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  1. #11
    Senior Member Kristiana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel View Post
    ADD/ADHD basically equals ENxP with strong preferences in those three letters. When I first got into MBTI, it was kind of funny to read how ENTP was "normal" yet similar characteristics could be classified separately as a "disorder". I know a lot of ESxPs get the diagnosis as well, but the whole thing is BS.

    The modern school system is outdated, and as more technology comes into kids' lives, the ADD/ADHD diagnosis helps teachers keep the children in line by medicating them. But fewer and fewer jobs require the stand in line, don't talk out of turn, do what you're told mentality of the education factories most children still attend. Adult ADD is an even bigger joke because it's just an excuse for failure for people who are in the wrong profession.

    I guess meds and the diagnosis are good for the ENTP/"ADHD" guy who wants to be a tax accountant, or for the ENFP/"ADHD" girl who wants to be a benefits administrator, and I've read some of the ADD tip books to help stay organized. But the diagnosis makes as much sense as medicating ISTJs for Attention Surplus Syndrome because their paintings aren't very inspiring.
    Nice acronym
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  2. #12
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halfjillhalfjack View Post
    Hey,

    I've been thinking that it seems possible that psychological problems could influence how you test or are typed by other people, but do you happen to know if especially ADD and Asperger's Syndrome can influence how people test on e.g. the cognitive functions test or other MBTI-related tools?
    Thanks a lot in advice!
    What comes around goes around.

  3. #13
    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triglav View Post
    Aspergers and ADHD aren't pathological, the traits they represent are simply personality traits.
    That's like saying "cystic fibrosis and sickle cell anaemia aren't pathological, the traits they represent are simply lung and blood traits".

    Any trait that causes harm or impairment is pathological by definition. These harmful traits are also known as conditions.

  4. #14
    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nigel Tufnel View Post
    ADD/ADHD basically equals ENxP with strong preferences in those three letters. When I first got into MBTI, it was kind of funny to read how ENTP was "normal" yet similar characteristics could be classified separately as a "disorder". I know a lot of ESxPs get the diagnosis as well, but the whole thing is BS.

    The modern school system is outdated, and as more technology comes into kids' lives, the ADD/ADHD diagnosis helps teachers keep the children in line by medicating them. But fewer and fewer jobs require the stand in line, don't talk out of turn, do what you're told mentality of the education factories most children still attend. Adult ADD is an even bigger joke because it's just an excuse for failure for people who are in the wrong profession.

    I guess meds and the diagnosis are good for the ENTP/"ADHD" guy who wants to be a tax accountant, or for the ENFP/"ADHD" girl who wants to be a benefits administrator, and I've read some of the ADD tip books to help stay organized. But the diagnosis makes as much sense as medicating ISTJs for Attention Surplus Syndrome because their paintings aren't very inspiring.
    Guess again. I'm diagnosed with ADHD, and am most definitely introverted. Not being able to keep still because any movement at all helps boost dopamine levels and normalise abnormal brain wave activity, and not being able to maintain focus because of a poor short-term memory and other cognitive deficits, have nothing to do with extroversion. Extroverts do not have the same cognitive profile as ADHD patients. A need to move and fidget constantly in order to think in anything resembling a straight line has nothing to do with the degree to which your attention is directed outwards vs. inwards.

    I know plenty of of ENXPs and all of them are perfectly capable of functioning to the best of their intellectual abilities at various work, school and domestic settings without accommodations, medication and cognitive-behavioural therapies. I am not. I'm still no where near fulfilling my potential with all that help and more. I can't even hold down unskilled manual labour because of cognitive deficits making me too slow in fast-paced environments and because of the poor co-ordination and spatial awareness that more often than not accompanies ADHD. I'd be reasonably suited to many less physical, fast-paced occupations but you need formal qualifications for those and I've only ever gotten so far with them due to the same cognitive deficits making post-high school formal education a disaster, with its timed this that and everything else and 'read/listen to this huge dense monologue without being distracted by the breathing of your neighbour or the very knowledge that there are other humans in this room'.

    The fact that people think you can have ADHD and function normally, when by definition you can't, is highly unfortunate because it leads to the trivialisation and ignoring of a condition that untreated is associated with a frightening list of eventual complications from self-medication with drugs, alcohol and over-eating to borderline personality disorder and suicide. Please educate yourselves before you spread potentially deadly misconceptions. If I hadn't learned of ADHD and sought help when did I think it very likely I'd have given up or be in a mental hospital by now.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by compulsiverambler View Post
    That's like saying "cystic fibrosis and sickle cell anaemia aren't pathological, the traits they represent are simply lung and blood traits".

    Any trait that causes harm or impairment is pathological by definition. These harmful traits are also known as conditions.
    Aspergers or ADD cause the same amount of harm and impairment as someone who enjoys sweets or is lazy. Should we give people chemicals for lazyness now? It's a personality trait, nothing more.

  6. #16
    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triglav View Post
    Aspergers or ADD cause the same amount of harm and impairment as someone who enjoys sweets or is lazy. Should we give people chemicals for lazyness now? It's a personality trait, nothing more.
    No they don't. They don't even compare. That's incredible ignorance. If you're so sure try giving yourself ADHD - brain injury in later life will do it - weak short-term memory, emotional dysregulation, unreliable impulse inhibition, most and occasionally all of it. Statistically, you'll probably find yourself having more accidents, including serious accidents, more episodes of depression and anxiety disorders and from an earlier age, and an 80% chance of developing insomnia by middle age. Incidentally you'll also find yourself more likely to be overweight and have trouble losing weight because ADHD is one of the many problems that people self-medicate with food.

    Whereas eating too much, while often contributed to by mental conditions including ADHD, in and of itself is not a problem with anywhere near the hideously long list of long-term correlations untreated ADHD has. It's possible to be lazy and eat too much while functioning as just well as you want to and enjoying life unimpaired by it. When these habits do become so extreme they significantly affect quality of life then yes of course they should be reversed if possible, and sometimes that's helped by treating underlying psychological problems leading to self-destructive behaviours. Obese people with ADHD have been found to lose weight much more successfully when their ADHD is treated, just as obese people do when any other contributing mental condition such as major depression is treated.

    Exposure to cigarette smoke or alcohol in the womb, premature birth (even very mildly premature), small size at birth, higher than average lead or mercury levels (not often even high enough to be officially classed as poisoning yet but higher than is found in non-ADHDers none-the-less) all these things are among the most common contributing factors in ADHD, along with genetic neurological, metabolic and immune differences.

    These and many rarer environmental contributing factors are all recognised as being bad for someone's long-term health in other ways, and there is no doubt that they frequently cause subtle-to-moderate damage to the brain, which happens to be smaller in all the main areas in ADHD patients regardless of IQ. When an impairing personality trait is associated with things that are known to damage the brain, and with a smaller brain especially in areas most vulnerable to perinatal complications, I don't see how you can possibly argue that it's not a condition that needs treating.

  7. #17
    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    Of course ADD/ADHD can affect test scores.
    Blue is my favorite color.
    HEY! That's a nice watch you're wearing!
    Let's go get some food, I'm hungry... :rolli:
    LOL, that's also true. I'm very curious about how I'd score yet still haven't managed to complete those cognitive functions tests. They just seem to never end. I can't complete many tasks in one sitting, let alone anything that intense, and you have to do them in one sitting.

  8. #18
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    You're wrong.

  9. #19
    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triglav View Post
    You're wrong.
    Wow, even Creationists do better than that. And they're more fun.

  10. #20
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    I have penis cancer and I can assure you that it causes multiple sclerosis.

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