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  1. #31
    HAHHAHHAH! INTJ123's Avatar
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    this is so weird, but as I was reading your post I remembered my whole dream from last night, and my dream had to do with MBTI! I'm off to write it down now in a dream journal I planned on making.

    and yea, I think it's completely possible to slide over to infj, I went from intj to intx now over the course of like 5 years?

  2. #32
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Tater View Post
    I would like to begin by simply stating that I am new to these forums. So, hello!

    I have taken the MBTI several times in the past year. I was initially typed as an INFP before retaking it to get INFJ. Both of the archetypes resonate with me, thus I label myself as an INFX. Furthermore, my Ni is just as strong as my Ne, and they are often interchangeable depending on what I feel like.

    However, upon thoughtful consideration, I have recently begun to organize my life as an INFJ would. After all, I have now left the mess that is my parents house, both of whom are "P" types. I have also noticed that, by doing this, my Ni is becoming more dominant than my Ne; and it is truly empowering to be able to move to conclusions more readily than I used to.

    So, I ask you. Is it possible for a young adult to "change" his or her type?

    Regardless of your answer, I am still going to strive to become more "J" like in order to harness and categorize my environment.

    PS - Don't give me that damned infjorinfp link. The woman who made is it batshit crazy.
    Two things--

    1) Obviously since you're having difficulty deciding, bullshit formulaic "tests" are not going to offer any more significant insight, so ignore anyone who tells you they will. Functional strength "tests" do not actually test your non-preferred functions, but rather the ability of your preferred functions to imitate them.

    2) Describe your definitions of Fi, Fe, Ni, and Ne. There may be some conceptual misunderstanding in what these actually are. I'm not saying it's impossible, but having equal Ne and Ni is very difficult and quite unusual, and typically results from learned skills--but your type is not based on learned skills; it's based on natural inclinations. If you write out what each of these functions means to you, it may give us some more insight into your type.

    Perhaps one most basic question to determine INFP/INFJ would be:

    Do you consider ethics/attaining the most ethical viewpoint possible to be a goal in itself? For INFPs, Fi's morality comes entirely from within and is self-validated according to arbitrary internal standards. Fi wants to possess perfect internal ethical understanding as an end unto itself (even if it doesn't directly apply to anything external...Fi is objectively certain of what is moral and what is not, and neither wants nor requires any external validation for it.)

    Or do you consider ethics merely as a means to an end? INFJs use Fe, which needs external validation for its ethical beliefs. For INFJs, morality is merely a means to some other goal, and is defined according to external community standards. There is no rigid internal conception of ethics because ethics exist only to facilitate communication and cooperation between people in order to complete external world goals--Fe requires that it serve an external purpose.

    Does any of that help at all?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by SciVo View Post
    A better question would be how we describe Fi, since if you didn't click with my description of Ni then it probably isn't even in your top half. Please just take this test.
    Cognitive Process Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
    extraverted Sensing (Se) *************** (15.6)
    unused
    introverted Sensing (Si) ************************ (24.9)
    average use
    extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************************** (38.1)
    excellent use
    introverted Intuiting (Ni) ****************************************** (42.1)
    excellent use
    extraverted Thinking (Te) ********************** (22.9)
    limited use
    introverted Thinking (Ti) ********************************* (33.9)
    good use
    extraverted Feeling (Fe) ***************************** (29.1)
    average use
    introverted Feeling (Fi) ********************************* (33.8)
    good use

    Hmm, last time I took this test I typed as an INFJ. I am tired right now, so this probably isn't the best time to evaluate myself.

  4. #34
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Two things--

    1) Obviously since you're having difficulty deciding, bullshit formulaic "tests" are not going to offer any more significant insight, so ignore anyone who tells you they will. Functional strength "tests" do not actually test your non-preferred functions, but rather the ability of your preferred functions to imitate them.
    Or, really, what functions you want to use. And once you know about functions, these tests are so easy to manipulate both consciously and unconsciously. They're worthless then. If I want to think I use lots of Fi, and I'm taking a cognitive functions test, guess what I will do? Click all of the responses that correspond to Fi. Now I have high Fi...yeah, not actually.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Two things--

    1) Obviously since you're having difficulty deciding, bullshit formulaic "tests" are not going to offer any more significant insight, so ignore anyone who tells you they will. Functional strength "tests" do not actually test your non-preferred functions, but rather the ability of your preferred functions to imitate them.

    2) Describe your definitions of Fi, Fe, Ni, and Ne. There may be some conceptual misunderstanding in what these actually are. I'm not saying it's impossible, but having equal Ne and Ni is very difficult and quite unusual, and typically results from learned skills--but your type is not based on learned skills; it's based on natural inclinations. If you write out what each of these functions means to you, it may give us some more insight into your type.

    Perhaps one most basic question to determine INFP/INFJ would be:

    Do you consider ethics/attaining the most ethical viewpoint possible to be a goal in itself? For INFPs, Fi's morality comes entirely from within and is self-validated according to arbitrary internal standards. Fi wants to possess perfect internal ethical understanding as an end unto itself (even if it doesn't directly apply to anything external...Fi is objectively certain of what is moral and what is not, and neither wants nor requires any external validation for it.)

    Or do you consider ethics merely as a means to an end? INFJs use Fe, which needs external validation for its ethical beliefs. For INFJs, morality is merely a means to some other goal, and is defined according to external community standards. There is no rigid internal conception of ethics because ethics exist only to facilitate communication and cooperation between people in order to complete external world goals--Fe requires that it serve an external purpose.

    Does any of that help at all?
    Yes, it does. I'm going to come back tomorrow afternoon and revive this thread, because I'm simply too tired to type myself.

    Ni basically deals with the past and the present, from what I just read.
    Ne deals with all of the possibilities in order to eventually form a conclusion.
    Fi basically enforces an internal ethical code.
    Fe projects the users consciousness upon other people in order to empathize with them. Otherwise known as compassion.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    Why not? I think Fi is a very interesting function, and not just "I like/don't like." Have you tried out ENFP? You're not "coding" as INFJ to me (sez Ni).

    My description is to be continued. I'm working on le grand Ni delineation. It may take awhile.
    I'm not an extrovert. I keep to myself most of the time, and in the past I have had social anxiety. It's not as bad now, but I'm still a loner. When I'm with a group of people, I feel the need to bring them together, whether it be by ideology or just getting something done. As far as I'm concerned, fighting just impedes progress and hurts people. For the most part, it's pointless.

    We should all work toward a common goal out of love and respect for one another instead of pointlessly bickering. I am a registered independent because I refuse to choose political "stances", and my favorite color is purple because it represents a harmony between both red and blue.

    Ok, now that I've gotten that off my shoulders, I'm going to sleep.

  7. #37
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Tater View Post
    Yes, it does. I'm going to come back tomorrow afternoon and revive this thread, because I'm simply too tired to type myself.

    Ni basically deals with the past and the present, from what I just read.
    Ne deals with all of the possibilities in order to eventually form a conclusion.
    Fi basically enforces an internal ethical code.
    Fe projects the users consciousness upon other people in order to empathize with them. Otherwise known as compassion.
    Those are extremely oversimplified/rather inaccurate definitions.

    Ne - Ne is concerned with exploring new patterns and combinations in the external world, replacing what is with what might be. Ne seeks to change and redefine everything about the external world approach; it most often manifests itself in the form of an attitude along the lines of: "If we've done it this way before, that's a great reason to try it a different way this time." Ne is the process of leaping in on a whim and exploring the theoretical implications of every system it can find in the outer world, just for the sake of discovery--"What does this complex series of buttons do?"

    The downside is that Ne requires external validation for its ideas. It wants to show others the connections and the discoveries that it's made and for others to understand them too. (For instance, Ne poets and songwriters will typically write distinctly solvable patterns and puzzles into their lyrics, wanting the reader/listener to connect the dots and discover the meaning in the subtext. They WANT you to get it they way they do.)



    Ni - Ni also involves a redefinition of perspective, but only in terms of one's own personal interpretation of it. Ni tries to back up one step further and discover the flaws it in its own perceptive approach--how might the assumptions I am making based on my perceptions be misleading or incomplete?

    Ni requires no external validation for its ideas and discoveries because it never interacts directly with the external world. Ni doesn't really care whether or not you understand--it reasons, "I can see the connections in my head and it makes sense to me, and since you are not me and cannot experience reality in just the way I do, you won't get it and I gain nothing from attempting to explain to you."

    Unfortunately, given the total lack of emphasis on the external world's approval, Ni gone awry results in a lot of bizarre conspiracy theories because it's convinced that everything is entirely in how you look at it. Ni is not very good at picking up on abstract patterns in the external world, as it doesn't work well with the external world at all--Ni users (NJ types) leave that up to Te or Fe.

    To Ni, truth is but a frame of reference. There is no objective truth until an external goal or set of rules has been defined: If there was, how would we know our perception of it was not deceiving us?

    Often Ne is so busy playing with patterns and toying around with the formula to create something new that it overemphasizes originality/creativity at the cost of other values which may be more important.

    Ni writers don't typically care whether or not you or anyone else can pick up the exact meaning in their words--they're not interested in any external validation of their perceptions, so often their writing will be impossibly abstruse and often totally meaningless to anyone else who doesn't share that Ni user's exact perspective. But Ni doesn't care if anyone else gets it.

    Ne may forget to ask: "Why do I need to solve this puzzle/win this game/complete this pattern/derive this formula? What purpose will this actually serve and how might my perception of its importance be skewed?" These are questions best answered by Ni, a function in which most P types are tragically lacking.

    It's often said that Ne is so far outside the box that it doesn't even know where the box is. Ni is standing just outside the box and looking back in on it, wondering about why the box is set up the way it is and what that might imply about the people who put it there. To Ni, Ne users often just seem like pattern monkeys--very useful for generating new and unique combinations of ideas, but not very good at seeing the ultimate big picture.

    I'll get to Fe and Fi later; I think I've written some older posts on them which I might be able to find.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  8. #38
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Tater View Post
    I'm not an extrovert. I keep to myself most of the time, and in the past I have had social anxiety. It's not as bad now, but I'm still a loner. When I'm with a group of people, I feel the need to bring them together, whether it be by ideology or just getting something done. As far as I'm concerned, fighting just impedes progress and hurts people. For the most part, it's pointless.

    We should all work toward a common goal out of love and respect for one another instead of pointlessly bickering. I am a registered independent because I refuse to choose political "stances", and my favorite color is purple because it represents a harmony between both red and blue.

    Ok, now that I've gotten that off my shoulders, I'm going to sleep.
    Yes, I'll definitely agree with INFP.

  9. #39
    Senior Member whimsical's Avatar
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    im like this too dont worry

    just call yourself unique
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Ni requires no external validation for its ideas and discoveries because it never interacts directly with the external world. Ni doesn't really care whether or not you understand--it reasons, "I can see the connections in my head and it makes sense to me, and since you are not me and cannot experience reality in just the way I do, you won't get it and I gain nothing from attempting to explain to you."
    Introverted intuition is useless without new information being supplied to it, which is why you'll always find it paired with extroverted sensing. Same is true of every other function in every type.

    To illustrate how this relationship works, look at a car's engine. By itself, the engine can do nothing, no matter how much potential it has. In order to work properly, it must have a fuel line attached to it. This fuel line takes in fuel from an outside source, and supplies it to the engine as it needs it. At the same time, the engine itself regulates how much new fuel needs to be supplied to get the maximum possible output. As long as the engine and fuel line do their jobs, the car as a whole will function the way it's supposed to.

    This is how MBTI type functions work. In the INFJ example, Se and Fe give new data about the external world to Ni and Ti, respectively. Ni and Ti then regulate how much data they need from Se and Fe to form new thoughts and ideas about the goings-on in the external world. Ni and Fe, being the more dominant functions, are then moderated by Se and Ti, preventing the INF from becoming a hypersensitive recluse.

    To know for sure which INF type you are, examine how you relay facts and explanations to people. INFPs tend to be more visual and more poetic than INFJs, often prone to using illustrations to explain their theories and ideas. Kind of like how I did above. And in most of the discussions I've posted in on TypoC since signing up.

    *researches, reflects, reevaluates* *changes J to P*

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