User Tag List

View Poll Results: Should ISTP and ESFP both be SP Artisians grouped within the same temperament or not?

Voters
9. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    8 88.89%
  • No

    1 11.11%
12 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 17

  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    Will
    Posts
    5,927

    Default Should ISTP and ESFP both be SP Artisians grouped within the same temperament or not?

    Here's some comments of mine taken from The ESFP "stupid" myth. thread:

    I approve of this myth - even if some have higher IQs than my own (114), their orientiation to think at many levels and maintain higher focus won't ever be completely set.

    I don't think you could find one famous ESFP philosopher in the entire history (and even unknown past) of the human race!

    Still, it doesn't make them bad or unecessary people, it's just that their abilities and inclinations rest outside my zones of interest.

    Well, not only are many not interested in topics such as metaphysics, philosophy, cosmology, enlightenment, and such, but they also quite often fight against progress in those areas. If there's one thing worse than a closed-minded person, it's a closed-minded person that closes our horizons. Like I said, they have their own intelligence, but it's in things of more mundane natures.

    If an ESFP wants to tell me something of value, or better yet, let me tell them something of value, then I'll open up more; but until then, my attention remains focused elsewhere. You confuse me discounting other people with me not listening to them. I try to factor everyone's opinion, and I don't believe in destroying the rights of other people. We each deserve chances to be heard out and acknowledged, but some people (like general ESFPs) are less likely to have something or as much available for integration. They can do other things, like leading people, or throwing parties, and so forth.

    Yes - if my mom's correct, my 17 yeard old sister is an ESFP.

    I suppose I can depict her attributes here vaguely: She's quite popular and good at managing large groups of people. She's very practical and knows what will or won't work. She is very interested in outward success, balances efficient completion of required tasks with having fun. She loves politics, and has very strong opinions not too subject for change.

    You are free to believe whatever you wish; I'm just presenting my worldview - whether or not it's accurate is very open to debate.

    You actually have a good point about me thinking in terms of absolutes, maybe that isn't holistic enough. Still, it fits my own observations and experience that ESFPs, in general, do those things.

    But that doesn't make them wiser or more able to develop great ideas; it just means they're better problem solvers and have a faster wit.

  2. #2
    Riva
    Guest

    Default

    Any new member or guest reading this would assume that an intj started this thread; adding to the misguided view people have on INTJs.

    But that doesn't make them wiser or more able to develop great ideas; it just means they're better problem solvers and have a faster wit.
    Please do tell us what wise and great ideas you have discovered?

    Intelligence I believe should not be a comparison; it should be the ability to grasp/understand and to solve/innovate. Don't ascribe to intelligence what most education systems expect from children or by the ability to hold your breath and puke a cosmology thread that goes in circles and at the end of the day say nothing much.

    This thread is a rant; judging people by aspie standards and jealously throwing tantrums for having poor social skills.

  3. #3

    Default

    Unless you create a new system. Yes.

  4. #4
    WALMART
    Guest

    Default

    ST's and SF's, like NT's and NF's. Drawn like that it seems fair.

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,153

    Default

    Rather than ST and SF there should be NP and NJ.

  6. #6
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    ESFP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx
    Socionics
    SEE Fi
    Posts
    6,727

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RaptorWizard View Post
    Here's some comments of mine taken from The ESFP "stupid" myth. thread:

    I approve of this myth - even if some have higher IQs than my own (114), their orientiation to think at many levels and maintain higher focus won't ever be completely set.

    I don't think you could find one famous ESFP philosopher in the entire history (and even unknown past) of the human race!

    Still, it doesn't make them bad or unecessary people, it's just that their abilities and inclinations rest outside my zones of interest.

    Well, not only are many not interested in topics such as metaphysics, philosophy, cosmology, enlightenment, and such, but they also quite often fight against progress in those areas. If there's one thing worse than a closed-minded person, it's a closed-minded person that closes our horizons. Like I said, they have their own intelligence, but it's in things of more mundane natures.

    If an ESFP wants to tell me something of value, or better yet, let me tell them something of value, then I'll open up more; but until then, my attention remains focused elsewhere. You confuse me discounting other people with me not listening to them. I try to factor everyone's opinion, and I don't believe in destroying the rights of other people. We each deserve chances to be heard out and acknowledged, but some people (like general ESFPs) are less likely to have something or as much available for integration. They can do other things, like leading people, or throwing parties, and so forth.

    Yes - if my mom's correct, my 17 yeard old sister is an ESFP.

    I suppose I can depict her attributes here vaguely: She's quite popular and good at managing large groups of people. She's very practical and knows what will or won't work. She is very interested in outward success, balances efficient completion of required tasks with having fun. She loves politics, and has very strong opinions not too subject for change.

    You are free to believe whatever you wish; I'm just presenting my worldview - whether or not it's accurate is very open to debate.

    You actually have a good point about me thinking in terms of absolutes, maybe that isn't holistic enough. Still, it fits my own observations and experience that ESFPs, in general, do those things.

    But that doesn't make them wiser or more able to develop great ideas; it just means they're better problem solvers and have a faster wit.
    Are you talking to yourself?

    I don't know what your topic title has to do with your post, since it just sort of sounds like a semi-rant about ESFPs, specifically your sister.

    I think ESFPs are the most open-minded type there is. But of course we all mature at different rates.

    Not having interest in the same things you do does not make one closed-minded.
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

    "I like the sigs with quotes in them from other forum members." -- Oberon

    The SP Spazz Youtube Channel

  7. #7
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    Will
    Posts
    5,927

    Default

    What can I say? I'm a very talented individual - and I'm a judgmental tyrant.

  8. #8
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    ESFP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx
    Socionics
    SEE Fi
    Posts
    6,727

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RaptorWizard View Post
    What can I say? I'm a very talented individual - and I'm a judgmental tyrant.
    You're not still thinking you're ISTP are you?
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

    "I like the sigs with quotes in them from other forum members." -- Oberon

    The SP Spazz Youtube Channel

  9. #9
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx/so
    Posts
    5,151

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    Rather than ST and SF there should be NP and NJ.
    Dunno, I relate a lot more to an ENFJ than, say, an INTP even if I'm closer to the latter functionally. I think the current temperaments are fine though. Oooh, or EP, EJ, IP, and IJ. That would be interesting.

    Anyway RW, since I'm assuming this will inevitably lead to discussion of your type (), you seem more INTP than ISTP to me. Everyone has their tastes but you seem very grounded in looking at things from a certain framework (Si) - specifically philosophical. That, and your ideas seem externally influenced and quickly expressed (Ne) than internally filtered and drawn out (Ni). And you're not an INTJ at all; I don't see any Te in you anywhere. You're all about that Ti. Enneagram wise, 5w6 is a yes. sx/so is a no. I liked when you had so/sp out there since a large majority of your posts relate to spreading your knowledge among humanity, contributing what you can for the progression of society as a whole. And you're too formal and distanced to be so/sx - even when your posts are more casual it seems like you're trying to make them so. Don't worry, formality is a good thing if you want people to take your ideas seriously.
    7w6 - 2w3 - 8w7 sx/so


  10. #10
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    Will
    Posts
    5,927

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffster View Post
    You're not still thinking you're ISTP are you?
    I think @Chanaynay explained sufficiently well why that isn't the case.

    Anyway, if you want to get revenge in any way, I'm up for the challenge!

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-06-2014, 12:19 PM
  2. [ENFJ] How can ENFJ be both charming and clueless at the same time?
    By Lily flower in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-07-2011, 03:47 PM
  3. [ISTP] ISTPs and Rambling
    By girlnamedbless in forum The SP Arthouse (ESFP, ISFP, ESTP, ISTP)
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: 01-05-2010, 09:40 AM
  4. [ISTP] Married to an ISTP and need help!
    By CestMoi in forum The SP Arthouse (ESFP, ISFP, ESTP, ISTP)
    Replies: 45
    Last Post: 02-25-2008, 10:00 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO