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  1. #11
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    Hmm... I'm thinking INTJ enneagram 4w5 or 5w4, maybe? That would fit in with relating to melancholy...
    "I don't know a perfect person.
    I only know flawed people who are still worth loving."
    -John Green

  2. #12
    Honor Thy Inferior Such Irony's Avatar
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    Here's the supine stuff. Once again, I've bolded what's particularly true for me and italicized stuff that sorta fits.

    Inclusion: Supine

    Inclusion is the need to establish and maintain a satisfactory relationship with people in the area of surface relationships, association and socialization (parties, social gatherings, and people who come in and out of our lives every day).
    Inclusion asks two questions:

    1. How many people do I approach for socializing?
    2. How many people do I want to approach me for socializing?

    General description of people who are Supine in Inclusion:

    1. Is an extrovert although he/she appears to be an introvert (I've had several people tell me they're surprised that I claim to be an introvert)
    2. Approaches very few people for association and socialization, but wants to be approached by others for association and socialization
    3. Has indirect behavior -- looks like someone who doesn't want to socialize, when in fact he/she wants very much to socialize and is waiting for someone to initiate
    4. Is slow-paced -- works at a steady, slow pace and tends to lose momentum as the day progresses, requires a change of environment in order to "recharge" his/her energy
    5. Responds to both the threat of punishment and the promise of reward -- will change his/her actions in order to gain recognition and approval or to avoid negative consequences
    6. Highly responsive to emotional rewards such as recognition and acceptance -- also highly responsive to emotional punishments such as guilt, rejection and loss of recognition
    7. Suffers a great deal of anxiety if forced to be away from people often or for long periods of time (quite the opposite. More likely to suffer anxiety if I'm forced to be around people for long periods of time)

    Supine in Inclusion:
    Potential strengths which should be encouraged, used and developed:

    1. Is relationship-oriented -- relates well to people and can perform tasks very well as a means of establishing and maintaining relationships
    2. High intellectual capacities -- a thinker

    Supine in Inclusion:
    Potential weaknesses which should be considered and dealt with:

    1. Appears to be cold and withdrawn when in reality he/she is not -- it is simply a defense against the fear of rejection
    2. Becomes angry if not recognized for services performed
    3. Has strong fear of rejection -- when he/she feels rejected, insulted or offended, his/her anger is internalized, causing it to remain unresolved. This anger is referred to as "hurt feelings."
    4. Has low self esteem and constantly searches the environment for messages to reaffirm that he/she is not a valuable person
    5. May be moody -- mood swings respond to the environment: a change of environment will change his/her mood
    INtp
    5w6 or 9w1 sp/so/sx, I think
    Ravenclaw/Hufflepuff
    Neutral Good
    LII-Ne




  3. #13
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuchIrony View Post
    I've bolded the parts of choleric that particularly fit and italicized what partly fits.

    Control: Choleric

    Control asks two questions:


    1. How many people do I want to control?
    2. How many people will I allow to control me?

    General description of people who are Choleric in Control:


    1. Extremely independent.
    2. When undertaking a task, he/she wants complete control over it, tolerating very little interference from other people.
    3. Must have a great deal of control over the lives and behaviors of other people, but will tolerate almost no control over his/her life and behavior.
    4. Very strong willed.
    5. Must receive recognition for accomplishments.

    Choleric Control
    potential strengths which should be encouraged, used and developed:



    1. Makes quick, intuitive decisions.
    2. Very good leadership capabilities -- the number of decisions and responsibilities this person is capable of handling would make other temperaments cringe.
    3. Very confident in his/her abilities.
    4. Willing to take on leadership role, to solve problems and move forward.

    Choleric Control
    Potential weaknesses which should be considered and dealt with:
    (Reminder: Cholerics have a very hard time admitting they might be wrong, so it is difficult for them to consider their weaknesses.)



    1. Very controlling (may be bossy.)
    2. Highly susceptible to burn out because of overload.
    3. Capable of undertaking very poor behaviors in order to maintain control of others -- such as intimidation, yelling, etc.
    4. May associate with people who can be dominated and then end up resenting their weakness
    5. Perfectionist -- highly critical of self and others, especially when his/her perfectionistic standards are not realized.
    6. Externalizes his/her anger and uses it to lash out at others.
    7. May have a cruel, abusive temper -- becomes angry if controlled, told what to do, or if someone interferes with his independence.


    Overall choleric doesn't fit me that well. I could care less about controlling others and I'm pretty even tempered. I don't seek leadership but can be a good leader when the situation entails it.
    Well, the Supine on the social level greatly tempers the Choleric, so since you will be slow to approach people (on the surface social level) to begin with, then the more aggressive Control behaviors will be greatly toned down. (The Choleric in Control descriptions would go along most typically with Choleric in Inclusion. These profiles are based on pure temperament combos). This seems to happen with most INTP's who select from these profiles.

    But it's the key strong will, control over your one's own tasks, perfectionism and independence that still come through, and match the NT preference (You can even see this stuff in Keirsey's descriptions).

    Quote Originally Posted by SuchIrony View Post
    Here's the supine stuff. Once again, I've bolded what's particularly true for me and italicized stuff that sorta fits.

    Inclusion: Supine

    Inclusion is the need to establish and maintain a satisfactory relationship with people in the area of surface relationships, association and socialization (parties, social gatherings, and people who come in and out of our lives every day).
    Inclusion asks two questions:

    1. How many people do I approach for socializing?
    2. How many people do I want to approach me for socializing?

    General description of people who are Supine in Inclusion:

    1. Is an extrovert although he/she appears to be an introvert (I've had several people tell me they're surprised that I claim to be an introvert)
    2. Approaches very few people for association and socialization, but wants to be approached by others for association and socialization
    3. Has indirect behavior -- looks like someone who doesn't want to socialize, when in fact he/she wants very much to socialize and is waiting for someone to initiate
    4. Is slow-paced -- works at a steady, slow pace and tends to lose momentum as the day progresses, requires a change of environment in order to "recharge" his/her energy
    5. Responds to both the threat of punishment and the promise of reward -- will change his/her actions in order to gain recognition and approval or to avoid negative consequences
    6. Highly responsive to emotional rewards such as recognition and acceptance -- also highly responsive to emotional punishments such as guilt, rejection and loss of recognition
    7. Suffers a great deal of anxiety if forced to be away from people often or for long periods of time (quite the opposite. More likely to suffer anxiety if I'm forced to be around people for long periods of time)

    Supine in Inclusion:
    Potential strengths which should be encouraged, used and developed:

    1. Is relationship-oriented -- relates well to people and can perform tasks very well as a means of establishing and maintaining relationships
    2. High intellectual capacities -- a thinker

    Supine in Inclusion:
    Potential weaknesses which should be considered and dealt with:

    1. Appears to be cold and withdrawn when in reality he/she is not -- it is simply a defense against the fear of rejection
    2. Becomes angry if not recognized for services performed
    3. Has strong fear of rejection -- when he/she feels rejected, insulted or offended, his/her anger is internalized, causing it to remain unresolved. This anger is referred to as "hurt feelings."
    4. Has low self esteem and constantly searches the environment for messages to reaffirm that he/she is not a valuable person
    5. May be moody -- mood swings respond to the environment: a change of environment will change his/her mood
    So 1-5 you have italicized for "partly true". In which way do they not fit? Too "wanting", or not "expressive" enough?
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  4. #14
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcontent View Post
    Thanks Eric,
    I read all the "Inclusion reports" and it's difficult choose for sure which apply me the most. Many reports have a lot of similitude.
    But I could say that I see myself a lot in the description with melancholy-association.
    Maybe the first one is "Phlegmatic/Melancholy".
    But it depends for the situation, I can see myself also in "Melancholy" and "Melancholy/Phlegmatic"
    Thanks, bye.
    Well then, it looks like some sort of Chart the Course type (IST or INJ).
    Now, you could check Control, and that would give a likely complete type. Does Choleric in Control fit you? That would suggest INTJ. (and they do usually fit Melancholy-Choleric).
    After that, we could also look into functions.
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric B View Post
    Well then, it looks like some sort of Chart the Course type (IST or INJ).
    Now, you could check Control, and that would give a likely complete type. Does Choleric in Control fit you? That would suggest INTJ. (and they do usually fit Melancholy-Choleric).
    After that, we could also look into functions.
    In Control Reports I can be a mixture maybe of "Phlegmatic-Choleric" and "Melancholy-Phlegmatic"
    In Affection Reports (as for Inclusion Reports) maybe a mixture between "Melancholy-Phlegmatic" and "Phlegmatic-Melancholy"

  6. #16
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Well, Phlegmatic-Choleric in Control would certainly go along with NT. Melancholy-Phlegmatic is between Melancholy and Supine (SJ/NF), do you mean Phlegmatic-Melancholy (which is next to Phlegmatic-Choleric)?

    Affection does not necessarily correspond to type; but in your case, it would go along with Inclusion, and further point to CtC.

    So it looks like INTJ to me. Melancholy-Phlegmatic in Control would suggest ISTJ or INFJ, but you don't seem to be an S or an F from what I gather.

    And you did start off asking about I/E, so that should be clearly a definite I, though maybe with some moderate expressiveness.

    Would you identify with an introverted iNtuition dominance? (Of course, the dominant function orientation also tells you your I/E preference).
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric B View Post
    Well, Phlegmatic-Choleric in Control would certainly go along with NT. Melancholy-Phlegmatic is between Melancholy and Supine (SJ/NF), do you mean Phlegmatic-Melancholy (which is next to Phlegmatic-Choleric)?
    Yes, you're right I mean Phlegmatic-Melancholy, but the first maybe is "Phlegmatic-Choleric" and in some particular situation with people very close and for important things I can be very controlling, like "Choleric/Phlegmatic".

    Would you identify with an introverted iNtuition dominance? (Of course, the dominant function orientation also tells you your I/E preference).
    In tests based on functions I am Ni dominant:
    See those results in last december:

    ----------------------------------

    Keys2cognition test:


    extraverted Sensing (Se) ************** (14.4)
    unused
    introverted Sensing (Si) ************************************* (37.7)
    excellent use
    extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ********************************* (33.5)
    good use
    introverted Intuiting (Ni) **************************************** (40.5)
    excellent use
    extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************************* (33.7)
    good use
    introverted Thinking (Ti) ******************************* (31.5)
    good use
    extraverted Feeling (Fe) ******************* (19.5)
    limited use
    introverted Feeling (Fi) ***************************** (29.4)
    average use


    Summary Analysis of Profile
    By focusing on the strongest configuration of cognitive processes, your pattern of responses most closely matches individuals of this type: INTJ

    If these cognitive processes don't fit well then consider these types: ENTJ, or ISTJ
    -------------------------------

    Team Technology test:


    This table suggests that your preferences are most likely to be for INTJ or INTP.

    INTJ - 85%
    INTP - 76%

    If your personality type is INTJ then you have a strong, private sense of strategic vision, both for the future and how that future will can be achieved. Your vision, or sense of knowing, may be difficult to articulate, but even if wasn't others might find it difficult to accept (e.g.: as impractical or unrealistic). Pursuing your vision might be a lonely task, therefore, as you develop and pursue plans without anyone else really understanding the nature of what you are trying to achieve.

    If your personality type is INTP then you have a strong sense of the hidden principles that govern how the world works. You are interested in theoretical models and explanations, and when other people put forward their own theories you put them to the test to find out how true or robust they are. You enjoy solving difficult intellectual problems and seek to understand the real truth behind any situation, even when it involves several complex factors.

    Function Attitude Scores
    Ni 27
    Ti 25
    Te 22
    Si 21
    Ne 14
    Fi 13
    Fe 10
    Se 8

    Your mental muscle diagram suggests:

    * your dominant function is iNtuition and very introverted
    * your auxiliary (second most important) is Thinking and slightly introverted
    * your tertiary (third) is Feeling and slightly introverted
    * your inferior (fourth) is Sensation and very introverted
    -------------------------

    As I said, in tests based on 4-letters I result often INTP because of some P "quality": some laziness, procrastination and change my goals in personal long-term career/life wishes.

    Thanks.

  8. #18
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    So by all counts, it looks like INTJ (with the one anomaly being such strong Si. But there are numerous Forer effects in that first test; so just as long as Ni and Te are strong).
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric B View Post
    So by all counts, it looks like INTJ (with the one anomaly being such strong Si. But there are numerous Forer effects in that first test; so just as long as Ni and Te are strong).
    Many thanks for all your suggestions, Eric.
    Bye.

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