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Thread: ENTJ to ESTP

  1. #11
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    Halla74, I love your post! Haha, it's massive.
    Thank you, Muhahaaa. I strive to be thorough and clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    No way am I spending my money on a test, but I did the second one and came out ESTP. S 8 N 6, and quite firmly P > J actually. What you say about your being more like ExTx - I am EXACTLY the same.
    At the time I paid for the test I was actively in need of alot of information quickly, and desired a single comprehensive battery that my wife and I both could take. It was very useful in that regard. But, once I did some Googling and found the myriad of good quality free tools available, I realized that it was not necessary, just convenient.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    I love that film. I always saw Naylor as an ENTP probably for the reason you just suggested. I guess he could be an ESTP too. But if he is really an N type then I'm more inclined to see myself as an ENTJ, because I see more clearly what makes an N type an N type.
    I'm really interested in the bolded part of your response above. Could you spare a few words to flesh it out? I'll give you my take on N Vs. S just for grins, and hopefully to simplify your efforts in responding. In general, if I were to summarize N/S according to what I've read and what I've experienced I'd say that:

    Stereotypical differences according to readings:
    (1) S = concrete (tangible facts) / N = abstract (possibilities)
    (2) S = here and now / N = future oriented

    Interesting adages heard from others:
    (1) To determine if someone is S, N, or J; throw a Nerf ball at their head while they are sitting: (a) if they catch it, they are S, (b) if it hits them in the head, they are N, and (c) if it hits them in the head, and they get pissed, they ar J.
    (2) NFs = always strive for things to be better and perfect, rarely staisfed, sometimes emotionally sensitive.
    (3) NTs = always objective, find rational solutions to problems, aloof or "detached", and good at math/logic.

    Personal observations:
    (1) Sensor/Thinkers emulate Rationals, especially if their S/N is balanced.
    (2) STs and NTs have way more in common with each other than either do with NFs.
    (3) Despite being a P, I am very orderly. I organize EVERYTHING. I know where EVERYTHING is in my house and office. So, I'll say P's with OCD easily emulate J's in alot of cases.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    Interesting... I've become MORE wild over the years. If anything I've become far more P than I used to be (I was very very J when I was 16 or 17). As for the S/N distinction, I've always been very balanced, frequently testing as ESTJ.
    Me too. I was actually VERY conservative and anal when younger, until around age 20. Then I finished "hatching."

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    But the way you describe yourself - that's me too. Thinking man and a man of action as well. If you are the thinking man ESTP, I am happy being the action man ENTJ counterpart.
    Nice analogy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    If you had to give an order of preference to these, what would you say?

    I'd be ENTJ > ESTP = ESTJ > ENTP
    Hmmm, I like this question:

    To mirror your response, my preference order would be...

    ESTP >= ENTJ > ESTJ > ENTP

    note1: Arrows are not mathematical operators...

    note2: ESTP/ENTJ seem my default modes of operation, when things require even more formality I'll lock onto my ESTJ Dad's methods, and finally, in my own time when there is nothing on the line, but I am free to explore and dream up my future I go into ENTP mode.
    Based on overall type descritpion...

    Based on what modality I must operate in...

    ESTP: Social default, happy, fun-loving rational and logical problem solver, efficient and egalitarian. Go where the action is, if there is none create it. Deal with conflict head-on, go for the jugular, but give opponents an out in order to allow them to save face and retreat in peace. +

    ENTJ: Work default, identify the best course of action and defeat all other possibilities, maintain professional image, ensure processes are efficient, integrated, and re-usable. Deal with conflict head-on, go for the jugular, take no prisoners.

    ESTJ: Secondary mode of work if part of a multi-vendor team in a hierarchical organization where I have little political pull. Get the job done, do it right, and don't let the small stuff interfere with the objective at hand. There is one right way. A purely brilliant finish can be foiled by one simple screw up, be anal and authoritarian to ensure compliance with methods of task completion.

    ENTP: Secondary social mode of operation. Unconventional exuberant genius. Dream big, dream often to fuel capacity for improvisation. Rules are guidelines, work hard play hard. I got the rulebreaking renegade traits from my INTJ brother, ironically enough, he was a hellion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    8w7 sp/sx, although I've considered balanced wings in the past.
    As in 7w8 Vs. 8w7?

    OR

    8w7 + 8w9?

    I'm definitely Ring 7 sx/so/sp, but I have a healthy smattering of 8 traits too. I don't identify with Ring 6 much at all. I've not a neurotic bone in my body.

    What do you think of Ennegram Vs. MBTI or Socionics?

    I know that the Enneagram Institute's "Enneathought of the Day" has been useful to me at times, as it often compels you to focus on something other than your default mode of thinking/living, and when I have made effort to do so, the exercise has resulted in a small amount of personal growth, simply by focusing on what is always there, but often does not register in my processing of life events.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    Dad: MBTI INFP, socionics IEI
    Step-mum: MBTI ESFJ, socionics possibly Fe base (EIE or ESE) or Si creative (LSE or ESE) or maybe even SLE.
    Mum: MBTI ESFP, socionics ESE
    Step-dad: MBTI ENFP, socionics SEI
    Wow, you're family is interesting! Two EPs, one EJ, and one INFP. You had to have an interesting upbringing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    What's the difference, IYO?
    Ahhh, another interesting question.

    I thought it silly for both to be used in the ESTP/ENTJ types. I would have simply used "confident" in both, but I did not write those descriptions. Essentially I think them to be the same. "Self" is extraneous as the context was a type description of a person, or a "self."
    --------------------
    Type Stats:
    MBTI -> (E) 77.14% | (i) 22.86% ; (S) 60% | (n) 40% ; (T) 72.22% | (f) 27.78% ; (P) 51.43% | (j) 48.57%
    BIG 5 -> Extroversion 77% ; Accommodation 60% ; Orderliness 62% ; Emotional Stability 64% ; Open Mindedness 74%

    Quotes:
    "If somebody asks your MBTI type on a first date, run". -Donna Cecilia
    "Enneagram is psychological underpinnings. Cognitive Functions are mental reasoning and perceptional processes. -Sanjuro

  2. #12
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    Nooo no no no, INTJs are not usually ILIs (what you call INTp) or LIIs (INTjs). As for ISTPs, there are no shortage of them on the16types - they all seem to think they're SLIs, but they're not at all. They're more likely SEIs or Beta STs (LSIs and SLEs).
    Meh it all varies. But what type in your experience are INTJs in socionics?
    I'm actually social last. Remember, so-first isn't about being sociable - it's about being aware of social dynamics between large groups of people, and about finding one's identity within groups.
    Yeah that too lol. See, I don't think of that when it comes to socializing because I'm a social last. I'm just basically unaware of those factors.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  3. #13
    Luctor et emergo Ezra's Avatar
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    I refuse to consider this question any more. I'm sticking with ENTJ. Either I'm wrong, or I'm right and this was unnecessary fuss. If I'm wrong I just don't really care that much. I'll let other people doubt it and be the judges of what they themselves think (if anything). I basically do think I'm an ENTJ with "something off".

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    I could be wrong.
    Each to his own. You prefer MBTI, stick with it man.

    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    I'm really interested in the bolded part of your response above. Could you spare a few words to flesh it out?
    Well because if what he does is what one would deem "abstract" then I am definitely abstract. This is all I really need - some external criterion by which to judge myself. That's the problem with self-analysis; I don't know the definitions of some of these words like "abstract". But that in itself (I think I've said this before) could be the key to my type - N > S. Because honestly what S would consider what "abstract" means when taking the test? They'd just say "no".

    In general, if I were to summarize N/S according to what I've read and what I've experienced I'd say that:

    Stereotypical differences according to readings:
    (1) S = concrete (tangible facts) / N = abstract (possibilities)
    (2) S = here and now / N = future oriented
    Possibilities and future-orientation is my life. I live with the future in mind at all times. Never could I live in the present only. There's always some part of my mind which is thinking about six, twelve months in advance. I can't stop myself from doing this.

    8w7 + 8w9?
    This.

    What do you think of Ennegram Vs. MBTI or Socionics?
    I came to each of the systems in that order. My understanding of the Enneagram is the best, mainly because I've been surrounded by it since I was sixteen, and my understanding of socionics isn't far off. To be honest, my understanding of MBTI is pretty superficial (although I've read Keirsey's Please Understand Me II) simply because I don't really see much use in it besides giving yourself a label. Socionics helps you in all relationships (far better than does MBTI), and helps you identify the person you will have the most rewarding relationship with. Enneagram I like because it helps me as a person. I guess MBTI is just a bit of fun for me, because I do enjoy typology in and for itself.

    You had to have an interesting upbringing.
    I had a great upbringing.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    Meh it all varies. But what type in your experience are INTJs in socionics?
    Did you read that page I linked to?

    Personally I think INTJs tend to be LIEs and occasionally SLEs (e.g. INTJ Eights). I'm sure some of them are LIIs and ILIs though.

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