What type is Zarathustra? :)

[Ginkgo]

He does push. I notice that he doesn't have the apprehensiveness to clam up and be absorbed in his think-tank like many Ni dominants do. I think most introverts in general grind that introverted axe until they're ready to cleave with it in the extraverted world. "Thinking before saying" would be introverted, while "saying before thinking" would be extraverted. As a result, you may see that many introverts on these forums have the tendency to pock discussions with little frequency, but with great depth, refinement, and focus. On the other hand, extraverts push the envelope with more frequency, less premeditation, and more breadth. This, of course, has many exceptions, and Z might be one of these exceptions. I think that if he is an INTJ, than his Te Se axis is akin to Jaguar's, and his introversion is only moderate. I have seen him delve deeply with the Ni "flippy paradox shift dolphin", as I like to call it, but he keeps laying down his opinion far after his introverted side has flaked off. I picture him as a fighter, just like I picture Jaguar. Someone who's always ready to shout their opinion from the highest mountaintops (in reality, it's a roof top, but don't tell Them that).

And yes, he does kick bootay, while squeezing the other.

 

[Zarathustra]

I've though entj since nearly the beginning, but I've thought better of saying something, because I think it's perceived as rude to question openly another person's type. I definitely feel the Ni, which I like. When he started the thread about functions and wanted to develop a system of identifying function order, it was funny to me and so N/T-T/N; it's what I was in the middle of trying to do as well (when I was in my strong T mode).

But as I watched that thread, and other threads he started, unfurl, it seemed that he would usually digress to some sort of Te explanation when backed in to a corner or threatened. I felt/saw the Ni yield to Te in enough situations that, combined with his extraverted posting style, I naturally started feeling like he was really an entj. I guess he could be an intj who's just pushing his Ni beyond its normal limits, but in that case, Ni should be his dominant function and should pervade his posts, visibly or invisibly. I just don't get that as much. Ni considers quietly more than it pushes. Z pushes.

I'd bet his Te and Ni are maybe both well developed and hence the extraverted Te shows forth when he wants to muscle an idea forth. I just don't feel excessive amounts of Ni there (which means he has more than a righteous amount of Te, btw ) is all.

There are several other "intjs" on here who aren't, imo. I don't know about other Ni doms, but just as with Fe/Fi doms (because I use Fe), it's easy for me to tell who is Ni dominant and who isn't on here. The forum is an interesting medium because it shaves off all but the two main functions of someone more so than irl, so that you get a flatter picture of them and over time, you really get a good sense of a person's type. It's bullshit on here when people say that a viewer can "only see the extraverted function more strongly" and I guess it's a throwback to mbti rote lingo. Perhaps that's true for many, but I can see a dominant irrational on here over time pretty clearly; just because a dominant function is irrational doesn't mean it isn't obvious or visible (and I suspect Isabell felt like it was not as obvious because she herself was a dominant rational being infp, and lived with a dominant irrational istj).

Having said all that, I think instinctual variants make a big difference on how you come off as well, more so in person, but on here too. I'd be curious to know Z's stacking. He could be an entj sp/sx and therefore come off more introverted, or he could be intj sx/so and come off more extraverted.

Good post.

I still side with Highlander on the issue of Je function being more readily apparent than the Pi function, if you assume all else is equal.

The less equal, and the more this skews towards the Pi function, the less this should be the case, but I think the Je function can still be more apparent than the Pi function, even if it's relatively weaker, too. In many ways, as you pointed out, it's not even just the relative balance between the two that matters, but how developed the Je function is on an absolute basis.

I have no idea what this sp/sx and sx/so business means... been seeing it all over the place since I got back...

 

[Zarathustra]

Sweet... 7 n 7...

My favorite drink.

 

[Zarathustra]

(note: one of the ENTJ votes is in error, as the voter thought the OP was about the historical, mythological and/or fictional character)

 

[Ginkgo]

Z, I'm going to be honest - it is forum etiquette to merge your thoughts into one post until someone else posts, at which point you may choose to respond. Otherwise, you're needlessly bumping a thread and filling up the intertubes with extra post scripts. Save the whales. Reduce post emissions.

 

[Zarathustra]

Z, I'm going to be honest - it is forum etiquette to merge your thoughts into one post until someone else posts, at which point you may choose to respond. Otherwise, you're needlessly bumping a thread and filling up the intertubes with extra post scripts. Save the whales. Reduce post emissions.

But what if it's a completely separate thought, that comes after I write the previous post?

That rule is completely Nazi, and Ni+Fi will have none of it.

 

[Night]

Sweet... 7 n 7...

My favorite drink.

My vote counts for more, as it is unavoidably correct.


Your answer, ladies and gentlemen, is INTJ.

 

[Forever_Jung]

I definitely think he is an INTJ, I just think he is a slightly rarer kind. If he isn't an 8, he is most certainly a sexual subtype because he is a very assertive introvert. I would still bet he is an 8 even if a counterphobic six type is possible. Most INTJ's are 5's so naturally INTJ 8's can come across as ENTJish in comparison. I hope Zarathustra doesn't smite me, but I should mention he seems to make enemies with his forceful posting style. Also, Silly who has some authority on the topic of his personality (Not as much as Z, but still) commented:

But I think Zara slips into ETJ mode when he's stressed out and that, in my opinion, is when he is not in top form, so he tends to unleash a Te MonsTErrrrr!!!

it's berrry scarrry.

and also:

You have a tendency to act childish and retaliatory when you feel, mayhaps... threatened/hurt/angry by others who might know as much or more than you

This fits in with the combative, low-frustration threshold of type 8's. That being said, I don't have a problem with his strong presence at all (I am an INFP, phobic 6 so I don't mind deferring to others at all), but I notice some people feel antagonized by him for one reason or another. I am sure they are justified.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

My vote counts for more, as it is unavoidably correct.


Your answer, ladies and gentlemen, is INTJ.

This from someone who struggled excessively with typing himself. :rolli:

edit: Also, Te dom explains mo bettah Z's apparent lack of Fe.

Z: go to here and see what your subtype is (it's the stacking thing. It will tell you one, but you can glean an idea of the next one from how many of the other subtype results you get)

 

[ragashree]

But what if it's a completely separate thought, that comes after I write the previous post?

That rule is completely Nazi, and Ni+Fi will have none of it.

However Te needs to consider the following line of reasoning:

A logical future consequence of this is that other forumites/the mods are likely to be annoyed by it as being against their conception of forum etiquette. It's therefore predictable that you're likely to draw negative attention for this regardless of the actual content of your posts. Since this is commonly categoried by others as trollish behaviour or a violation of forum etiquette (particularly if already warned about it) it will be taken as corroboratory evidence that you are trolling or deliberately provoking people by anyone who otherwise becomes offended by anything you say or do; and also by the mods if they are contemplating any kind of action in response to their taking offense.

If the criticism and negative attention relates entirely to the content of your posts, a style of interaction or line of argument may be rationally defended, while the breaking of forum etiquette may not. The argument will simply be that you were warned, and chose to ignore it, therefore it is proof that you were willfully disruptive on the forum. On the other hand, nothing is actually gained from posting like this, besides the feeling that you are breaking rules which you consider arbitrary. You could therefore increase the likelihood of earning future infractions/bannings merely for posting in this way and quite regardless of any argument you actually make, due to the negative effect it has on others' perceptions of you.

How's that

 

[Night]

This from someone who struggled excessively with typing himself. :rolli:

edit: Also, Te dom explains mo bettah Z's apparent lack of Fe.

Z: go to here and see what your subtype is (it's the stacking thing. It will tell you one, but you can glean an idea of the next one from how many of the other subtype results you get)

Yeah. . . struggled.

 

[JustHer]

The reason why I know he is an introvert is that I've seen him interact with people with whom he's not comfortable/acquainted with, and he will either be shy/quiet/reserved, or have an affected way of socializing. (Obviously, this doesn't apply when he's drunk ).

This doesn't happen with natural born extroverts, new people don't scare us, (hahaa, usually, that is ), and we are very go with the flow and natural in our social dance with strangers, such is not the same with introverts.

That's not true at all.

 

[Ginkgo]

That's not true at all.

Your devotion for truth is charming. But it's so easy to pinpoint a falsehood, and so hard to perfect the truth. WHY CRUEL WORLD? WHY??? :workout:

 

[JustHer]

Your devotion for truth is charming. But it's so easy to pinpoint a falsehood, and so hard to perfect the truth. WHY CRUEL WORLD? WHY??? :workout:

There, there, little potato. *pats head*

 

[SillySapienne]

That's not true at all.

Okay, explain why, preeze.

( Also, please realize I was talking about non-mbti introversion/extroversion)

On another note, great responses, guys!

IRL I think his Ni and Te are pretty balanced, and when he's stressed he totally becomes/morphs into/embodies a Te monster, a bulldozer.



And, I think that more often than not, he flexes and "flaunts" his Te skillz on the forums.

Ha!

Never in a million years would I ever imagine myself to be with a Te dom.

I absolutely LOATHE being bulldozed.

Depending on the person, I usually prefer the expression/exhibition of the introverted functions more so than their extroverted counterparts.

Te, Fe, and Se doms I can have trouble jiving with, granted I can have trouble jiving with anybody, but there is a distinct pattern where I find myself overwhelmed by, especially Te and Fe doms.

This is not their problem, it's mine. I just like things to be chill, and with Fe, I'm sensitive to the emotional intensity and with Te doms, I'm sensitive to their hard-headed, bulldozing.

I digress.

I actually don't think Zara is an enneagram 8, though to be fair, I've only read up on Fours, Fives, and Eights.

He's certainly not a 4 or a 5, and at first I thought he was an 8, but now that I know him better, I definitely think that he's not.

Bay suggested he was a 6, and from what I glanced on wiki

Sixes
Characteristic role: The Loyalist[12]
Ego fixation: Cowardice[13]
Holy idea: Faith[14]
Basic Fear: To be without a support system in an unforgiving world[22]
Basic Desire: To feel safe[22]
Temptation: To question the intentions of everyone around them
Vice/Passion: Fear[16]
Virtue: Courage[17]
Stress/Disintegration point: Three. Paranoid and anxious Sixes may try to win over others, like unhealthy Threes, to cover up their anxiety
Security/Integration point: Nine. Positive Sixes may become more peaceful, open and receptive like healthy Nines

Six seems to describe him pretty well, it resonates the most out of all nine.



Anyhow, carry on.

Oh, also, aphrodite mentioned something about getting/reading/seeing Ni from a poster, and not.

And, I would agree with her in her assessment, even though I am not an Ni user, I sure as shit can spot it when I see it.

And I think more than less of Zara's posts clearly resonate a Te trademark as opposed to an Ni one.

But, irl, I definitely see, firsthand, his Ni-ness.

 

[JustHer]

Okay, explain why, preeze.

( Also, please realize I was talking about non-mbti introversion/extroversion)

Whats there to explain? Extraverts aren't exactly by definition comfortable around everyone. We can still get scared of new people or awkward around certain types of peopel or certain situations. As for the "go with the flow" and "natural in social interactions with strangers" parts, I hardly think that would apply to ETJs quite as much as EFPs. And if you weren't talking about MBTI introversion/extraversion, then why were you using it to explain why in MBTI he would be an introvert

 

[teslashock]

ENTJ

 

[Thalassa]

That's not true at all.

Yep, I'm gonna have to agree with JJ. I've always been able to get on stage, charm people in job interviews or when waiting tables, and I've been pretty damn outspoken since I was about 12 or 13 years old (very shy before that), but I'm not necessarily extremely comfortable with strangers, in fact sometimes keep my distance because I have to have space and don't just automatically feel comfortable with everyone. In fact, I get strong feelings of like or dislike often with people, actually. I can be very personable, can talk your ear off, and will volunteer to speak in front of a group, but I am not just a go with the flow hang out with everybody person. Far from the truth, which is why I initially thought I was an introvert.

I think SS may be a more extroverted extrovert, maybe?

 

[PeaceBaby]

K my real vote, rather than silly posts:

ENTJ, close on the E / I, close on the S / N.

 

[Lethe]

Whats there to explain? Extraverts aren't exactly by definition comfortable around everyone. We can still get scared of new people or awkward around certain types of peopel or certain situations. As for the "go with the flow" and "natural in social interactions with strangers" parts, I hardly think that would apply to ETJs quite as much as EFPs. And if you weren't talking about MBTI introversion/extraversion, then why were you using it to explain why in MBTI he would be an introvert

[...] Dominant Ni or Te. There's a big difference and I'd think it would be obvious and you would know this better than us.

Kudos to these posts.

I think there's a confusion between MBTI extroversion, and ordinary extroversion. MBTI extroversion means that you focus on the stimuli around the object, either by actively organizing (Je) or perceiving (Pe) them, leading to greater breadth. Introversion (Pi; Ji) selects a particular focus, which then becomes the "object", and seeks to understand the insides in greater depth. Sometimes, Pi/Ji can be seen as narrow-minded, whereas Pe/Je are criticized for not paying enough attention to the inner nuances.

Ordinary extroversion that is relative to perceived energy, on the other hand, explains very little how this occurs. FDG, HTB, and Lark are some of the ENTJs who aren't the conspicuous, "Hurrah!" gladiator-types at all. They're very low-key and calm in energy; in fact, some of the introverts here are more interactive than they are. But the thing they have in common with ENTJs is a preference for 'objectively' organizing the environment before all else. You can see this in their posts: it's sharp, to the point, and rarely contains multiple hidden tangents. If things get messy, they sort them out Je-style.

Compare this habit to someone like Antisocial One, Kalach, or even Lex Talionis who are inclined to express ideas like, "Hypothetically" or "It could be true... in theory". A significant disorganization and uncertainty of the Pi, in contrast to Je, are evident right on the spot. Whenever Z gets into a debate, he does have a tendency to bulldoze individuals (an Enneagram 8/sexual quirk) who disagree with him, yet his processing style remains suggestive, and often skips around from a minor idea to another. His refusal to let in conflicting information is more akin to the Ni-Dom one, when they're stressed, or overwhelmed by the amount of raw data they already have. Ni desires to establish a comprehensive meaning before they can categorize them, and this has been a reoccurring theme in Z's posts.