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Thread: INFP or ENFP?

  1. #21
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Hi All!

    I became interested in personality theory a few years ago, when my wife got her license to administer a Christian temperament analysis, and she tested me and several friends and family. I came to see how the theory helps us understand ourselveds and others. Then, one of these friends encourages us to take the Keirsey Temperament Sorter online. We both come out as ENFJ, which while possible for here, was way off for me. I then set out to understand the 16types system, and compare it to ours. Ours is based on FIRO and uses the ancient four temperaments of Galen (Sanguine, Melancholy Choleric, Phlegmatic), but has concluded that there was a fifth temperament, as well as the three areas (From FIRO) in which temperament can be blended (social, leadership and deep personal). I happen to fall into the new temperament in two of the areas, while being Choleric in the leadership area.

    I had become so enthusiastic about this, that I looked for somewhere to discuss it. Unfortunately, I ended up on largely NF boards which were not into theorizing on this stuff. (And it took a long while before they could even speak up and communicate this). One had a resident expert who could break down all the 8 archetypes of Beebe and all, but no one could wrap their mind around the apparently foreign FIRO scales. But I had come to see a very likely parallel, particularly in the Keriseyan temperament and Berens Interaction Styles model. Also, Enneagram is similar, with its so/sp/sx variants, and it seems a lot of people want to integrate Enneagram with MBTI.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    Finally, I don't think that Introversion/Extraversion really makes a strong correlation with assertiveness. One of my best friends is an INTJ who I would say is very assertive socially, but he also definitely needs and enjoys his alone time and chooses his friends wisely. He even has the tendency to interrupt others in group conversations when (I guess) he feels what he has to say is more important. In one-to-one conversations, he often does more of the talking, even if I am the more 'extraverted' one of the duo. TJ's tend to more dominant than FP's though.
    This makes sense if you consider the "pragmatism" (or "utilitarianism") of NT as a kind of expressiveness. (like "extraversion" is). The SP is like this as well, regardless of the I or E of the Interaction Style. This really seemed to be a great evidence of the comparison.

    With this correlation, I had expected my temperament mix to correspond to INTP, and it did seem to fit me a lot. But then others said I was too enthusiastic, and displayed too much Fi and Te, so that I was more like ENFP. Learning more on the functions from Berens' and others' books, I can see it is more likely, and that type did fit to some exent as well. I am just not as socially outgoing, inspiring, entrancing, etc. as the ENFP seems to be described. Yet I'm too enthusiastic to be an INFP. So it seems it may be the fifth temperament, which expresses as an introvert, yet "responds" as an extrovert, yet does not really fit in the four temperament systems, that is being picked up as both extraverted, and its overdriven "Feeling" preference overshadowing the Choleric influence, which would be more pragmatic and structure-focused. (i.e.NT'ish, though Keirsey correlated them differently)

    So that is another possible explanation. The type expert I mentioned had said she ran across a "boatload of ENFP's" who considered themselves introverts.
    The explanation given about Ne being different from the other extraverted functions was an interesting likelyhood too.

    All of this stuff is fascinating, and each model has its own unique perspective to offer. I'm really inspired by Linda Berens who also integrates several models.

    Eric

  2. #22
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    ENxPs are a curious blend of Extroverts, since they are often described as "shy". It's probably because of the overwhelming Ne...

    Anyway, most ENFPs will often have borderline results in the I-E scale. They usually score between 45-75% only.
    While their introverted brethren, the INFPs will rather score as very strong introverts, something like 0-30%.

    You have the same trend with ENTP/INTP, but the ENTPs seems very slightly more extroverted (50-80%).

    So don't worry. According to what you've said about you, and your Cognitive test (very low Si), you sound like a typical ENFP. That was quite obvious and I noticed you quickly figured it out.

    If ENFP's like books and being alone sometimes, it's normal. IMHO, It's healthy behaviour...
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

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  3. #23
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    I related to the ENFP profile even more than I could to the INTP profile. However, Keirsey doesn't differentiate between Introversion/Extraversion so much, thinking that it isn't important. Ideally, I would say that I am ambiverted. However, I am unsure. I am definitely energized by other people, but only those I really like. I can be social and can talk off the cuff with ease. If I am alone for too long, I get depressed. However, I often like my alone time to read, write stories, and post on forums such as this. I often need external validation to gain motivation to do things. I could relate to what an ENTP said about himself in a personality type book that he has many ideas but needs to talk about them with others to figure out which ones are worth working on and which ones aren't.

    I have never been afraid of meeting new people and my Introverted friends are amazed by my ability to just start a conversation so eagerly with people I never met before. I tend to handle myself well and am able to find common ground with people I meet. I often get people talking about themselves a lot, many I even mistook to be Extraverts but learned later on that they are definite Introverts. I am just 'easy to talk to'. I thought it was partially because I was so unassertive myself but learned that it may actually have been for the reverse that I was able to get others to get talking, since I often find myself asking them some interesting and thought-provoking questions.

    I have talked to someone about this and that person said that my 'introversion' is simply rooted from some insecurities I have about myself and that it is more destructive for me than it would be for a typical introvert and that is why I can seem withdrawn at times, that I am likely an extravert and not an introvert.

    What would you think from what I wrote?
    If anyone has any questions, feel free to ask.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    I'm not sure what I am yet.
    It all matters by why I feel that I am so unassertive in social situations.
    If it's from the fact that I am afraid that much of what I'm going to say will hurt other's feelings and cause conflict, so I choose to hold back and not show an 'assertive side', I could very well be an extrovert.
    If it's due to some sort of 'introversion', then I would most likely be an introvert.
    For now, I'm sticking to XNFP.

    I am energized by people who I enjoy being around and am not so bothered by the lack of alone time in college but find I need it to keep my grades up. However, while I definitely can hold my own in a group conversation, I find that I often get interrupted by more assertive personalities with ease (mostly Extraverted types) and I find I get annoyed with talking after the interruption, since I think what I had to say must have not been that important. Would an Extravert not care about such things? Would an Extravert just keep talking despite the interruption?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    This thread has convinced me that I am more extraverted than I thought I was. I am extremely energized by positive interactions for sure. I enjoy going to parties and having conversations with people, I've always found that 'small talk' can often be a way of getting into a deep conversation later on. I enjoy making new friends.

    From reading what other ENFP's say about how they deal with social interactions, I can relate to the 'fog of dullness'.. but I am never really in 'solitude'. I always have music going on. I'm always talking to someone online. I'm always on Facebook/MBTI Central/Other Forums. I think I may have mistaken extraversion for dependence. I can have a good time by myself. I'm an avid reader and writer and often take time alone to work on those hobbies. Being around people that I enjoy definitely makes me happy. As long as interactions are positive, I am very outgoing and enthusiastic. However, when there is a negative interaction, I either snap at the person with sarcasm, try to resolve the conflict diplomatically, or (especially if I don't know the person well) ignore them and don't say much to them.

    ENFP 4eva!
    I can so relate to all of that!
    (Had read it before, but was in the dentist's office waiting for my wife, and posted the ealier message from the mobile device).

    As I had mentioned above, the temperament system my wife works with has proposed a fifth temperament. The fifth temperament is sort of like a Behind the Scenes (Introverted, informing: ISF/INP), yet has more of a need for people, basically matching a Get Things Going. Yet he is very inhibited; even moreso than the BtS. However, alluding to what others have said, while the expressed behavior is what we say we are, the high need (responsiveness) is what we really are!

    So the introverted behavior might not be caused by "woundings" or "baggage", though such negative experiences will certainly "confirm" our social fears. The "insecurity" and "inconfidence" mentioned are themselves apart of the temperament. In our theory, what we normally call introversion is driven by an inborn fear of rejection. They lack confidence, and so avoid expressing to people. This is characteristic of the old Melancholic temperament, as well. Those with high needs for people (which would include the classic Sanguine temperament) also have this fear. The fifth temperament has both. They want to be included by others, but are afraid to initiate it. If they are in a group that they feel secure in, then they will be more expressive.

    To give my own experience, our theory describes the fifth temperament, called Supine, as needing to be personally invited to things, and being frustrated when nobody "reads their minds" and invites them. However, in the area of temperament involving decision making, I am the totally opposite Choleric, and this influences the social aspect, and adds another measure of expressiveness. So I myself will hope that someone will invite me, but if they don't, and I really want to be involved, the other part of my temperament will kick in, and I will invite myself. I know that people don't like this, so the social temperament (which wants to be accepted, and thus not annoy people) will restrain the other part of the temperament as well. I often am torn as to which way to go in such situations. It will depend on what the situation is, and which need is more important. However, the "personal" need does come out in my not liking larger, impersonal groups, such as a megachurch, over a smaller fellowship where everyone knows one another. I also generally prefer familiar old friends to meeting new people. I generally get nothing out of being in a group of people I don't know (though I might like just the idea of people being around). On the other hand, the Choleric aspect has driven me to go to great lengths to track down old friends and keep in contact, even over long distance. It's almost as if I use the high expressed behavior of the leadership temperament to fill in for the social expression I lack.

    On the other hand, if I'm engaged in a project (which ties to the Choleric drive) I may not want to be bothered with people, even if invited. Or sometimes, I will again be torn, or try to rush through it and catch the end of a social gathering. On the other hand, in places with people I do not know, like work, I will sit by myself like a true introvert, and hardly speak to anyone. Yet, I am meeting my other temperament need through my interests by going online on my mobile device, so I am happier not being bothered, again. But if I hear someone discussing something I am interested in, then, I will all of a sudden become outgoing and go and join in or add a comment, and sometimes even have much to say. That would meet both needs.


    So it seems that ENFP's are partly this fifth temperament, which is more inhibited, yet wanting interaction from people; and partly a more expressive temperament. That would explain the ambigouous I/E we are experiencing. The normal ENFP appears to be a blend of Sanguine with Supine. I have Choleric instead of Sanguine, and what this did was to make T/F ambiguous for me as well. This came up in a Expanded Analysis Report. So again; I initially identified more with INTP, which is Behind the Scenes also, but mixed with the tough-minded Rational.

    Both the Interaction Styles, as well as the SP/SJ/NT/NF groupings have been compared to the ancient temperaments. So actually, each of the 16 types is like a blend of temperaments, and will display aspects of both.

  4. #24
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    Over the past week, I have come to realize that I am probably an INFP over an ENFP. The reason for picking I over E is fairly simple. I realize that I am a lot more outgoing for one-on-one conversations than I am with group conversations. I have the natural tendency to stay quiet when I am in a large group, I have to work at being more talkative in that case and to be frank... talking to many people kind of wears me out. I think that classifies me as an Introvert. Thinking I was an ENFP was fun, but I think I am ready to say that I am an INFP.

  5. #25
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    I'm the same way (more outgoing with less people; more quiet in large crowds, and can get tired from them), but still, if you are "energized" by interaction, that is apparently interpreted as a kind of "extraversion". It seems as you said earlier, that extraversion is not [necessarily] "assertiveness". (though it often is).

  6. #26
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    It is strange. I am more energized by one-on-one conversations but not necessarily from talking in groups. I find that in large groups that I often have the tendency to get into a conversation with one or two people. I am fine in groups of three and four.. especially if I know the people really well but after that, I begin to find the interaction overwhelming.

  7. #27
    will make your day Carebear's Avatar
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    You sound like an INFP more than an ENFP. Close to the I/E border, but definitely I in my opinion.
    I have arms for a fucking reaosn, so come hold me. Then we'll fuvk! Whoooooh! - GZA

  8. #28
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    I'm dealing with the same dillema... I was sure I was INFP when I first came to MBTI, then I started wondering and decided I'm ENFP, then INFP again and I have no idea which one I actually am...

    You know, I love the external world, talking to people, I often get energized by action and people, but I can sometimes get overwhelmed... I love meeting new people, but one at a time please.

    Tests and descriptions don't help me very much, because I always get torn in between the two.

    I'm leaning more towards INFP these days, though. But I don't think I'll ever be sure about my type :\
    'Cause in the strange design of conscience
    We're controlled by a desire
    That can never be realized


    iNFP xL|U|aI 9w1 sx

  9. #29
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    I love meeting new people, but one at a time please.
    Sounds more I than E!

  10. #30
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    Yeah, plus I think I use Fi more than Ne

    What mistakes me greatly is how fast/open/crazy I can get, and I don't even have to try... Also I was much more of a Ne kid than Fi... (used a lot of Te back then, actually, but no way I'm a TJ)

    Yeah, I'll go towards INFP for now, I'll just re-read some descriptions first. Cheers!
    'Cause in the strange design of conscience
    We're controlled by a desire
    That can never be realized


    iNFP xL|U|aI 9w1 sx

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