I have no type... help me

[Lauren Ashley]

If you will allow me to point out: I think you actually agree with me in belief, yet you disagree in attitude.

I agree that there is a bias towards I and P, as in people are more likely to be I and P here.

No, that's not what I meant. I meant that perceiving as a preference is preferred to judging. You can go in any thread here and see that this is the case. Judgers are maligned as inflexible and closedminded, while perceivers are hailed as easygoing and openminded. Actually, in most "what's my type?" threads, if someone shows the slightest inclination towards judging behavior (e.g. order) they are typed as J.

The belief I was pointing out was actually one you seem to agree with (even if you dont know it), that E T and J are seen as something "built on top" of I F and P.

I don't agree with that. If that were the case, then ISFP would be a common typing as well, yet it is not. Or even INTP, yet that is not. The issue is with the INFP (or xNFP) type as a whole, rather than the separate preferences of introversion, feeling, and perceiving.

 

[Venom]

No, that's not what I meant. I meant that perceiving as a preference is preferred to judging. You can go in any thread here and see that this is the case. Judgers are maligned as inflexible and closedminded, while perceivers are hailed as easygoing and openminded. Actually, in most "what's my type?" threads, if someone shows the slightest inclination towards judging behavior (e.g. order) they are typed as J.

I don't agree with that. If that were the case, then ISFP would be a common typing as well, yet it is not. Or even INTP, yet that is not. The issue is with the INFP (or xNFP) type as a whole, rather than the separate preferences of introversion, feeling, and perceiving.

well then we are going to just have to agree to disagree. my experiences just do not corroborate this...

 

[Lauren Ashley]

well then we are going to just have to agree to disagree. my experiences just do not corroborate this...

Change your type to ESTJ and let's see if that changes.

 

[Venom]

Change your type to ESTJ and let's see if that changes.

are you implying that no one would question an ESTJ typing for me?

 

[PeaceBaby]

Dear Babylon Candle,

I ask; ultimately, what does it really matter what type you are? I sense a unique energy and power in you and I think you ought to embrace your special combo of personality and skills and continue on with the wonderful business of living.

As for type, I shall answer your question intuitively, since it is as logical as any other rationale used in this thread.

ENFP. This is what I sense from you. Very close IvsE, PvsJ. Overcompensated Te, to the point of being at odds with Ne and Fi, seeking to take over and slap them both back to behaving themselves. It gives you a decisive air and flavor here, slightly uncharacteristic, but it's conflicted.

I have always had the impression that you feel old for your age. You feel a distance between yourself and others that is at odds in your desire to be present, in the moment with them. That you struggle with the paradox of both wanting to be close yet feeling indifferent to humanity. The energy of your independence is palpable, but you need to refrain from seeking to understand everything right now.

Life unfolds. Some answers you have to wait for. Put this one away for a while, revisit the question a little further down the road.

 

[Jaguar]

Enneagram 1= Any J Type.

 

[Venom]

Dear Babylon Candle,

I ask; ultimately, what does it really matter what type you are? I sense a unique energy and power in you and I think you ought to embrace your special combo of personality and skills and continue on with the wonderful business of living.

i sometimes take this stuff too seriously for my own good. I'm happy to say that I haven't ever let it get me down irl

As for type, I shall answer your question intuitively, since it is as logical as any other rationale used in this thread.

ENFP. This is what I sense from you. Very close IvsE, PvsJ. Overcompensated Te, to the point of being at odds with Ne and Fi, seeking to take over and slap them both back to behaving themselves. It gives you a decisive air and flavor here, slightly uncharacteristic, but it's conflicted.

Its amazing to hear how others view me. I think that ENFPs are wonderful. I'd almost say it fits, if not for my best friend in HS who tests ENFP, and is 5x more enfp than I ever could be (both good and bad qualities). When we converse, the difference in thought process is very striking. We both connect on an intuitive level, but he is just "scattered", resourceful and "slippery". Where as I am more "collected", planning and responsible. I think the main differences are summed up in my motivations. I still don't question my enneagram 1w9 sp/sx. I know that its possible to be an ENFP 1. It just doesnt seem right though.

I have always had the impression that you feel old for your age. You feel a distance between yourself and others that is at odds in your desire to be present, in the moment with them. That you struggle with the paradox of both wanting to be close yet feeling indifferent to humanity. The energy of your independence is palpable, but you need to refrain from seeking to understand everything right now.

Life unfolds. Some answers you have to wait for. Put this one away for a while, revisit the question a little further down the road.

How do you write such an utterly soul penetrating paragraph?
Thanks for taking the time to gather up some info and collect your thoughts on me.

Enneagram 1= Any J Type.

I keep coming back to this point in my typology search, both explicitly and implicitly.

 

[VagrantFarce]

I thought you were ENFJ? What's with the doubt, Mr. J?

I have always had the impression that you feel old for your age. You feel a distance between yourself and others that is at odds in your desire to be present, in the moment with them. That you struggle with the paradox of both wanting to be close yet feeling indifferent to humanity. The energy of your independence is palpable, but you need to refrain from seeking to understand everything right now.

This could not be more Ni/Se if it tried.

must stop analyzing everything...

 

[Jaguar]

Enneagram 1= Any J Type.

I keep coming back to this point in my typology search, both explicitly and implicitly.

Good, but then you wrote this in the same post:

I know that its possible to be an ENFP 1.

The only Enneagram 1 ENFP you're going to find is someone who in reality is an ENFJ, who mistyped themselves as a P.
But frankly, I don't even see how an ENFP could do that.

Ne generates many possibilities.
Enneagram 1's allege there is one "right" or "perfect" way to do something.
That's a head-on collision of contradiction with Ne (ENFP).

Only you have the power to make the decision, Babylon.
But I will give you another hint: Whether you want to admit it or not, you are seeking a consensus in this thread. (Fe)
"Taking it to the people," if you will.

Food for thought.

 

[Little Linguist]

Good, but then you wrote this in the same post:



The only Enneagram 1 ENFP you're going to find is someone who in reality is an ENFJ, who mistyped themselves as a P.
But frankly, I don't even see how an ENFP could do that.

Ne generates many possibilities.
Enneagram 1's allege there is one "right" or "perfect" way to do something.
That's a head-on collision of contradiction with Ne (ENFP).

Only you have the power to make the decision, Babylon.
But I will give you another hint: Whether you want to admit it or not, you are seeking a consensus in this thread. (Fe)
"Taking it to the people," if you will.

Food for thought.

Indeed. One thing that was clear for me was that I could not be ENFP for this very reason - not only because I have enneagram 1 but also because many of my values conflict with ENFP values.

 

[PeaceBaby]

Ne generates many possibilities.
Enneagram 1's allege there is one "right" or "perfect" way to do something.
That's a head-on collision of contradiction with Ne (ENFP).

That's a good point. Do you think Babylon is like that though? I don't get a "my way or the highway" vibe from him.

Here's a little extra food for thought, from the enneagram institute site:

Misidentifying Ones and Nines
Usually this mistype is caused by confusion about the wing and dominant type: is the person a Nine with a One-wing or a One with a Nine-wing? In some cases, with a strong wing, this can be a difficult call. Both can be idealistic, philosophical, and somewhat withdrawn. Neither feels comfortable with their anger. Usually, the Nine's reluctance to get into conflicts is the easiest way to discern these adjacent types. Average Nines want to maintain peace in their lives, and while they may hold strong personal convictions, they generally do not want to argue about them with people–especially people with whom they have an emotional attachment. For Ones, however, the principle is foremost, and Ones will drive home their point to convert the other to their view, even if it risks creating upsets and arguments. ("The truth is the truth.")

While Nines can be hard workers, it does not take much to convince them that a break would be useful. They enjoy down time, and tend to have difficulty shifting gears from relaxation to activity or vice versa. Ones are extremely driven and have difficulty tearing themselves away from their various projects to take a rest or relax. They feel anxious when they are not being productive (like Threes), and want to get back to work to avoid attacks from their superego.

Another distinction can be found in how the two types handle stress. Nines initially become more emotionally disengaged and resistant, but eventually become more anxious and reactive as they go to Six. Ones, initially become more fervent in their efforts to convince the other that they are right, but then collapse into moodiness and a tight-lipped testiness as they go to Four.​

Now, that being said, I consider myself a 9wing, but I have stood up in front of hundreds of people to argue for what I feel is right, and have risked much to do so. I constantly feel like I am wasting time if I am not working on my projects. So do I think these describe everyone perfectly? No. But perhaps this little snippet will help Babylon discern some additional feelings on the topic.

I'm not an enneagram or MBTI expert, and ultimately only Babylon can come to a type conclusion. I can go from what I sense, and he does seem more driven to me than the average ENFP. I am not 100% confidently feeling the J vibe, the outward Fe conclusiveness. There's definitely something pushing him, something that doesn't allow him to relax and explore who he is. A restlessness if you will.

I have thought on LL's recent transition too, from ENFP to ESTJ. Reflected on the relevance of that here. Again, I just don't feel the decisiveness. I feel the conviction, just not the sweeping confidence that generally holds hands with it.

Curious to see how this continues to unwind. I am happy to share my feelings, whatever label they belong to.

 

[Venom]

That's a good point. Do you think Babylon is like that though? I don't get a "my way or the highway" vibe from him.

Here's a little extra food for thought, from the enneagram institute site:

Misidentifying Ones and Nines
Usually this mistype is caused by confusion about the wing and dominant type: is the person a Nine with a One-wing or a One with a Nine-wing? In some cases, with a strong wing, this can be a difficult call. Both can be idealistic, philosophical, and somewhat withdrawn. Neither feels comfortable with their anger. Usually, the Nine's reluctance to get into conflicts is the easiest way to discern these adjacent types. Average Nines want to maintain peace in their lives, and while they may hold strong personal convictions, they generally do not want to argue about them with people–especially people with whom they have an emotional attachment. For Ones, however, the principle is foremost, and Ones will drive home their point to convert the other to their view, even if it risks creating upsets and arguments. ("The truth is the truth.")

While Nines can be hard workers, it does not take much to convince them that a break would be useful. They enjoy down time, and tend to have difficulty shifting gears from relaxation to activity or vice versa. Ones are extremely driven and have difficulty tearing themselves away from their various projects to take a rest or relax. They feel anxious when they are not being productive (like Threes), and want to get back to work to avoid attacks from their superego.

Another distinction can be found in how the two types handle stress. Nines initially become more emotionally disengaged and resistant, but eventually become more anxious and reactive as they go to Six. Ones, initially become more fervent in their efforts to convince the other that they are right, but then collapse into moodiness and a tight-lipped testiness as they go to Four.​

Now, that being said, I consider myself a 9wing, but I have stood up in front of hundreds of people to argue for what I feel is right, and have risked much to do so. I constantly feel like I am wasting time if I am not working on my projects. So do I think these describe everyone perfectly? No. But perhaps this little snippet will help Babylon discern some additional feelings on the topic.

I'm not an enneagram or MBTI expert, and ultimately only Babylon can come to a type conclusion. I can go from what I sense, and he does seem more driven to me than the average ENFP. I am not 100% confidently feeling the J vibe, the outward Fe conclusiveness. There's definitely something pushing him, something that doesn't allow him to relax and explore who he is. A restlessness if you will.

I have thought on LL's recent transition too, from ENFP to ESTJ. Reflected on the relevance of that here. Again, I just don't feel the decisiveness. I feel the conviction, just not the sweeping confidence that generally holds hands with it.

Curious to see how this continues to unwind. I am happy to share my feelings, whatever label they belong to.

well when I read this description of 1s, I just "know" that its me. I can identify things that people (who know me well) actually say about me:

Type 1(Instinctive Triad)

Ones idealize a moral purity that both transcends reality and is the foundation of it. They see the world through their perceptual filter of how things could be improved, the ideal as opposed to the real, which leads to a constant dissatisfaction with reality. They are eternally frustrated with all the flaws around them and with their eye for improvement feel it is their mission to fix them. They take pride in not wavering in their convictions no matter how unpopular and in resolutely pointing out the right way everybody ought to abide by. When everyone adheres to the same rules/ideals/principles there is fairness and order...and when people break the rules ones truly resent that. "You can't do that because if everyone did what you did..." is a common type one stream of consciousness.

Ones have the strongest inner critic of all types and justify their moral authority to "point out the right way" by constantly putting more effort into being good or virtuous than others. Due to their strict superego there is no type that feels as guilty for being "bad" and harder on themselves to be perfectly good. They are not just conscientious disciplined competent and reliable people who hold themselves accountable to do what they are supposed to do. They go further in the self-control department by continually repressing their "dirty" desires and restricting their indulgences. The more self-control they consistently maintain the more upright they are and the more they've earned both their right to point out how things should be and their duty to hold their enviornment as well as themselves to ideals.

Ones being perfectionists tend to be uptight and anal-retentive about things and aren't the easiest people to get along with. They practice what they preach however which many find sincere and refreshing in an image-dominated society filled with hypocrisy. They continually hold themselves to their own high standards. They do their duty and are dedicated to standing up for what's right through thick and thin as those are extensions of their perseverance. They are also the least likely type to be full of themselves, so much so one gets the sense that they couldn't promote themselves even if they tried.

 

[Jaguar]

That's a good point. Do you think Babylon is like that though? I don't get a "my way or the highway" vibe from him.

I said "right" or "perfect" way.
There is a big difference in meaning between those two words and "my way or the highway."

To answer you, no, I do not get a "my way or the highway" vibe from him.
But that is only from my limited exposure to him online.

 

[Venom]

I said "right" or "perfect" way.
There is a big difference in meaning between those two words and "my way or the highway."

To answer you, no, I do not get a "my way or the highway" vibe from him.
But that is only from my limited exposure to him online.

"my way or the high way" implies a degree of confrontation that is not necessarily present with believing in a "right" or "perfect way". So I would agree with you that I'm not so much of a "my way or the high way" person. Im not afraid of presenting what I think is right though. Ive stood up to religious teachers, econ professors, right wing and left wing extremists...and peguy







(peguy: i hope you realize that i'm kidding)

 

[Jaguar]

Ive stood up to religious teachers, econ professors, right wing and left wing extremists...and peguy

 

[PeaceBaby]

Im not afraid of presenting what I think is right though. Ive stood up to religious teachers, econ professors, right wing and left wing extremists...

How do you feel when you do this? Describe your internal state and the external expression of it to me.

 

[Venom]

How do you feel when you do this? Describe your internal state and the external expression of it to me.

I feel more like a messenger to those listening, than a debater with the person I'm arguing with. I feel like I'm able to pick out the "secret world view" that lies behind what the speaker is espousing, a worldview that the listeners might not actually/nor should they believe in (and they oughta know!). Its not so much that I have an urge to tell someone they are wrong. Its more that I worry about the minds around me being mislead. There are times though, where even if I know the people around me don't believe in the "secret worldview" behind what is being espoused, I'll let it continue (if I believe its for their own good).

If I know that my speaking up won't change anyone's mind, then I wont even bother speaking up. I will just sit there and bite my lip.

Internally, I just feel compelled to say something. Externally, I first take inventory to see if its even worth it (will people listen), and then I either bite my lip, or speak up to provide information.

 

[VagrantFarce]

How can this "secret worldview" be interpreted as anything but raging, unequivocal Ni!

Step 1: Go to User Control Panel
Step 2: Go to Edit Your Details
Step 3: Select the MBTI Type box
Step 4: Bash these keys on your keyboard with your forehead: E, N, F, J
Step 5: Press "Save Changes"
Step 6: ??
Step 7: PROFIT

 

[PeaceBaby]

OK, good.

How do you feel emotionally, generally speaking (realizing that different scenarios could evoke unique responses) - excited, nervous, conflicted (should you or should you not speak), relaxed, contemplative, scared, self-conscious ...

You get the idea. Expand this part.

How can this "secret worldview" be interpreted as anything but raging, unequivocal Ni!

LOL, good post.

Remember though that Babylon has been pondering this question for so long that he knows the lingo that accompanies any and all possible MBTI types and could use it consciously or unconsciously to steer towards any outcome. Don't rely on a word or phrase to hang a function on.

His knowledge is a hindrance here and we needs to catch him unawares ...

 

[Venom]

OK, good.

How do you feel emotionally, generally speaking (realizing that different scenarios could evoke unique responses) - excited, nervous, conflicted (should you or should you not speak), relaxed, contemplative, scared, self-conscious ...

I feel nervous when what I'm saying basically comes down to secretly telling people they are stupid/immature (a lot of those thoughts I've learned to keep inside). I would say this is evidence of "feeling conflicted", but I actually never feel conflicted on this (I have learned to know whether I should say it or not).

I'm excited if I know those around me will at least be receptive, or if I feel its for their own good. I obviously get scared if I know some people will forever think of me differently for saying what I say (I generally weigh that before hand though).

I think feeling self conscious, or relaxed, just has to do with the frequency that you speak up (I have learned that the people around me in my current life have no further interests except drinking and bars...so I dont speak up as much any more because I know that I would never be able to affect anyone's thought process).