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....I'm sorry I have to do this....INTJ or INFJ?

highlander

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Neither INTJ nor INFJ. Those were possibilities suggested by other people that you're running with to see how they work out.

INFP.

Why anyone would want to be INTJ...

Just quickly revisiting here. The one thing I did see evidence of is Fi in all of the above, so dominant Fi makes sense. Besides, J seems perhaps more decisive.

The snag is that Serge said he doesn't really identify with Se or Ne. Maybe that should be rethought. In either case, having good understanding of the functions would help.
 

Serge

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Neither INTJ nor INFJ. Those were possibilities suggested by other people that you're running with to see how they work out.

INFP.




Why anyone would want to be INTJ...

INFP?....I can see INFJ, I can see INTJ, I can even slightly see INFP, but I can't really see INFP. With that being said, if anyone thinks that I'm neither of these types, I'd like to know what type you truly think I am. Anyways, what's your reasoning for INFP?

My attention span only lasted for 2 pages, but you sound like you don't want to be an INFJ. Which, I hate to say, isn't the most T-ish thing. A typologically confused INTJ would simply want to put ALL the facts out there and get the truth. The way you're trying to subtly promote yourself as an INTJ indicates a subjective slant to your self-analysis, which goes against what T's generally do/stand for.

INFJs rock. INFJs roll. If it's the "badass genius" INTJ stereotype you're after, INFJ is the same thing, except maybe a little broodier.

This isn't my first exercise in futility nor is this the first time I've seriously thought about my type. I can't put all the facts out there for the simple reasons that I don't know which facts are wholly relevant to my thinking patterns, I've tried to put the most relevant information in this thread without bogging it down with useless and inane details. To me, I have a slant towards INTJ because the functions make more sense to me (I 'know' I make contingency plans and I don't feel the need to care for people and notice the relationships between people and the breaches they may commit. My values are most important to me, foremost. I don't expect others to live by them) and the stereotypes of being an INTJ fits me more, quantity wise and easily, than the INFJ stereotypes in which I kinda have to finagle with.

Alas, if I wanted to be the "badass genius" then I could've just lied to myself and acted in a manner that would seem like a "badass." A badass doesn't need validation from others, right?
 

Little_Sticks

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You're not either types.

You're an ENTJ. I AM NOT WRONG ON THIS.

You have a stubborn streak evidenced in this thread that shows you only value what can be considered an objective evidence of fact. And you have stated it in your video.

You see Fe as a means to an end. It's something that gets you things in society, not something that is valued for itself. You have developed and use it but you have it made it very clear it is not your preferred or natural way of dealing with and looking at things. ENTJs are often good with Fe like an ENFJ, but are not nearly as versatile and tire from it being a focus, which it is clearly not here.

There are other reasons, but I'm not going to waste my time if you are going to ignore this anyway.

You are an ENTJ

And by ignoring this, you only server to further prove my point.
 

highlander

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I've been told that I'm warm and sympathetic. I do care about peoples. I want to help people. And I do show my love through actions, not words, if it's my choice. (Some people have a certain love language, y'know?)

Well, part of the problem is that youngish INTJs don't generally say things like this. Even an older INTJ might be considered compassionate but not exactly warm and sympathetic.

Rather than look at an overall type descriptions and try and to fit into one of the boxes or look at short but misleading function definitions, I think it is better to get certainty around function attitude preferences and order of priority. That's really what the assessments attempt to do. What were your results of those?
 

Kalach

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INFP?....I can see INFJ, I can see INTJ, I can even slightly see INFP, but I can't really see INFP. With that being said, if anyone thinks that I'm neither of these types, I'd like to know what type you truly think I am. Anyways, what's your reasoning for INFP?

My reasoning is you want to see other people's reasoning.

And there isn't enough accurate matching of image to profile in this whole thread to justify anything. Thus, INFP.


It's actually a rule of thumb when considering the dichotomies: wherever there is no clear preference, err on the side of INFP.
 

Serge

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Well, part of the problem is that youngish INTJs don't generally say things like this. Even an older INTJ might be considered compassionate but not exactly warm and sympathetic.

Rather than look at an overall type descriptions and try and to fit into one of the boxes or look at short but misleading function definitions, I think it is better to get certainty around function attitude preferences and order of priority. That's really what the assessments attempt to do. What were your results of those?

My results of my tests have largely been INTJ but, of course, I've taken a few cognitive function tests so...here they are

Introverted Intuiting (Ni) ******************************************* (43.6)
Introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************************* (37.4)
Extraverted Thinking (Te) *********************************** (35.3)
Extraverted Sensing (Se) ******************************* (31.2)
Extraverted Feeling (Fe) **************************** (28.6)
Introverted Thinking (Ti)*************************(25.9)
Extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ********************* (21.1)
introverted Sensing (Si) ***************** (17.3)
~~~
extraverted Sensing (Se) *********************************** (35.6)
introverted Sensing (Si)
************** (14.3)
extraverted Intuiting (Ne)
*********************** (23.4)
introverted Intuiting (Ni)
****************************************** (42.7)
extraverted Thinking (Te)
**************************** (28.4)
introverted Thinking (Ti) ************************* (25.3)
extraverted Feeling (Fe) *********************************** (35.6)
introverted Feeling (Fi) ********************************** (34.7)
~~~
Introverted Intuition (Ni) ************************************************** (50.6)
Introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************************** (38.3)
Extraverted Thinking (Te) ******************************* (31.1)
Extraverted Sensing (Se) ****************************** (30)
Introverted Thinking (Ti) **************************** (28.9)
Extraverted Feeling (Fe)
************************ (24.3)
Extraverted Intuition(Ne) *********************** (23.2)
Introverted Sensing (Si) ************* (13.8)
~~~
Extraverted Sensing (Se) ************************************ (36.4)
Introverted Sensing (Si)
************* (13.2)
Extraverted Intuiting (Ne)
************************** (26.6)
Introverted Intuiting (Ni) ************************************************ (48.)
Extraverted Thinking (Te)
************************************** (38.6)
Introverted Thinking (Ti)
********************** (22.2)
Extraverted Feeling (Fe)
********************* (21.5)
Introverted Feeling (Fi)
*************************************** (39.8)

Little_Sticks: I'm listening, go on. Aren't ENTJs colder than INTJs, though?
Kalach: Lol. Interesting. Hmm, though, I thought that INFP would hate the idea of being placed in a box, I thought Fi was all about defining things for the self instead of seeking external things to adhere too.
 

Kalach

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From People Types and Tiger Stripes

Choose a side, any side, but only one side. You will recognise aspects from both sides, but one side should stand out over the other:

E or I

E likes action and variety.
I likes time and quiet to consider things.

E likes to do mental work by talking to people.
I likes to do mental work privately before talking.

E acts quickly, sometimes without much reflection.
I may be slow to try something without understanding it first.

E likes to see how other people do a job, and likes to see results.
I likes to understand the idea of a job, and to work alone or with just a few people.

E wants to know what other people expect of him or her.
I wants to set his or her own standards.

S or N

S pays most attention to experience as it is.
N pays attention to the meaning of facts and how they fit together.

S likes to use eyes and ears and other senses to find out what’s happening.
N likes to use imagination to come up with new ways to do things, new possibilities.

S dislikes new problems unless earlier experience shows how to solve them.
N likes solving new problems and dislikes doing the same thing over and over.

S enjoys using skills already learned more than learning new ones.
N likes using new skills more than practicing old ones.

S is patient with details but impatient when the details get complicated.
N is impatient with details but doesn’t mind complicated situations.

T or F

T likes to decide things using logic.
F likes to decide things using personal feelings and human values.

T wants to be treated with justice and fair play.
F likes praise, and likes to please people, even in small matters.

T may forget and hurt other people’s feelings without knowing it.
F is usually very aware of other people’s feelings.

T gives more attention to ideas or things than to human relationships.
F can predict how others will feel.

T can get along with little harmony.
F values harmony; feels unsettled by arguments and conflicts.

J or P

J likes to make a plan, to have things settled and decided ahead.
P likes to stay flexible and avoid fixed plans.

J tries to make things come out the way they “ought to be”.
P deals easily with unplanned and unexpected happenings.

J likes to finish one project before starting another.
P likes to start many projects but may have trouble finishing them all.

J usually has mind made up.
P is usually looking for new information.

J may decide things too quickly.
P may decide things too slowly.

J wants to be right.
P wants to miss nothing.

J lives by standards and schedules that are not easily changed.
P lives by making changes to deal with problems as they come along.
 

Serge

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From People Types and Tiger Stripes

Choose a side, any side, but only one side. You will recognise aspects from both sides, but one side should stand out over the other:

E or I

E likes action and variety.
I likes time and quiet to consider things.

E likes to do mental work by talking to people.
I likes to do mental work privately before talking.

E acts quickly, sometimes without much reflection.
I may be slow to try something without understanding it first.

E likes to see how other people do a job, and likes to see results.
I likes to understand the idea of a job, and to work alone or with just a few people.

E wants to know what other people expect of him or her.
I wants to set his or her own standards.

S or N

S pays most attention to experience as it is.
N pays attention to the meaning of facts and how they fit together.

S likes to use eyes and ears and other senses to find out what’s happening.
N likes to use imagination to come up with new ways to do things, new possibilities.

S dislikes new problems unless earlier experience shows how to solve them.
N likes solving new problems and dislikes doing the same thing over and over.

S enjoys using skills already learned more than learning new ones.
N likes using new skills more than practicing old ones.

S is patient with details but impatient when the details get complicated.
N is impatient with details but doesn’t mind complicated situations.

T or F

T likes to decide things using logic.
F likes to decide things using personal feelings and human values.

T wants to be treated with justice and fair play.
F likes praise, and likes to please people, even in small matters.

T may forget and hurt other people’s feelings without knowing it.
F is usually very aware of other people’s feelings.

T gives more attention to ideas or things than to human relationships.
F can predict how others will feel.

T can get along with little harmony.
F values harmony; feels unsettled by arguments and conflicts.

J or P

J likes to make a plan, to have things settled and decided ahead.
P likes to stay flexible and avoid fixed plans.

J tries to make things come out the way they “ought to be”.
P deals easily with unplanned and unexpected happenings.

J likes to finish one project before starting another.
P likes to start many projects but may have trouble finishing them all.

J usually has mind made up.
P is usually looking for new information.

J may decide things too quickly.
P may decide things too slowly.

J wants to be right.
P wants to miss nothing.

J lives by standards and schedules that are not easily changed.
P lives by making changes to deal with problems as they come along.


So, INFJ. I'm pretty sure about introvert. Positive about the answers I selected for intuition. I had a hard time picking an answer to the 5th question but then I finally remembered one time when my parents (fairly aggressively, mind you, but no harder than they usually do) and I flipped out. I felt like utter crap and I wanted them to stop fighting, but alas, you can't tell your parents to stop dealing with their grown up problems so the next thing I wanted was out. Fairly positive about J (Kinda surprised I got so many P answers)

Anyways, I tried to be completely truthful, I thought through all my answers and reasonings
 

Kalach

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Actually the layout of that bunch of likes statements is a bit misleading. If the BB code were available to make tables, I would have, and "side" would have meant dichotomy side. One doesn't have to agree with every, for example, "P likes" statement to feel that overall P stands out, nor disagree with every "T likes" statement to choose F, and so on. The idea is, which side stands out. Maybe, for example, does just one "N likes" statement seem to sum everything up? And so on like that. The overall gestalt.

And it's worth working out what one is referring to when one chooses one like statement over another. So, for example:

J may decide things too quickly.
P may decide things too slowly.

J wants to be right.
P wants to miss nothing.

How are those two bolded statements to be reconciled. If you decide quickly, you'll miss out whatever the other choice would have offered, so what is it of "nothing" that you don't want to miss? Alternatively, what is it that you decide too quickly? (And, for example, do you say you may decide too quickly precisely because you don't want to miss anything and you think you might if you make any decision... indicating P preference, not J.)

And so on.
 

Serge

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Actually the layout of that bunch of likes statements is a bit misleading. If the BB code were available to make tables, I would have, and "side" would have meant dichotomy side. One doesn't have to agree with every, for example, "P likes" statement to feel that overall P stands out, nor disagree with every "T likes" statement to choose F, and so on. The idea is, which side stands out. Maybe, for example, does just one "N likes" statement seem to sum everything up? And so on like that. The overall gestalt.

And it's worth working out what one is referring to when one chooses one like statement over another. So, for example:



How are those two bolded statements to be reconciled. If you decide quickly, you'll miss out whatever the other choice would have offered, so what is it of "nothing" that you don't want to miss? Alternatively, what is it that you decide too quickly? (And, for example, do you say you may decide too quickly precisely because you don't want to miss anything and you think you might if you make any decision... indicating P preference, not J.)

And so on.

J may decide things too quickly
P wants to miss nothing

I mostly picked P on the second question for the reason that "Wanting to be right" seems like quite a shallow statement by itself it implies by the P answer that being completely correct isn't as important as looking "right". Maybe I just projected too much on that question, though. I tend to make most of my decisions quickly and I can be a bit stubborn when I'm asked to change my opinion. With that being said, when I make decisions, I tend to think that I have all the relevant information at hand. I'm making the "Right" decision, I'm making the most logical decision based on all the information given.
 

Aleksei

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My attention span only lasted for 2 pages, but you sound like you don't want to be an INFJ. Which, I hate to say, isn't the most T-ish thing. A typologically confused INTJ would simply want to put ALL the facts out there and get the truth. The way you're trying to subtly promote yourself as an INTJ indicates a subjective slant to your self-analysis, which goes against what T's generally do/stand for.
For fuck's sake.

Guys, forget letter-based analysis, it misses the point. He's feeling but he's not a feeling type, because his functions don't fit. INFJs are Fe, Serge is strongly Fi, and approaching the problem in a way an Fi-guided person would.

Serge. Is. INTJ.
 

highlander

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For fuck's sake.

Guys, forget letter-based analysis, it misses the point. He's feeling but he's not a feeling type, because his functions don't fit. INFJs are Fe, Serge is strongly Fi, and approaching the problem in a way an Fi-guided person would.

Serge. Is. INTJ.

It seems so. :)

Just goes to show that everybody's different regardless as to type.

It would be interesting to see Step II results.
 

Aleksei

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Does Step II cost money?
 

Aleksei

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Spending ca$h on anything MBTI-related is a waste of money, IMHO.
 

Mole

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Join the military and do the MBTI test.

Get a job and do the MBTI test.

It's free because it is a way of thinking that suits the military and business.

Sure, we can call it brain-washing or a cult, but it works for business and the military. And we know the business of the military.
 

Aleksei

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highlander

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Spending ca$h on anything MBTI-related is a waste of money, IMHO.

It depends on:
1) how much money you think your time is worth
2) how important it is to you to get the most accurate/nuanced view possible

For me, it was not a waste at all. Though for many, I can see how it would be if they were not so much interested in the result.
 

Kalach

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Letter-based analysis provides a type hypothesis. Normally one would then look at profiles and see if they fit. Serge, sadly, has already looked at a great many profiles and has decided that he can't choose. However, it would seem that the type hypothesis currently firmly includes I and N. So... the next step would be to discuss examples from real life that support one of either T or F and one of either J or P.

Um.... so, Serge, can you say more about these:

T may forget and hurt other people’s feelings without knowing it.
F is usually very aware of other people’s feelings.

T can get along with little harmony.
F values harmony; feels unsettled by arguments and conflicts.

and this:

J tries to make things come out the way they “ought to be”.
P deals easily with unplanned and unexpected happenings.



(Morally speaking, the final arbiter of a person's type is the person, not the observers even if the observers already have a strong impression of what's up. It's a crappy rule and subverts the whole undermining of individuality thing we here at MBTI headquarters have going, but hey, ethical commerce and child molestation demand it.)
 

Craft

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I am disappointed. First you proclaim your type conclusion with insufficient presentation of data then you move on to monetary issues. Tsk tsk tsk.

No, seriously. Argue with reason and evidence, not repetitive presentations of unsupported judgments stated as fact. Just because you say it, doesn't make it so. Reread the thread. There is enough information.
 
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