad, Fe notices the signs of sadness and tries to help in some way, like cheering the person up (because that's what every good person is expected to do in such a situation). Fi, on the other hand, wants to understand what that person is feeling and empathize. In my experience, as a Fi user, I am easily moved emotionally because my first instinct when I see that someone is sad is to empathize--not just to care, but to actually imagine and try to feel what that person must be feeling. It's hard to explain though, because I don't necessarily put myself in the other person's shoes. I'm feeling for them, but it's really more from my own perspective in a way. I wish I knew Fe better so I could describe the differences more rather than just give a Fi perspective. Perhaps Fe wants to be a good Samaritan while Fi wants to be genuine, deep, and connecting. Fe has been called more shallow than Fi, and Fi has been called more selfish than Fe, though I don't believe either is entirely true or false.
 

Viridian

New member
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
But these are all good examples of the bolded:

They are? I thought it was just me being a skittish youth... :shock:

I'm not sure whether these would fit more into Fi or Fe. I suppose they're all skills that I have as well, as a Fi user, but I think a Fe user might be just as likely to fit those descriptions. :shrug:

I perceive Fe as spreading out and taking everyone in, and Fi as reaching out toward one person of focus to connect deeply. When someone is sad, Fe notices the signs of sadness and tries to help in some way, like cheering the person up (because that's what every good person is expected to do in such a situation). Fi, on the other hand, wants to understand what that person is feeling and empathize. In my experience, as a Fi user, I am easily moved emotionally because my first instinct when I see that someone is sad is to empathize--not just to care, but to actually imagine and try to feel what that person must be feeling. It's hard to explain though, because I don't necessarily put myself in the other person's shoes. I'm feeling for them, but it's really more from my own perspective in a way. I wish I knew Fe better so I could describe the differences more rather than just give a Fi perspective. Perhaps Fe wants to be a good Samaritan while Fi wants to be genuine, deep, and connecting. Fe has been called more shallow than Fi, and Fi has been called more selfish than Fe, though I don't believe either is entirely true or false.

The trouble is, I think, that quite a few of my Fe-ish behaviors can be attributed to general insecurity - being way too concerned about others' acceptance or rejection, having trouble saying "No, I don't feel like doing X", being afraid of being the "voice of dissent"... :shrug:

However, going by your descriptions, I suspect I might be more Fe, since I don't think I go that deep into the rabbit hole about some feelings... Like, there was this dream Huxley (the forumer) told us about, where she experienced life from the viewpoint of a spider, and never squished one again... I don't think I could examine a situation so deeply. The thought of "becoming somebody/something" else is a bit unnerving to me, since it entails such a complete change of context. As well as the perils that come with it. :unsure:

(Not that I'm incapable of grasping negative feelings, mind you, I'm just more specialized in certain ones... Am I expressing myself in a clear way here?)
 

Silveresque

Active member
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Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
The trouble is, I think, that quite a few of my Fe-ish behaviors can be attributed to general insecurity - being way too concerned about others' acceptance or rejection, having trouble saying "No, I don't feel like doing X", being afraid of being the "voice of dissent"... :shrug:

However, going by your descriptions, I suspect I might be more Fe, since I don't think I go that deep into the rabbit hole about some feelings... Like, there was this dream Huxley (the forumer) told us about, where she experienced life from the viewpoint of a spider, and never squished one again... I don't think I could examine a situation so deeply. The thought of "becoming somebody/something" else is a bit unnerving to me, since it entails such a complete change of context. As well as the perils that come with it. :unsure:

(Not that I'm incapable of grasping negative feelings, mind you, I'm just more specialized in certain ones... Am I expressing myself in a clear way here?)

I think being a 9 can make someone seem more Fe even if they're a Fi user. 9 makes one more concerned with harmony and others' opinions/viewpoints and thus more agreeable, and it can also make one less aware of one's own feelings (repression, gut triad so feeling last). Maybe you really are a Fe user, but it's hard to tell because of your enneatype, so I wouldn't rule out Fi just yet. I'll have to do more research on this. Maybe I'll start a Fi/Fe thread or something...
 

Viridian

New member
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Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
I think being a 9 can make someone seem more Fe even if they're a Fi user. 9 makes one more concerned with harmony and others' opinions/viewpoints and thus more agreeable, and it can also make one less aware of one's own feelings (repression, gut triad so feeling last). Maybe you really are a Fe user, but it's hard to tell because of your enneatype, so I wouldn't rule out Fi just yet. I'll have to do more research on this. Maybe I'll start a Fi/Fe thread or something...

There are quite a few Fe/Fi threads around, but it's hard to trudge through the spats. It goes like this...

"Fi is pure and genuine! Fe is sycophantic and manipulative!" :saturned:
"Fe is caring and nurturing! Fi is selfish and inconsiderate!" :jesus:
:bitchfest:
:girlfight:
:emot-emo:
:boohoo:
:doh:
:thelook:
:wtf:
:mad:
:tongue10:
:BangHead:
:ranting:
:dry:
:harhar:
:hug:

Lather, rinse, repeat.

/only partly joking
 

Silveresque

Active member
Joined
Jul 28, 2011
Messages
1,169
There are quite a few Fe/Fi threads around, but it's hard to trudge through the spats. It goes like this...

"Fi is pure and genuine! Fe is sycophantic and manipulative!" :saturned:
"Fe is caring and nurturing! Fi is selfish and inconsiderate!" :jesus:
:bitchfest:
:girlfight:
:emot-emo:
:boohoo:
:doh:
:thelook:
:wtf:
:mad:
:tongue10:
:BangHead:
:ranting:
:dry:
:harhar:
:hug:

Lather, rinse, repeat.

/only partly joking

So true! :laugh:
 

Noon

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Jul 23, 2010
Messages
790
Out of curiosity, though, do my descriptions sound more like Fe or Fi to you?

I can see the majority of them fitting into both or either, depending on your reasons. The only one which I thought was a clear example of Fe was:

*Increases my sensitivity to others' expectations and opinions of me (also allowing me to be less judgmental, by the same token)

Your underlying primary focus seems to be on what goes on between yourself and others, how you impact each other and whatnot, so I would guess Fe at a glance. But I still believe your reasons would clarify the difference much better.
 

Viridian

New member
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Dec 30, 2010
Messages
3,036
MBTI Type
IsFJ
I can see the majority of them fitting into both or either, depending on your reasons. The only one which I thought was a clear example of Fe was:



Your underlying primary focus seems to be on what goes on between yourself and others, how you impact each other and whatnot, so I would guess Fe at a glance. But I still believe your reasons would clarify the difference much better.

In this specific case, what I meant was: I hate feeling foolish, inferior, incompetent, etc.; I often feel as if I'm being silently judged* by my peers (for lack of a better word); it's a feeling that brings about guilt, unease, defeatism and other fun emotions; therefore, I'd like to not evoke these sorts of feelings in others.

Mind you, I can get quite critical under pressure/stress. Especially when other people are "getting in the way" of my efforts. But mostly, I try to minimize pressure towards others. I may be a small-minded man, but that's my problem and no one else's. :dry:

Does that help, Noon? I never quite know when I've gone far enough into the rabbit hole... ;)

* (When they're not vocal about it, that is.)
 

Silveresque

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Messages
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In this specific case, what I meant was: I hate feeling foolish, inferior, incompetent, etc.; I often feel as if I'm being silently judged* by my peers (for lack of a better word); it's a feeling that brings about guilt, unease, defeatism and other fun emotions; therefore, I'd like to not evoke these sorts of feelings in others.

Mind you, I can get quite critical under pressure/stress. Especially when other people are "getting in the way" of my efforts. But mostly, I try to minimize pressure towards others. I may be a small-minded man, but that's my problem and no one else's. :dry:

Does that help, Noon? I never quite know when I've gone far enough into the rabbit hole... ;)

* (When they're not vocal about it, that is.)

That's Fi! That's the same reason I would have given. You're not being nice out of social obligation, but because you know from your own experience what it's like to feel judged, and you don't want to make others feel that way. You're deriving your own sense of morality from within, from empathy. And getting critical under stress is probably Te. It looks like you could be an INFP after all. :)
 

Noon

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Jul 23, 2010
Messages
790
Does that help, Noon? I never quite know when I've gone far enough into the rabbit hole... ;)

Somewhat :)

edit: Oh, it sounds as if I am repeating myself.

What I mean is
So far you've demonstrated that you generally focus more on the external and that your Feeling is utilized primarily in an interpersonal context.
 

Viridian

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Dec 30, 2010
Messages
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IsFJ
That's Fi! That's the same reason I would have given. You're not being nice out of social obligation, but because you know from your own experience what it's like to feel judged, and you don't want to make others feel that way. You're deriving your own sense of morality from within, from empathy. And getting critical under stress is probably Te. It looks like you could be an INFP after all. :)

That is indeed a compelling argument... :yes: Still, there's the fact that a) that doesn't explain my neuroses concerning what other people think and b) I do, in fact, say a lot of nice things out of a sense of duty, not just natural empathy (I ain't that much of a saint :smile:). I do think my Te is stronger than my Ti, though... :thinking:

Somewhat :)

edit: Oh, it sounds as if I am repeating myself.

What I mean is
So far you've demonstrated that you generally focus more on the external and that your Feeling is utilized primarily in an interpersonal context.

That sounds kind of accurate... I'm kind of oblivious to my current social context, though - even though I'm supposed to be a journalism student 'n' stuff. :blush:

The "social context", here, sometimes becomes an amorphous mass of people who (I think) feel either pity, mild contempt or apathy towards me... or maybe they'd laugh at me if they found out what a huge dork I am, all of them, grinning shadows snickering about the "babe in the woods" that somehow made it into the fortress of the "intellectual elite"*. :aquiver:

* (You know how they talk about "The Beautiful People"? My university is the den of The Intelligent People - intellectuals, questioners, iconoclasts, subverters of unspoken structures. Those who bite at the ankles of those in power, those who know critical thinking inside out, who yield it as a fine tool, shaking their heads at the oblivious working class and spitting in the eye of the oppressors. You know the kind. :cool:)

...Geez, I'm drifting. :doh:
 

Noon

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That sounds kind of accurate... I'm kind of oblivious to my current social context, though - even though I'm supposed to be a journalism student 'n' stuff. :blush:
It's understandable. You are an introvert and self-preservation first, after all. Fe does not necessarily confer social grace or skill -- that is an individual effort. What is most defining of an Fe user is the preference to focus on the outer (concrete) aspects of value and identity.

* (You know how they talk about "The Beautiful People"? My university is the den of The Intelligent People - intellectuals, questioners, iconoclasts, subverters of unspoken structures. Those who bite at the ankles of those in power, those who know critical thinking inside out, who yield it as a fine tool, shaking their heads at the oblivious working class and spitting in the eye of the oppressors. You know the kind. :cool:)

Fe doesn't necessarily exclude you from being rebellious or untied to social norms and obligations :)

But with Fe, I imagine there is a noticeably more prominent desire to affect your environment with your identity/sense of value and to be open to being affected by it. Fe can have a rebellious desire to change the face of the social environment, and work diligently towards it. ENFJs are an especially good example of this.
 

Silveresque

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Messages
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That is indeed a compelling argument... :yes: Still, there's the fact that a) that doesn't explain my neuroses concerning what other people think and b) I do, in fact, say a lot of nice things out of a sense of duty, not just natural empathy (I ain't that much of a saint :smile:). I do think my Te is stronger than my Ti, though... :thinking:

Do you think Fi-users can't be hypersensitive about what others think of them? I worry a lot about what others think of me, and I don't think that has anything to do with Fe/Fi. And I also often say nice things out of social obligation, because, well...it's pretty much obligatory unless you want people to think you're a cold person. But when I do that I have a sense of just going through the motions, and it kind of bothers me. I feel much more at ease when I'm acting out of genuine empathy.
 

Viridian

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IsFJ
It's understandable. You are an introvert and self-preservation first, after all. Fe does not necessarily confer social grace or skill -- that is an individual effort. What is most defining of an Fe user is the preference to focus on the outer (concrete) aspects of value and identity.

Point taken. :)

Then again, the "social sphere" is far from what catches my eye the most... :shrug:

Fe doesn't necessarily exclude you from being rebellious or untied to social norms and obligations :)

But with Fe, I imagine there is a noticeably more prominent desire to affect your environment with your identity/sense of value and to be open to being affected by it. Fe can have a rebellious desire to change the face of the social environment, and work diligently towards it. ENFJs are an especially good example of this.

Oh, I didn't mean to imply that! I was simply pointing out that I don't feel nearly as "subversive" or political as them - it's a private source of shame for me, as I've mentioned in passing once or twice. I'm kind of a sheep, really. :/

Do you think Fi-users can't be hypersensitive about what others think of them? I worry a lot about what others think of me, and I don't think that has anything to do with Fe/Fi. And I also often say nice things out of social obligation, because, well...it's pretty much obligatory unless you want people to think you're a cold person. But when I do that I have a sense of just going through the motions, and it kind of bothers me. I feel much more at ease when I'm acting out of genuine empathy.

But I thought all Fi users were full of magic and poetry and were only sad because people didn't understand them! :ohmy:

(That's actually what I thought not too long ago. :blush:)

Going through the motions can be a bit bothersome if it takes too long, I agree. But I feel the need to be nice to those that extend me favors or are pleasant towards me (e.g. parents' friends that invite my family over for dinner).
 
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