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  1. #1
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Question Am I a sensor or intuitive?

    Ok you guys, I need some help. I don't know if I'm a sensor or intuitive anymore. This post is inspired by an excellent post on Ptgatsby's blog.

    Aside from trying to figure out what my pure default position is, I found a previous post Jennifer made about sensing and intuiting. I have no doubt that I'm an EFJ, but now I'm confused whether my perceiving function is introverted sensing or introverted intuition.

    Here's where I stack up on S and N according to the info in Jen's post:

    Sensing
    tangible
    likes exact facts
    sensible
    focus on effectiveness
    pragmatic
    results oriented
    realistic
    empirical
    facts are valuable
    accepting

    Intuiting
    figurative
    symbolic
    likes original ideas
    imaginative
    focuses on novelty
    ideas oriented
    enjoys knowledge for its own sake
    facts make patterns
    big picture
    values inventiveness

    Deciding between which of the descriptors is not just a matter of simple forced choice. I feel like I do these things equally and I don't know which ones are my default. For example, I like to learn things just to know but I also like to apply what I've learned. When reading descriptions, deciding between the ESFJ and ENFJ is a less difficult, I think ENFJ is more accurate but my perception could be skewed because of dominant Fe. I mean look at the descriptions, would you rather be this

    People love ENFJs. They are fun to be with, and truly understand and love people. They are typically very straight-forward and honest. Usually ENFJs exude a lot of self-confidence, and have a great amount of ability to do many different things. They are generally bright, full of potential, energetic and fast-paced. They are usually good at anything which captures their interest.
    Or this:
    ESFJs respect and believe in the laws and rules of authority, and believe that others should do so as well. They're traditional, and prefer to do things in the established way, rather than venturing into unchartered territory. Their need for security drives their ready acceptance and adherence to the policies of the established system. This tendency may cause them to sometimes blindly accept rules without questioning or understanding them.
    Such a hard decision.
    I'm not trying to figure out which description fits me more accurately, I want to figure what my perceiving function is. I can read descriptions on my own and I have at least a dozen books chock full of descriptions and I've reached the conclusion that the descriptions are bullshit.

    I also have been doing some research in the NEO-PI (five factor model) and looking at the openness scores. I took a web version of the test and had high openness, but I don't know if I was testing to get a certain score.

    Another thing is I may be resistant to actually being a sensor. Pt went over the reasons in his blog, but when I think about it if I'm a sensor, it's going to take me a while to break the stereotypes that have accumulated in my mind about sensors. Even though I've railed so loudly against sensor stereotypes I still very much see it in action IRL and that scares me to think that I may be part of that group, that people may view me in that way. I don't think being a sensor is bad as long as I'm not it, get it? I know, quite hypocritical of me. When you suddenly become part of that group then you keep thinking to yourself, hey that's not me! Or at least I do, and I don't want to be labeled in that way. I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with being a sensor, but when I see Sensors Behaving Badly, I want to run in the opposite direction, although I feel the same way when intuitives do it. Since I don't have enough intuitives in my life to make it obvious the only times I see Intuitives Behaving Badly is on MBTI forums. I know how the internet causes people to do things that they normally wouldn't do so such more for that.

    In the end I know that it's going to be my choice and nobody else can tell me what I am or what I'm not. I'm just curious about other people's input.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  2. #2
    Senior Member nottaprettygal's Avatar
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    A couple of the areas in Jen's post that are used to describe Sensors seem like they could also be used to describe Judgers as well. Practicality and being realistic seem common to both Sensing and Intuitive Js.

    So. . . I guess that doesn't help.

  3. #3
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nottaprettygal View Post
    A couple of the areas in Jen's post that are used to describe Sensors seem like they could also be used to describe Judgers as well. Practicality and being realistic seem common to both Sensing and Intuitive Js.
    You're right, there's very much some overlap there; it seems to be one of the typical points of confusion.

    I don't know, PM. Couldn't you just be happy being an ExFJ? <hopeful>
    no, i guess not... you're a J, not a P...

    I will think more about it. Motivation is as important as behavior; sometimes outer behavior can overlap, but the motivation helps determine what functions are being used. I had completely forgotten about posting that chart. It's very much a generalized "either/or" style chart, which is hard to apply unless one is extreme.

    Regardless of which you are, PM, I just wanted to say that you are a mature example of the type -- either an S with good flexibility/open-mindedness enough to respond to changing circumstances, or an N who can really seize upon opportunities with practical clarity.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #4
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    I'm fairly sure you're an Intuitive. I'm very aware of rules and traditions at times, but I value inner visions more. Fe by nature tends to accord with customs and such. A lot of the things on your Sensing list seem to have more to do with your Extraversion, and Judging. Now tell me, are you more focused on tangible memories of the past as standards, or on visions that you feel compelled to act on or explain? Also, what do you normally test as on the personality sorters? That's how you decide.

  5. #5
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    I think based on your other posts that you are an N who is very close to the border between the preferences.

    I am certainly that way with the J/P preference.

    ETA: You came out very close on all functions on this test, makes me think you are just well balanced between the functions.

  6. #6
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nottaprettygal View Post
    A couple of the areas in Jen's post that are used to describe Sensors seem like they could also be used to describe Judgers as well. Practicality and being realistic seem common to both Sensing and Intuitive Js.

    So. . . I guess that doesn't help.
    Yeah, also, you have to remember that the S vs. N is a gradient and thus you're going to have overlap; it's just a preference.

    For instance, as an INTJ, I am pretty well balanced on these descriptors.

    SENSING............................INTUITIVE

    Concrete...........................Abstract
    - Literal..........................- Figurative
    - Tangible.........................- Symbolic
    - Likes exact facts................- Likes original ideas

    Realistic..........................Imaginative
    - Sensible.........................- Ingenious
    - Matter of fact...................- Imaginative
    - Focuses on effectiveness.........- Focuses on novelty

    Practical..........................Inferential
    - Pragmatic........................- Scholarly
    - Results-oriented.................- Ideas-oriented
    - Enjoys applied interests.........- Enjoys knowledge for its own sake

    Experiential.......................Theoretical
    - Realistic........................- Conceptual
    - Empirical........................- Big picture
    - Facts are valuable experiences...- Facts make patterns

    Traditional.........................Original
    - Conventional......................- Unconventional
    - Accepting.........................- Idiosyncratic
    - Values established institutions...- Values inventiveness

    My suggestion: try reading a bunch of the specific 1/16 descriptors (as in, a few different explanations of each type) and seeing what you really identify with. I really like the murraystate explanations.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  7. #7
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    Actually, what she has listed on Sensing is pretty much Sensing.

    A Judger isn't necessarily results-oriented, and neither is the Extravert.

    Judging and Perception is simply the preference for living. Judgers enjoy structure and habit, Perceivers are more adaptable and enjoy new experiences.

    Now notice that structure isn't necessarily related to physical structure as in keeping things in the environment in order. Keeping the environment orderly seems to be more specifically an SJ thing. A work ethic also falls into the domain of SJ, since work is both a here-and-now and routine activity.

    The NJ, on the other hand, is less conscientious about that sort of thing, but requires habit to conserve the safety of the mind. NJs resist change lest they become insane.

    Note, too, that Sensors, who concentrate and are used to the here-and-now tend to be more adaptable to changing circumstances. Even the SJ has less trouble adapting, because rather than panic, they are able to adapt to the change by relating it to a past experience.

    The Intuitives, want to make the changes. They exercise a certain element of creative control. The NJ, in particular, has trouble adapting, because unlike the SJ, it isn't their natural style to rely on past experience.

    In the face of change, the SJ may still be cautious, but will think: "Well, I survived a change last time, I don't see why I can't survive it this time." The NJ will not normally relate their concrete experience to the here-and-now. The NJ's past experience speaks for itself and state, "Just because it worked last time doesn't mean it'll work this time." As a result, when the NJ is in the face of change out of their control, it becomes a matter of worrying what might happen. This is particularly troubling if the NJ sees the glass as half-empty.

    In the case of who focuses on usefulness, I think that's more a factor of Thinking. More skeptical in nature, the Thinker is often more realistic than the Feeler and focuses on practicality regardless of S or N preference.

    For example: The Thinker would probably run down the street naked if offered a million dollars (give me a break, it's an example). The Feeler would dismiss this act as immoral and/or a total lack of self-respect. The Thinker is more logical, and would think it's stupid to not do something foolish for something that would, in the end, make life easier for a while.

  8. #8
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by athenian200 View Post
    ...are you more focused on tangible memories of the past as standards, or on visions that you feel compelled to act on or explain? Also, what do you normally test as on the personality sorters? That's how you decide.
    I don't know, I don't feel particularly connected to the past. I rarely get nostalgic or wish to go back to some previous experience, I think I'm forward looking.

    Here are some things I think may help:
    • I rarely rewatch movies or TV shows, once I've watched them that's usually it for me
    • I'm not very good at holding melodies or music in my memory
    • I only need to go to a new place a couple of times before I remember how to get there
    • I know when my body isn't doing what it normally does
    • While I don't keep track of what people wear, I usually notice if someone changes their hair color or has lost weight
    • I rarely read books to completion and I only skim instructions. I try to put it together first and if I mess up then I look at directions
    • I'm not afraid to try new things or go new places
    • While I use vivid and colorful language when I'm telling a story I tend to ramble and not get to the point very quickly
    • I sometimes see people doing things. I'm not saying psychically or anything, but sometimes I get flashes of people doing stuff and when they do something similar I'm not surprised
    • I like structure but I don't like routine
    • I don't take very many pictures, either I remember it or I don't but I usually do
    • I've had physical reactions to people that I know I'm not going to like upon meeting them, usually my stomach starts to hurt or I feel nauseous but it goes away as quickly as it came
    • I have a tendency to tell people what they're going to do rather than let them do it. This isn't being bossy, I just tell them I know what they're going to do. I'm not always right.
    • I overcomplicate things
    • I'd rather do preventative maintenance then problem solve and I think I'm good at damage control
    • I'm not a pack rat. I don't feel like I have very many emotional attachments to objects and I have a tendency to throw things away that I'll need again.
    • I like repetitive things. When I worked in retail, I liked to fold the t-shirts and I like to photocopy large amounts of stuff. I thought I did this because I'd go on auto-pilot, but I don't know.
    • I know if someone has moved around my stuff because it's not the way I left it


    I guess that's enough for now, I tried to scan my brain for everything I could think of.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer View Post
    Note, too, that Sensors, who concentrate and are used to the here-and-now tend to be more adaptable to changing circumstances. Even the SJ has less trouble adapting, because rather than panic, they are able to adapt to the change by relating it to a past experience.

    The Intuitives, want to make the changes. They exercise a certain element of creative control. The NJ, in particular, has trouble adapting, because unlike the SJ, it isn't their natural style to rely on past experience.

    In the face of change, the SJ may still be cautious, but will think: "Well, I survived a change last time, I don't see why I can't survive it this time." The NJ will not normally relate their concrete experience to the here-and-now. The NJ's past experience speaks for itself and state, "Just because it worked last time doesn't mean it'll work this time." As a result, when the NJ is in the face of change out of their control, it becomes a matter of worrying what might happen. This is particularly troubling if the NJ sees the glass as half-empty.
    If I use the example of somebody's behavior, I'm more likely to think that if they've done it repeatedly in the past there's no reason for me to think they're going to stop doing it in the future. I don't have a problem with thinking that if it worked before, there's no reason why it won't work now. To me it seems obvious to use a proven solution that fixes a problem then to start wasting time, energy, and effort on a new solution that may or may not work. Now when the old solution doesn't work I think you should be receptive to a new way of doing things and it annoys me that people try to keep doing the same thing that isn't working instead of trying something else, but the FIRST thing you should look at is what has worked well in the past and move from there.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  9. #9
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    I wish I could just watch you for a day, PM, and see how you interact with people.

    I do fairly well perceiving a type when I can just observe someone [holistically], but it's difficult when I just get a list (especially if some of the items are S and some are N) -- I am more interested in how the components work together and are integrated than how they stand separately.

    And N's and S's tend to put out different "vibes." I know that sounds very very vague and unhelpful; but honestly, when I watch people interact with others in person, I almost immediately get either an "S" or an "N" vibe off them... There is just an expansiveness/breadth that comes with N, versus a clarity on the surrounding world that comes with S.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #10
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    I'm abandoning hope of having this all sorted out by bedtime.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

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