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  1. #1
    Amazing Spambot! Cloudblue's Avatar
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    Default Am I sure of myself...

    I didn't botter to read the stickies so am just going to go with the post...

    I cant figure out if am either infp or intp,so to help you guys with analyzing my type I will include as much details and hidden clues as possible...ok,here I go,ahem...

    I am a temperament,the reason why am not typing my name is that am I dont trust you guys...yet..
    I like:
    Fruits and vegetables,
    video games,
    anime,not so much the cute cuddly shojo kind,because characters with big eyes and girly expressions make my eyes burn...
    Before making a decision I make sure to analyze it as much as possible.Both the risk and chances of it working,I tend to be a risk taker so that may thwart that.

    there you go,you may ask for more information...
    Edit:how do you change the title of a message?
    Kindblue,from globalchatter...
    And still wonders were it has gone...

  2. #2
    Reptilian Snuggletron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloudblue View Post
    I didn't botter to read the stickies so am just going to go with the post...

    I cant figure out if am either infp or intp,so to help you guys with analyzing my type I will include as much details and hidden clues as possible...ok,here I go,ahem...

    I am a temperament,the reason why am not typing my name is that am I dont trust you guys...yet..
    I like:
    Fruits and vegetables,
    video games,
    anime,not so much the cute cuddly shojo kind,because characters with big eyes and girly expressions make my eyes burn...
    Before making a decision I make sure to analyze it as much as possible.Both the risk and chances of it working,I tend to be a risk taker so that may thwart that.

    there you go,you may ask for more information...
    Edit:how do you change the title of a message?
    I have reason to believe you're an INTJ.

  3. #3
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloudblue View Post
    I didn't botter to read the stickies so am just going to go with the post...
    First mistake.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloudblue View Post
    Edit:how do you change the title of a message?
    You can double-click the box that the thread title is in on this page.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adoamros View Post
    I have reason to believe you're an INTJ.
    Can I just ask how this sort of statement helps? It's like saying "I have reason to believe you're a transexual", and then just walking away without explaining yourself. o_O
    Hello

  4. #4
    Senior Member Space_Oddity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adoamros View Post
    I have reason to believe you're an INTJ.
    You believe that liking anime = INTJ?!
    I assure you I've met lots of anime fans of all different types.

    To the OP, this really isn't enough information to work with... For example, are you very instrospective? Is it easy for you to figure out how you feel? Do you identify with your emotions? Are you value-oriented? That would point to Fi (even if it wouldn't necessarily prove you're a Fi primary).

  5. #5
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adoamros View Post
    I have reason to believe you're an INTJ.
    No. From what Cloudblue has typed, I could only tell that he/she is most likely a P.

  6. #6
    Head Pigeon Mad Hatter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloudblue View Post
    I didn't botter to read the stickies so am just going to go with the post...

    I cant figure out if am either infp or intp,so to help you guys with analyzing my type I will include as much details and hidden clues as possible...ok,here I go,ahem...
    If it's any help (been there, done that myself), here's a nice quote about the socionics INFp, Intuitive Ethical Introvert (=IEI).

    "IEIs often have a keen interest in interpreting their surroundings in terms of logical categories. They may be drawn to descriptive logical systems and models, which ground IEIs' oft-scattered thought processes and help them to focus on somewhat more tangible ideas. IEIs' often exhibit a tendency to organize their thoughts in a deliberate, methodical manner -- though they rarely are inclined to regiment their lives in this way, their ideas are often subject to systemic associations, sometimes extensively so.

    (This line contains no links and has no purpose at all.)

    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    I have reason to believe you're a transexual
    I second that.
    IN SERIO FATVITAS.

    -τὸ γὰρ γράμμα ἀποκτέννει, τὸ δὲ πνεῦμα ζῳοποιεῖ-

  7. #7
    Reptilian Snuggletron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    Can I just ask how this sort of statement helps? It's like saying "I have reason to believe you're a transexual", and then just walking away without explaining yourself. o_O
    I need to explain myself? Clearly the evidence is there. In fact I bolded it.

    OP didn't present any evidence hinting he was a transsexual but it could be possible I'll give you that.

  8. #8
    Amazing Spambot! Cloudblue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space_Oddity View Post
    You believe that liking anime = INTJ?!
    I assure you I've met lots of anime fans of all different types.

    To the OP, this really isn't enough information to work with... For example, are you very instrospective? Is it easy for you to figure out how you feel? Do you identify with your emotions? Are you value-oriented? That would point to Fi (even if it wouldn't necessarily prove you're a Fi primary).
    More information:
    Am I very introspective,yes I am.I think people need some time to introspective in order find what is not working and what is...
    About emotions,I kind of annoyed when people have emotional outbursts for the most illogical reasons.For example,someone buys a hamburger,eats it and cries afterwards...WTH?
    I also loathe people who use feelings as their way of figuring out things,before you do something think about it...

    you may ask for more information...
    Kindblue,from globalchatter...
    And still wonders were it has gone...

  9. #9
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloudblue View Post
    More information:
    Am I very introspective,yes I am.I think people need some time to introspective in order find what is not working and what is...
    About emotions,I kind of annoyed when people have emotional outbursts for the most illogical reasons.For example,someone buys a hamburger,eats it and cries afterwards...WTH?
    I also loathe people who use feelings as their way of figuring out things,before you do something think about it...

    you may ask for more information...
    All introverted intuitives are going to feel "introspective". I get the feeling you have the common misconception that Feeling equals emotion. Feeling is a function which evaluates and reasons. Feeling types are no less capable of intelligent thought or rational conclusions than a Thinking type. That has much more to do with the individual's own intellect, and even self-discipline.

    That said, your described thought process sounds very "dry" to me, and there's not much interest in understanding why other people may feel a certain way that is foreign to you; and so I would guess INTP. INFPs tend to speak of their inner thought process in more colorful terms and would be less likely to dismiss another person's seemingly "strange" emotional outburst without considering the many possibilities that could've led to it (probably nothing to do with a hamburger).


    And these are good to contrast Fi and Ti:

    The introvert of feeling-type finds support and guidance by shaping his own feeling-attitudes in accordance with an inner ideal. Here the activities of feeling are hidden, and from the outside there is, as a rule, little to tell us that we are dealing with a person of feeling-type. Feeling aims more especially at an inner harmony, trying to discover what under various circumstances should be the right relationships between people if life is to be beautiful and well balanced. Reality, however, reveals in most cases that this ideal is not attained, and introverted feeling is particularly vulnerable in regard to such experiences. This vulnerability which may become as intense at that of the sensitive plant is one of the most characteristic peculiarities of this type.

    Just as with the introvert of thinking-type, we find here, too, a marked contrast between inner security on the one hand, and uncertainty in external behavior on the other. But whereas with the introverted thinker this opposition gives rise to thought concerning the problems of life, with the individual of feeling-type it leads to deep feeling, and to a strange mixture of inner tenderness and passionate conviction. These people are absolutely certain as to the soundness of their ideals, but this is accompanied by a helpless feeling that it will never be possible to realize them in this world. They do not, however, reject the world, for feeling means the making of ties and is directed towards social contacts. In spite of ever-repeated collisions with the world and with other people, they can never give up their wish to love them both.

    They conceal their sensitiveness behind a mask, which may be childish or simple, or again conventional, remote, or it may be friendly. But behind this mask the search goes on for someone who will understand, and for a community which will embody their ideals. However disappointed they are, they still in their innermost being believe implicitly in what their feelings tell them. Even if they are not able to express it clearly in words, they are inwardly quite certain as to what accords with them and what does not. Outwardly, their feelings are not very obvious, for when these are affected, these people tend to withdraw into themselves, and if they do express anything, it will only be much later, after they have had time to work it all over within themselves.

    In ordinary life their mask conceals what they really are. But there is, nevertheless, something very individual about them, sometimes remarkably so, which will come to expression particularly in certain moments, in relation to certain people. This happens more especially in two situations: when they achieve real contact with another person; and when, in a state of high emotional excitement, they stand up for a threatened ideal.

    In the first case, a very profound relationship of mutual understanding may suddenly come into being, all the wealth of their minds being unlocked to the confidant; sometimes this contact will later be broken off just as suddenly and unexpectedly, in defence of their own vulnerability. And where his feelings are aroused, the person who appeared to be so impersonal, remote and somewhat insignificant may suddenly burst out with a personal point of view, expressed with such conviction and such force of feeling that it compels respect.

    Such people may also resist with extreme obstinacy anything that does not accord with their sentiments. This resistance may be justified, in so far as it is based on a motive of fine feeling; but the means used to give it emphatic expression is ill-suited to the external world, and in this respect incorrect. The consequence is that they are nearly always misunderstood, and they tend more or less to resign themselves to this situation. This contrast between a clear intention, directed towards harmony, and uncertain modes of expression, giving rise to misunderstandings, is found again and again in the lives of these people.

    In childhood they are gentle and dreamy, and somewhat reserved, but with occasional violent outbursts of emotion. In familiar surroundings they can be unrestrainedly gay; but more often they are likely to exhibit violent resentment if circumstances do not correspond to their feelings, and it then seems to them that harshness and indifference prevail in the world. As a result, they seem to show signs of disappointment at a very early age, and a certain distrust of life. Owing to their inability to express themselves clearly, and to bring their ideals to reality, there may arise a feeling of impotence and inferiority. They are apt to seek the fault in themselves, and may suffer much from a sense of guilt on this account. Here, also, feelings have a tendency to extend their influence, with the result that their whole being may be plunged into depths of unhappiness; but at other times a genuine emotional contact with someone will once more fill them with a quiet and enormous delight. Now they will look at the world again with new eyes, and a feeling that is almost religious will embrace both nature and man.

    Later, also, the happiness of these people will depend on the emotional attachments which they are able to make, though they find it less necessary than do extraverts of this type to be in immediate touch with other people. The expression of other people's feelings in poetry and music, and the realization, through the reading of stories and biographies, of the depths of their spiritual experience, may have the effect on these people of making them feel more at home in the world. In this way, there develops in them a life of the spirit, which is carefully concealed from strangers, and which may be expressed, for instance, in a secret piety, or in poetical forms, which are revealed only with great unwillingness.

    This feeling-type is particularly found among women. Whereas the woman of extraverted feeling-type has it in her to create an atmosphere of harmony around herself, in the introverted woman of this type all the riches of her mind will be developed into a love which is inwardly directed towards the highest ideals of harmony. Without saying or doing much, such a woman will emanate a feeling of rest and security. It is difficult to describe an influence of this kind, expressed as it is in such indefinite forms. But on the immediate environment it may be very effective. A mother of this type may have an even greater influence on her children than the devoted and radiant mother of extraverted feeling-type. These women are often able to implant and foster something of their own ideals in their children, exercising in this way a quiet force which helps to keep a respect for moral authority alive in the world.

    All the modes of expression for the deeper impulses of the spirit in religion and art find great support in such people. Whether they are artists or scientists, they are still primarily attracted by problems of the emotional life. They express themselves in such occupations with great care and precision. Here again the persistence and devotion of the individual of feeling-type become evident. When they do give form to their inner feeling in a poem, for example they will carefully weigh every expression; at the same time, they will often neglect generally accepted social forms, which for them have no significance; or they will employ conventional and simple forms as a mask, from behind which a more genuine and finer feeling will occasionally come quite unexpectedly to light.

    Although in these persons the will, under the direction of strong moral conviction, represents an important factor in the psyche, it is less evident than in the other rational types, owing to the fact that the controlling activity is directed more inwards, and feeling is expressed more indirectly. It is most evident in the strong sense of duty characteristic of these people, and in their faithful discharge of their duties. Their activity frequently suffers as a result of moods of discouragement. When this is so, they lose themselves in pessimistic feelings, giving up their efforts to make themselves better understood, or to alter things in their environment. After a time they recover from such moods, since they tend, as a rule, to regard them as a fault in themselves.

    This contact with their own moral judgment represents an essential factor in the lives of feeling-introverts. They are not bound by the judgments of others as is the feeling-extravert for the standard by which they judge their own behavior is an inner moral law, intuitively felt to be binding. While the extravert of feeling-type will repress, for the sake of harmony, things both in himself and in the external world which do not accord with his ideal, the feeling-introvert will remain more aware of such conflicts. In him, however, the limiting and excluding activity of the demand for harmony may be detrimental in a different way, everything not consonant with that harmony being regarded from a negative point of view, as opposed to what is ideal and good. It is impossible for these people to see the world or themselves objectively, and their continual comparison of things with ideal requirements gives them an exaggeratedly critical point of view. Since this also applies to their own lives, there is an undermining of their own self-confidence, as well as of their confidence in the world, which may seriously affect their happiness in life. It is necessary for these people to recognize that things which do not exactly accord with their ideals may yet have a value which may be developed.

    In these cases, also, the instinctual life is to a very large extent subordinated to the regulating force of feeling. Since the relationship between moral conviction and instinctual impulse is here worked out more within the mind, there is less danger of pretence for the sake of the external world than with extraverts. Instinctual feelings are subordinated to the ideal. At the same time, there may be a too forcible suppression of the instinctual life, in which case it will lead not so much to a split in the emotional life as to a certain joylessness, and to the feeling that life is passing without bringing any true fulfilment. There is too often a need to associate all pleasures and joys with some moral value, and to condemn them if this higher satisfaction is not obviously found in them.

    Intuition is also subjected to the authority of introverted feeling. Intuitions here bear more on the inner aspect of feeling than on its expression in other people. They may give form to the laws of feeling, but in images rather than in concepts. Where intuition is developed, it is of great assistance in finding expression for introverted feeling, both in practical life and in art. Intuition may also provide a link with religious life, which, in this case, will be specially developed in its feeling-aspect: inner moral unity with God and with his fellow-man has greater significance for the man of feeling-type than ecstatic experiences or philosophical problems. The dominance of feeling is revealed in the constant search for a harmonious relation and in the weight given to views on morality, love and justice.

    Thought is, as a rule, not very essential in the lives of these people. They accept the thought-forms as taught to them, and make conscientious use of them; butthis is not vital to them, as the judgment of feeling is. In their thought-processes, they argue from preconceived attitudes of feeling, and frequently do not embark on any logical thinking at all, leaving the realm of logic to others to deal with.
    ------------------
    Dr. J. H. van der Hoop, Lecturer in Psychiatry, Amsterdam, Conscious Orientation, pp. 87-91, translated 1939 by Laura Hutton, B.A. Lond., M.R.C.S., L.R.C.P.

    The introvert of thinking-type also takes his systematized experience as his guide; but here the emphasis falls on the inner aspect, thus on the need for objective order and on laws and principles, according to which experience is generally systematized. Abstraction of that part of conscious experience which is revealed as constant and subject to general rules is regarded by the introverted thinker as something of vital significance. He tries to arrange the opinions which he takes over from others in a system of his own. In doing so, he will take up a more critical attitude in regard to the thought-material which he is taught than do extraverted thinkers, and his aim is to follow the guidance of his own opinions and convictions. In consequence, we find a most careful working-over of his own experience, but a tendency to leave out of his reckoning facts and points of view which are not known to him. While the strength of the extraverted thinker lies in his easy application of systematized knowledge, the introverted thinker is particularly good at comparing systems and principles. He feels at home among abstractions, and there are many fine shades of meaning in the world of his ideas. Also, as he is more skilled in introspection, he is better able to examine mental facts than is the extraverted psychologist.

    Hence we see here a living contact with ideas, and subtle reflection and consideration, side by side with difficulty in expressing and applying what has been thought out, and a certain aloofness from the world of facts in general. There is thus in these people a contrast between their consciousness of the objectivity of their judgment, and their difficulty, of which they are equally conscious, in defending this judgment and securing its recognition by others. This produces, even in children of the type, a peculiar attitude. They are often reserved, somewhat timid and uncertain, and seem not to feel at home in the world. On the other hand, they will, at the same time, manifest an obstinate, somewhat pedantic decisiveness. They have not the cool logicality of the thinking extravert, but take up a more fanatical stand, which may easily degenerate into dogmatism and extreme pedantry. In general, both children and adults of this type are, as a result of their introversion, difficult to convince that they are mistaken. Their inner, logical reasoning makes them feel that they are right, and they may take up an attitude to the external world also, which might be expressed as follows: "That is my opinion, even if I can't prove it; whether you agree or not, it will not change it to the slightest degree."

    At an early age they have learned that the fact that they inwardly regard something as true does not in the least mean that others will accept it. As a result, their attitude is, in general, more sceptical in regard to the validity of any truth than is that of a thinking extravert, and they are more inclined to allow for the existence of differing views, even when these do not entirely tally with theirs or with those of prevailing authorities. At the same time, however, this gives rise to a feeling of aloofness in regard to any generally recognized system of truth, for this often seems to them something quite unattainable. On the other hand, they never cease to be surprised that what seems so obvious to them should not be equally clear to others. Occasionally such people will go to great pains to express themselves as objectively and clearly as possible, but sometimes they give up the attempt and simply present their views in the form in which they arose. In the difficult language of some philosophers we find the effect of both influences — sometimes in strange combination. As a result of this somewhat sceptical and resigned attitude in regard to form, the judgments of introverted thinkers have often about them something cautious, cold or stiff-necked. It is as if they already reckoned on difficulty in convincing others. Jung says of this type: "Even if he goes as far as giving his thoughts to the world, he does not deal with them as a careful mother would with her children, but he exposes them as foundlings, and at the most he will be annoyed if they fail to make their way."

    This inner conflict between certainty as regards conviction, and uncertainty as to how to maintain and apply this conviction in the world, intensifies thought concerning personal conflicts and problems. Hence many philosophically disposed persons belong to this type. They aim at having, at least inwardly, a foundation of pure ideals and definite principles for the ordering of their lives. Such people make, as it were, endless preparations for life; they constantly renew their efforts to perfect their equipment, so as to be equal to the fight for existence. This they do, not only in the big problems of life, but also in ordinary practical matters. They like to have a systematic view of the whole situation before entering on any new ground. In order to be able to adapt themselves, they need to have order in their life and work, and they love making programmes. When travelling, they eagerly study maps and guide-books, or they may even try to master the language of a foreign country, before ever they go there. Such people like to be able to foresee all the possible difficulties which may arise in their business or work, so as to be able to take precautions against them in good time. Occasionally this leads to the most elaborate reckoning with every important practical detail. Ford seems to me to be a good example of the potentialities in practical adaptation characteristic of the type, with his elaborate preparations down to the smallest detail coupled with a theoretical justification of all his ideas. In a mind less clear and with less insight into what is essential, this preparation may, however, lead to much fussiness and complexity, and in such cases much energy and attention is wasted in warding off imaginary dangers.

    These thinking people are also found more especially among the male sex. Great philosophers, such as Kant, belong to them, and also many mathematicians and psychologists. Or they may be found in all kinds of practical and applied sciences, and taking leading roles as careful organizers, legislators or contractors. On occasion, however, they are unable to get over certain unpractical traits, and will then cause difficulties with their fanatical exactitude in details, or by everlastingly insisting on their pet principles in any discussion or practical undertaking. This makes co-operation with them in any large combine somewhat difficult. Socially, also, they are somewhat surly. Their attitude to others is more or less studied, seldom absolutely spontaneous. Here again, their systematic thinking stands between them and the world. Their words are usually carefully chosen and weighed, and thus are a kind of mask. People of this type are usually aware of this; but they see no possibility of adopting any different attitude. One usually learns to know them better in a smaller circle, where they will be more spontaneous, and even cordial or original; but even so, with a tendency to be awkward as a result of over-sensitiveness or irascibility. It is more easy to see them as they really are in some sphere in which they have begun to master the technique.

    As among the extraverted thinkers, here, also, we may find keen concentration of will and constant activity. Since the introvert finds the motives for his aspirations more within himself, he is less dependent on external stimuli. This is counter-balanced, however, by greater susceptibility to inner difficulties, which, accordingly, may damage his working capacity. And while his independence of circumstances gives him great perseverance, even where initially no success is to be looked for, it may also happen that he will squander his best powers on something impossible from the practical point of view, without realizing this in time.

    If the instinctive life manages to gain some influence, it will be conducted along definite paths by a controlling reason. As a rule, introverted thought finds support in the perceptual aspect of instinctive experience, since this represents its objective aspect. This type of thinker is, however, in philosophy, natural science and psychology, more inclined than the extravert to speculate on the nature of perception and the object. In addition, he is, as an introvert, more in touch with the subjective side of instinctual life. He is more conscious of the inner struggle between instinctual drives, and here also he will seek to create order with his reason, in which case it will depend on his principles as to how he will do this. The theorizing idealist, full of his ideal of the purity of love, and despising as filthy anything remotely associated with sex, will, in the inflexibility of his system, be not far removed from those who defend licence on the principle that nature must not be denied. Both attitudes are in point of fact calculated to evade the practical complications of the problem, and to keep it, so to speak, at a distance. The introverted thinker will sometimes have a great deal to say on such subjects; but he is not, for all that, better, or more skilled, in practice.

    Intuition may also influence people of this type to a greater or less degree, giving them something original, which is, however, subdued, since it can only be permitted to play any part in their life after it has been carefully tested. Intuition also reveals to them the schemata and principles according to which thought may classify experience. But the immediate results of personal vision, both in regard to the internal and the external world, tend rather to be mistrusted, unless it is obvious that they will fit into the system. These results may, however, give rise to alterations and extensions in the system. Nevertheless, fine inspirations frequently remain unfruitful, owing to the ponderous way in which they are dealt with.

    Feeling, again, gives rise to the chief difficulties in people of this type. Anything which conforms to their principles and views is allowed; but even this cannot easily find expression, owing to deficient familiarity with current modes of expression. As a result, people of this type will often display a strict conventionality, or else a childish disregard of these modes. Inwardly, their feelings, moods and impulses cause them much more unpleasantness than they do to the extraverted thinker, the latter being less aware of them. An introverted thinker, when in love, feels awkward, uncertain and ridiculous. He will try and talk himself out of his feelings, or else make endless preparations to give expression to them, which is, naturally, scarcely conducive to spontaneity.
    -------------
    Dr. J. H. van der Hoop, Lecturer in Psychiatry, Amsterdam, Conscious Orientation, pp. 64-68, translated 1939 by Laura Hutton, B.A. Lond., M.R.C.S., L.R.C.P.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

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