User Tag List

First 678910 Last

Results 71 to 80 of 103

  1. #71
    Member Eye of the Potato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Socionics
    IEE
    Posts
    99

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    YES. I agree. The manner. Not trying to put something on.



    Yes exactly! These are exactly how I felt too.



    Lol, that one threw me for a loop too.




    Like I've already said, no, I did not listen to the whole video, and I did not make the argument that she wasn't ENFP. I just said that she makes me think Fe.



    Actually, I have seen that video. I don't lack understanding in typology, though of course I am not naive enough to claim I know everything, either. I don't feel like you can necessarily grasp an accurate type out of one video, even though there may be many clues. There are so many overlapping correlations and patterns that it can be difficult to determine the exact combination of factors that resulted in it, and I am surprised that you are so sure of your conclusions.



    I'm not an ENFJ. I've gone through years of figuring out my type and I'm 110% certain of ENFP, even though my next best-fit is probably ESFJ, whereas many other ENFPs would probably relate to ENTP or INFP first. I think being an enneagram 6 has a big impact on me, as does Social-first, but my cognitive process is E-N-F-P through and through.
    What parts of the enfj and esfj descriptions don't fit you?
    The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself.

  2. #72
    Member Eye of the Potato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Socionics
    IEE
    Posts
    99

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    You wasted your time mate in all honesty. I came to type myself through years of cognitive function study. I'm not going to waste any time just buying into the Forer Effect inherent in the type descriptions. I neither asked nor needed assistance in the matter. I was merely after some popcorn entertainment on Youtube.

    P.S. You didn't mean this response for someone else did you? I have no idea why you mentioned socionics.
    Because Socionics got the function order right and Myers Briggs fucked it up. And to clear up the confusion between the two systems.
    Yeah I suppose I went off on a tangent. Sue me.

    So if you studied the functions and came to the conclusion you're an mbti infp, then that must mean you believe yourself to be Fi, Ne. That's what I was asking.
    It's important to make that distinction.

    The forer effect only applies if you have low self awareness.

    From my observations on this site and PerC. Most people don't understand the cognitive functions at all. So when they base their type on functions that they don't even understand, they make a mess of it. Myers Briggs didn't help this situation because of the way they messed with the function order for the introverts.
    That's why I asked are you this


    creative, smart, focus on fantasy more than reality, attracted to sad things, fears doing the wrong thing, observer, avoidant, fears drawing attention to self, anxious, cautious, somewhat easily frightened, easily offended, private, easily hurt, socially uncomfortable, emotionally moody, does not like to be looked at, fearful, perfectionist, can sabotage self, can be wounded at the core, values solitude, guarded, does not like crowds, organized, second guesses self, more likely to support marijuana legalization, focuses on peoples hidden motives, prone to crying, not competitive, prone to feelings of loneliness, not spontaneous, prone to sadness, longs for a stabilizing relationship, fears rejection in relationships, frequently worried, can feel victimized, prone to intimidation, lower energy, strict with self



    or this




    creative, smart, idealist, attracted to sad things, disorganized, avoidant, can be overwhelmed by unpleasant feelings, prone to quitting, prone to feelings of loneliness, ambivalent of the rules, solitary, daydreams about people to maintain a sense of closeness, focus on fantasies, acts without planning, low self confidence, emotionally moody, can feel defective, prone to lateness, likes esoteric things, wounded at the core, feels shame, frequently losing things, prone to sadness, prone to dreaming about a rescuer, disorderly, observer, easily distracted, does not like crowds, can act without thinking, private, can feel uncomfortable around others, familiar with the darkside, hermit, more likely to support marijuana legalization, can sabotage self, likes the rain, sometimes can't control fearful thoughts, prone to crying, prone to regret, attracted to the counter culture, can be submissive, prone to feeling discouraged, frequently second guesses self, not punctual, not always prepared, can feel victimized, prone to confusion, prone to irresponsibility, can be pessimistic
    The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself.

  3. #73
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,153

    Default

    @Eye of the Potato - I studied MBTI to determine my MBTI type. I have made no real effort to learn my socionics type nor the theory in general but the first thought that came to mind was that socionics was a mess.

  4. #74
    Member Eye of the Potato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Socionics
    IEE
    Posts
    99

    Default

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn6Pp40Za-A

    This girl describes Ni really well.

    Maybe we should throw away the terms infj and infp and just call them Ni, Fe and Fi, Ne instead, to avoid more confusion.

    Which is actually how Socionics operates. It's mbti that uses the four dichotomy's of I/E S/N F/T J/P to type someone. So if someone came to mbti by studying the functions, they are really practicing Socionics without even realising it. And the ironic thing is that the people I have come across who approach it in that way, by the functions, are the ones most opposed to Socionics. Funny that, isn't it.
    The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself.

  5. #75
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/so
    Posts
    18,086

    Default

    i don't care much for socionics either.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  6. #76
    Member Eye of the Potato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Socionics
    IEE
    Posts
    99

    Default

    I was actually banned from PerC loads of times for going to the istp forum and bumping heads with istj's ( my opposite, my conflictor) who typed themselves istp because they were going by the functions.

    Yet the istp's ( artful technicians, baddasses, The Danger, The Rebel, Clint Eastwood types etc...) were going off the type descriptions. ISTp's can't be arsed going into the details of the functions, you see. They just care that they are badasses. That's enough info for them. They value Te you see. They value the facts. Not speculation like a Ti dom ( ISTj ) would.

    So what happened was there were loads of istj's, who thought they were istp's hanging out in the istp forum giving advice to enfp's and the enfp's naturally rubbed them up the wrong way and war broke out. And it's still going on. And it pisses me off.

    I was a bit of a mess when I'd turned to PerC for advice, I will admit. So I can't blame the istj's for hating me. In case there are any istj's from that forum reading this. Sorry about all that. But you'd be a mess too, if you had no choice but to use your weakest functions all the time, for years and years with no let up. You know you would.
    The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself.

  7. #77
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,153

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eye of the Potato View Post
    I was actually banned from PerC loads of times for going to the istp forum and bumping heads with istj's ( my opposite, my conflictor) who typed themselves istp because they were going by the functions.

    Yet the istp's ( artful technicians, baddasses, The Danger, The Rebel, Clint Eastwood types etc...) were going off the type descriptions. ISTp's can't be arsed going into the details of the functions, you see. They just care that they are badasses. That's enough info for them. They value Te you see. They value the facts. Not speculation like a Ti dom ( ISTj ) would.

    So what happened was there were loads of istj's, who thought they were istp's hanging out in the istp forum giving advice to enfp's and the enfp's naturally rubbed them up the wrong way and war broke out. And it's still going on. And it pisses me off.

    I was a bit of a mess when I'd turned to PerC for advice, I will admit. So I can't blame the istj's for hating me. In case there are any istj's from that forum reading this. Sorry about all that. But you'd be a mess too, if you had no choice but to use your weakest functions all the time, for years and years with no let up. You know you would.
    I think ISTJs do end up using their inferior function a lot e.g. being forced to consider the negative possibilities of being late for work/missing a deadline etc. They live in a world of organisation and realise that order only continues when the pieces work as they should. The possible consequences of the order coming apart really fucks with their poor little heads. They make up for it however (well my little brother did) by convincing himself that he was "random" (I've been advised that convincing oneself of being competent in it is actually a common approach to one's inferior function) however his "randomness" merely consisted of him quoting random movie or game characters word to word. No attempt to make or create his own.

  8. #78
    Member Eye of the Potato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Socionics
    IEE
    Posts
    99

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    I think ISTJs do end up using their inferior function a lot e.g. being forced to consider the negative possibilities of being late for work/missing a deadline etc. They live in a world of organisation and realise that order only continues when the pieces work as they should. The possible consequences of the order coming apart really fucks with their poor little heads. They make up for it however (well my little brother did) by convincing himself that he was "random" (I've been advised that convincing oneself of being competent in it is actually a common approach to one's inferior function) however his "randomness" merely consisted of him quoting random movie or game characters word to word. No attempt to make or create his own.
    What I mean by being forced to use your inferior functions, would equate to an istj being forced to change jobs every week and that job involving empathising with people all day long, and talking about their feelings. They wouldn't be able to handle it without going a little mad. It would be a nightmare situation for an istj.

    For me, I had to take care of my sick daughter. I had no choice in the matter. It involved keeping schedules for her to take her meds, physio twice a day, scheduling hospital appointments, collecting meds from the pharmacy, housework etc. And because I was a single parent, I was at home alone most of the time going stir crazy. Enfp's need to be around people. Solitude ruins us. She's 15 now and I still have to do all that, but I have a little bit more freedom. My sanity has returned now that I have more time to myself. It's made me who I am today though, so it's not all bad.
    The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself.

  9. #79
    Chaser of Light Dr Mobius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8 sp/sx
    Posts
    820

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    @Eye of the Potato - I studied MBTI to determine my MBTI type. I have made no real effort to learn my socionics type nor the theory in general but the first thought that came to mind was that socionics was a mess.
    It is a complete mess. The thing to remember about socionics is that it is spiritualism, a religious experience; to question it is to question a divine mandate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eye of the Potato View Post
    Which is actually how Socionics operates. It's mbti that uses the four dichotomy's of I/E S/N F/T J/P to type someone. So if someone came to mbti by studying the functions, they are really practicing Socionics without even realising it. And the ironic thing is that the people I have come across who approach it in that way, by the functions, are the ones most opposed to Socionics. Funny that, isn't it.
    No they are not; people start with MBTI which is simplified on purpose; the idea behind MBTI being to reduce it down to statistically testable variables. Because unlike socionics they knew that they needed evidence for it to ever be taken seriously. Cognitive functions is an extension of MBTI, and it is different from socionics in that it admits it is all an unproven theory, dealing how people’s minds potentially work not rigidly boxing people in.

    As for people who use cognitive functions doubting you, well that is a product of learning about typology, the more you know the more you question. No one who was sat down and critically thought through MBTI, cognitive functions, enneagram, instinctual variants, and socionics can take socionics seriously. The lack of evidence is bad enough, but the absolute certainty of things like duality (which condone a quite horrid form of co-dependent relationship), VI (ever heard of something called genetics?), without a hint of an original and independent thought is terrifying.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    i don't care much for socionics either.
    That is a pretty natural reaction no one outside of the old Soviet Union takes it seriously. Extremely detailed with zero evidence to back it up, and yet its proponents are always such zealots.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eye of the Potato View Post
    I was actually banned from PerC loads of times for going to the istp forum and bumping heads with istj's ( my opposite, my conflictor) who typed themselves istp because they were going by the functions.

    Yet the istp's ( artful technicians, baddasses, The Danger, The Rebel, Clint Eastwood types etc...) were going off the type descriptions. ISTp's can't be arsed going into the details of the functions, you see. They just care that they are badasses. That's enough info for them. They value Te you see. They value the facts. Not speculation like a Ti dom ( ISTj ) would.

    So what happened was there were loads of istj's, who thought they were istp's hanging out in the istp forum giving advice to enfp's and the enfp's naturally rubbed them up the wrong way and war broke out. And it's still going on. And it pisses me off.
    To be completely honest at this point I’m not entirely sure you understand the difference between MBTI and socionics. On one hand you use the key word statistics which I believe was an MBTI test done at several universities. You then proceed to say you went into the PerC ISTP forum which is widely understood (since PerC is a MBTI forum) to be the equivalent of socionics ISTj, and then tell them there all mistyped, and getting it wrong? Why did you simply not go to the ISTJ forum? I think you may have mangled up the MBTI statistics with socionics templates, and created some bizarre hybrid.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eye of the Potato View Post
    I was a bit of a mess when I'd turned to PerC for advice, I will admit. So I can't blame the istj's for hating me. In case there are any istj's from that forum reading this. Sorry about all that. But you'd be a mess too, if you had no choice but to use your weakest functions all the time, for years and years with no let up. You know you would.
    Most people who join these forums are complete messes, the problem with socionics is that it boxes you in, sure it’s safe and comfortable, and life is so much easier when everything is so nicely tied up right? But it also stops any personal growth; I mean I bet that those thought patterns and habits that made you so miserable are still there. You would undoubtedly have detailed rationalisations as to why you do it, but no answers as to how to move past it. socionics is a cocoon at some point if you want to grow as a person you will have to leave it behind.
    “Brighter, now brighter, pay no mind to those who squint, burn with all your heat.”

  10. #80
    Member Eye of the Potato's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Socionics
    IEE
    Posts
    99

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Mobius View Post
    It is a complete mess. The thing to remember about socionics is that it is spiritualism, a religious experience; to question it is to question a divine mandate.



    No they are not; people start with MBTI which is simplified on purpose; the idea behind MBTI being to reduce it down to statistically testable variables. Because unlike socionics they knew that they needed evidence for it to ever be taken seriously. Cognitive functions is an extension of MBTI, and it is different from socionics in that it admits it is all an unproven theory, dealing how people’s minds potentially work not rigidly boxing people in.

    As for people who use cognitive functions doubting you, well that is a product of learning about typology, the more you know the more you question. No one who was sat down and critically thought through MBTI, cognitive functions, enneagram, instinctual variants, and socionics can take socionics seriously. The lack of evidence is bad enough, but the absolute certainty of things like duality (which condone a quite horrid form of co-dependent relationship), VI (ever heard of something called genetics?), without a hint of an original and independent thought is terrifying.




    That is a pretty natural reaction no one outside of the old Soviet Union takes it seriously. Extremely detailed with zero evidence to back it up, and yet its proponents are always such zealots.



    To be completely honest at this point I’m not entirely sure you understand the difference between MBTI and socionics. On one hand you use the key word statistics which I believe was an MBTI test done at several universities. You then proceed to say you went into the PerC ISTP forum which is widely understood (since PerC is a MBTI forum) to be the equivalent of socionics ISTj, and then tell them there all mistyped, and getting it wrong? Why did you simply not go to the ISTJ forum? I think you may have mangled up the MBTI statistics with socionics templates, and created some bizarre hybrid.



    Most people who join these forums are complete messes, the problem with socionics is that it boxes you in, sure it’s safe and comfortable, and life is so much easier when everything is so nicely tied up right? But it also stops any personal growth; I mean I bet that those thought patterns and habits that made you so miserable are still there. You would undoubtedly have detailed rationalisations as to why you do it, but no answers as to how to move past it. socionics is a cocoon at some point if you want to grow as a person you will have to leave it behind.
    Actually I have grown heaps in the last few years. I'm far more focused now than I ever was before. I really like the person I have become.
    And it was actually an istp who opened my eyes to everything I was doing wrong. Every single thing he pointed out where I was going wrong was on point.
    And I showed him that he is capable of being in a meaningful relationship. It didn't work out between us, because we both had issues, he didn't respect me cos I was such a mess I suppose, but he did love me and is still trying to get back with me. I don't know. Maybe in time if he grows up I might give things another go. But for now, I'm happy working on making myself happy. I know for a fact he'd be proud of how far I have come. I really do have my shit together. And it was him who woke me up to myself.

    Whatever though. Think whatever you want. This place is starting to give me a headache.
    The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself.

Similar Threads

  1. [JCF] Can You Spot It? Recognizing The 8 Cognitive Processes
    By highlander in forum Typology and Psychology Book Reviews
    Replies: 35
    Last Post: 12-17-2015, 08:18 PM
  2. Can you spot the liar?
    By gromit in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 02-17-2015, 09:27 PM
  3. Can you see the blinders?
    By coberst in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-10-2009, 01:33 PM
  4. Can You See The Patterns..?
    By wustvn in forum Arts & Entertainment
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-07-2008, 07:33 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO