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Thread: Ask an ESFP!

  1. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comeback Girl View Post
    I don't think I've ever seen an ESFP express their anger towards the person they're angry with. At least, not agressively.
    So when exactly do you explode?

    If you bought an item in a clothing store, and you go home later to find out that there is problem that you over looked. The next day you return to exchange the item, but the person behind the counter is giving you grief. How do you handle that? More crazy eyes?

    Why do you think the stereotype of ESFPs, is always of them being annoying? I thought it would be the aggressiveness of them.

    Do you ever get aggressive?

  2. #362
    Ratchet Ass Moon Fairy Comeback Girl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calb View Post
    So when exactly do you explode?

    If you bought an item in a clothing store, and you go home later to find out that there is problem that you over looked. The next day you return to exchange the item, but the person behind the counter is giving you grief. How do you handle that? More crazy eyes?

    Why do you think the stereotype of ESFPs, is always of them being annoying? I thought it would be the aggressiveness of them.

    Do you ever get aggressive?
    I never explode. At least not when I'm in company. I only exploded once and then I broke a key ring. That's it.

    When it comes to the clothing shop situation, I'd remain calm and negotiate if possible. No need to get angry.

    I thought the stereotype of ESFPs would be that we're total sluts. No, we're not aggressive, can't think of an ESFP who isn't pretty peaceful. We're just like ISFPs, but more outgoing and talkative. ISFPs are peaceful and the outgoing and talkative part doesn't add more aggression. I think the annoying part of ESFPs would be their shallow/talkative/'slutty'/'party animal'/gossipy reputation.

    The most aggressive I've been, was when I broke a key ring out of anger.
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  3. #363
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    Have you ever given socionics some thought?

    Would you play along in this hypothetical view for now that you can convert your ESFP (MBTI) to SEE-ESFp (socionics).

    The scenario: ILI-INTp (INTJ MBTI) runs into the SEE.

    According to socionics.com "Nature has played a little trick on us. It is difficult to notice your Dual partner among all the other types and even easier to pass them by. Usually during first contact extroverts think about their introvert Dual as ordinary and simple, therefore not deserving their personal attention. In return introverts consider their extrovert Dual to be too good for them and therefore unattainable. Both positions usually belong to people who had a lack of Duality interaction during childhood." It is also possible that duals pass each other by because when they first meet they are likely to act through their Super-Ego functions, which is received with boredom from the other party. - See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/i...tionships/Dual
    in socionics SEE gets Se Fi but... the Super-Ego functions are this:

    Extroverted Intuition (Ne, )

    SEEs can be accomplished at offering perceptive potential explanations for the things going on around them. They are capable of generating novel conceptual structures and comparisons. They may make an effort to appear to have a handle on understanding and developing possibilities or potential mechanisms to apply to their environment, but in general they may tend to find such thinking tedious of minimal use in interpreting the actual effects of their actions in the real world.As a lifestyle matter, SEEs are often oriented towards productive activity; they can be often impatient with abstract explanations or ideas, and they usually prefer tangible accounts of worldly affairs, and information that they can use and apply. They may prefer to work in real-world contexts or on projects that are subject to their influence, as opposed to trying to effectuate overly intangible ideas. They are more interested in identifying and understanding the processes around them and consequences of their actions than having to understand the underlying abstract conceptual framework. They may also be oriented towards thinking about longer term plans as opposed to evaluating extemporaneous or random experiences or information.SEEs may find it difficult to consciously process ambiguity, uncertainty, or potentiality. When working on their goals, they may prefer to deal with any problems as they arise, rather than preparing for specific possible outcomes, of which they may have difficulty keeping track. They may sometimes become irrational or distressed if others around them become unpredictable or erratic, or if their environment becomes unresponsive to their pressuring influence.SEEs are aware that there is often more to a person than meets the eye at first, and try to keep that in mind; yet their inclination is to trust more what their own experiences of that person have told them, especially when evaluating their capacity for work and assertiveness.

    Introverted Logic (Ti, )


    SEEs generally exhibit chaotic and uncontrolled lifestyles. They are motivated by their impulses and momentary feelings, and may have difficulty carrying themselves to fulfill day-to-day obligations and responsibilities. To the extent that their external obligations permit it, they tend to be habitually unstructured and vagarious. They do not engage in systematic decision-making and may instead base their behaviors on whimsical desires. They avoid restricting or regimenting their lifestyles based on rational or "common sense" behaviors and can resist attempts to bring order and stability to their lives.They may have difficulty following externally imposed rules on their behavior, and may automatically resist being told what to do in matters pertaining to their lifestyle. They may have difficulty adapting their naturally impetuous lifestyle to some situations. Convincing them to change their ways is a gradual, tiresome and often thankless process, best accomplished by persons whose judgment they trust fully.SEEs are often inclined to disregard what they see as petty rules and procedures, especially if those require a high investment of time and concentration in order to be understood and implemented, while blocking the SEEs from achieving their goals. If they are suddenly stopped in their tracks by external forces because of a previous disregard for such rules, they can lash out in frustration and impatience, while feeling helpless and angry at having been so sidetracked.- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/SEE-ESFp

    Where as the ILI's are Ni Te, their Super-Ego functions are this:

    Introverted Sensing (Si, )

    ILIs generally place moderate to minimal importance on such matters as cleanliness, comfort, and sensory stimuli. Some ILIs may perceive these elements as a distraction. It is not atypical of ILIs to be completely uninterested by and unable to find any value in something such as a piece of fine artwork. Different ILIs respond to different such artistic stimuli in different ways; for example, an ILI might scorn painting as being worthless but possess sufficient background to enjoy other media, such as sculpture or music.ILIs are often uncertain about the messages that their own body sends them. An ILI might feel some irregularity in their own body and be unsure as to its significance in the overall functioning of the body. An ILI will seek to determine the consequence of such stimuli through their own understanding of the functioning of the human body -- often with minimal success at determining the true cause, and often blowing things significantly out of proportion. An ILI's sense of self doubt may lead to such assumptions as the presence of a brain tumor as the result of a mere headache. In contrast to Si types, ILIs are significantly less adept at making active adjustments to their lifestyle to correct these minor ailments.ILIs are very capable of placing a moderate life focus on maintaining their physical comfort. ILIs often construct a lifestyle based on various activities which feed their own intellectual stimulation; though attention to maintaining comfortable surroundings is likely to be ignored insomuch as it interferes with the ILI's deep interests, ILIs generally will not ignore their own comfort entirely, as some attentiveness to it goes hand in hand with their inactive lifestyle. However, in doing so, ILIs often still neglect the world around them and become consistently mired in their own inertia, and are liable to perceive something as missing.ILIs often feel very hesitant and resistant towards lifestyle changes that threaten the commodiously constructed surroundings that they create for themselves. Nobody is better suited to opening the ILI for change than the hyperactive SEE, whose constant activity is perceived by the ILI as refreshingly active.

    Extroverted Ethics (Fe, )


    ILIs are typically out of touch with expressing their emotional states. They are often seen as cold, unresponsive, and undesiring of human contact (which is often not the case). As a consequence, ILIs tend to be somewhat reclusive and often feel out of touch with their social surroundings. The rules of social "games" are often not naturally understood by ILIs. The are often unconfident and uneasy in social settings, especially those in which they feel that are expected to abide by social conventions that they have little connection to such as tribesmanship or purposeless joviality. Additionally, ILIs tend to regard the development of trust with others with significant anxiety, fearing that their inner world or antisocial tendencies will be unfavorably looked upon by others, and that most of the good will and friendliness they see in others is a pretense of social interaction rather than an expression of genuine emotional reactions. Often ILIs eschew many social situations and neglect emotional association with groups, instead seeking deep emotional connections with individuals.ILIs are often seen as especially negative, overly critical, and sometimes harsh in their judgments. This is in part because ILIs -- when serious -- tend to communicate in a direct, straightforward manner. They sometimes are unaware of others' reactions to their ideas and may avoid sugar-coating them. Many ILIs see their criticism as constructive and believe that they would be doing others no good by withholding their ideas. Because of their incessant criticism and negativism, ILIs are sometimes seen as haughty or arrogant.- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/ILI-INTp

    So what do you think about this, do you think you would fit the SEE description? The conversion between MBTI and socionics should be easier for extroverts compared to introverts.

    Do you think you have run into an ILI before?

  4. #364
    Ratchet Ass Moon Fairy Comeback Girl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calb View Post
    Have you ever given socionics some thought?

    Would you play along in this hypothetical view for now that you can convert your ESFP (MBTI) to SEE-ESFp (socionics).

    The scenario: ILI-INTp (INTJ MBTI) runs into the SEE.



    in socionics SEE gets Se Fi but... the Super-Ego functions are this:

    Extroverted Intuition (Ne, )

    SEEs can be accomplished at offering perceptive potential explanations for the things going on around them. They are capable of generating novel conceptual structures and comparisons. They may make an effort to appear to have a handle on understanding and developing possibilities or potential mechanisms to apply to their environment, but in general they may tend to find such thinking tedious of minimal use in interpreting the actual effects of their actions in the real world.As a lifestyle matter, SEEs are often oriented towards productive activity; they can be often impatient with abstract explanations or ideas, and they usually prefer tangible accounts of worldly affairs, and information that they can use and apply. They may prefer to work in real-world contexts or on projects that are subject to their influence, as opposed to trying to effectuate overly intangible ideas. They are more interested in identifying and understanding the processes around them and consequences of their actions than having to understand the underlying abstract conceptual framework. They may also be oriented towards thinking about longer term plans as opposed to evaluating extemporaneous or random experiences or information.SEEs may find it difficult to consciously process ambiguity, uncertainty, or potentiality. When working on their goals, they may prefer to deal with any problems as they arise, rather than preparing for specific possible outcomes, of which they may have difficulty keeping track. They may sometimes become irrational or distressed if others around them become unpredictable or erratic, or if their environment becomes unresponsive to their pressuring influence.SEEs are aware that there is often more to a person than meets the eye at first, and try to keep that in mind; yet their inclination is to trust more what their own experiences of that person have told them, especially when evaluating their capacity for work and assertiveness.

    Introverted Logic (Ti, )


    SEEs generally exhibit chaotic and uncontrolled lifestyles. They are motivated by their impulses and momentary feelings, and may have difficulty carrying themselves to fulfill day-to-day obligations and responsibilities. To the extent that their external obligations permit it, they tend to be habitually unstructured and vagarious. They do not engage in systematic decision-making and may instead base their behaviors on whimsical desires. They avoid restricting or regimenting their lifestyles based on rational or "common sense" behaviors and can resist attempts to bring order and stability to their lives.They may have difficulty following externally imposed rules on their behavior, and may automatically resist being told what to do in matters pertaining to their lifestyle. They may have difficulty adapting their naturally impetuous lifestyle to some situations. Convincing them to change their ways is a gradual, tiresome and often thankless process, best accomplished by persons whose judgment they trust fully.SEEs are often inclined to disregard what they see as petty rules and procedures, especially if those require a high investment of time and concentration in order to be understood and implemented, while blocking the SEEs from achieving their goals. If they are suddenly stopped in their tracks by external forces because of a previous disregard for such rules, they can lash out in frustration and impatience, while feeling helpless and angry at having been so sidetracked.- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/SEE-ESFp

    Where as the ILI's are Ni Te, their Super-Ego functions are this:

    Introverted Sensing (Si, )

    ILIs generally place moderate to minimal importance on such matters as cleanliness, comfort, and sensory stimuli. Some ILIs may perceive these elements as a distraction. It is not atypical of ILIs to be completely uninterested by and unable to find any value in something such as a piece of fine artwork. Different ILIs respond to different such artistic stimuli in different ways; for example, an ILI might scorn painting as being worthless but possess sufficient background to enjoy other media, such as sculpture or music.ILIs are often uncertain about the messages that their own body sends them. An ILI might feel some irregularity in their own body and be unsure as to its significance in the overall functioning of the body. An ILI will seek to determine the consequence of such stimuli through their own understanding of the functioning of the human body -- often with minimal success at determining the true cause, and often blowing things significantly out of proportion. An ILI's sense of self doubt may lead to such assumptions as the presence of a brain tumor as the result of a mere headache. In contrast to Si types, ILIs are significantly less adept at making active adjustments to their lifestyle to correct these minor ailments.ILIs are very capable of placing a moderate life focus on maintaining their physical comfort. ILIs often construct a lifestyle based on various activities which feed their own intellectual stimulation; though attention to maintaining comfortable surroundings is likely to be ignored insomuch as it interferes with the ILI's deep interests, ILIs generally will not ignore their own comfort entirely, as some attentiveness to it goes hand in hand with their inactive lifestyle. However, in doing so, ILIs often still neglect the world around them and become consistently mired in their own inertia, and are liable to perceive something as missing.ILIs often feel very hesitant and resistant towards lifestyle changes that threaten the commodiously constructed surroundings that they create for themselves. Nobody is better suited to opening the ILI for change than the hyperactive SEE, whose constant activity is perceived by the ILI as refreshingly active.

    Extroverted Ethics (Fe, )


    ILIs are typically out of touch with expressing their emotional states. They are often seen as cold, unresponsive, and undesiring of human contact (which is often not the case). As a consequence, ILIs tend to be somewhat reclusive and often feel out of touch with their social surroundings. The rules of social "games" are often not naturally understood by ILIs. The are often unconfident and uneasy in social settings, especially those in which they feel that are expected to abide by social conventions that they have little connection to such as tribesmanship or purposeless joviality. Additionally, ILIs tend to regard the development of trust with others with significant anxiety, fearing that their inner world or antisocial tendencies will be unfavorably looked upon by others, and that most of the good will and friendliness they see in others is a pretense of social interaction rather than an expression of genuine emotional reactions. Often ILIs eschew many social situations and neglect emotional association with groups, instead seeking deep emotional connections with individuals.ILIs are often seen as especially negative, overly critical, and sometimes harsh in their judgments. This is in part because ILIs -- when serious -- tend to communicate in a direct, straightforward manner. They sometimes are unaware of others' reactions to their ideas and may avoid sugar-coating them. Many ILIs see their criticism as constructive and believe that they would be doing others no good by withholding their ideas. Because of their incessant criticism and negativism, ILIs are sometimes seen as haughty or arrogant.- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/ILI-INTp

    So what do you think about this, do you think you would fit the SEE description? The conversion between MBTI and socionics should be easier for extroverts compared to introverts.

    Do you think you have run into an ILI before?
    Gee, that's one fucking long read. I scanned through the description and the things I read are indeed things that suit me well. I'm pretty sure I've met ILIs in some point in my life, one of my exes suits the description quite well and I can think of some more people.
    Ewww is the new sexy


    Hi! Ask me things, maybe I'll answer them! Just click here

    And here's my functions: Se-Te-Fi-Fe-Ni-Ti-Ne-Si


  5. #365
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    I'd like to get comments on argument that took place between me and my coworker, whom I believe is an ESFP...

    He is 38 and a father of three... But his actions are still child like... Especially under stress he becomes too energetic and start pestering and harassing other employees... He can feel down very easily and shuts himself down to a secluded corner in the workplace... Doesn't want to interact with people and acts all sullen at those times... Refuses to tell his problem and may snap at people if bothered too much...

    He also IMO has low self esteem and keeps measuring his self-worth and standing against fellow employees and wants to be on top... wants to subjugate others thru seemingly playful body language... He likes telling lies about his leaving for another department, transferring his responsibilities to another coworker etc. probably to check how we'll react (so as to measure his worth as well as ridicule and devalue his fellow coworkers, perhaps unconsciously)... When discussing technical issues and he feels cornered or criticized, he puts forward his knowledge about another indirectly related topic so as to push the other back or make him submit...

    From what he has told about his late father, his ESTP father must have berated\abused him about his intelligence and worth, due to which he feels insecure when questioned or disregarded to that end... His bad traits are amplified when he's under stress or feeling low or feeling too energetic... Other times (like %60 of the time) he "acts" kind and caring but it feels like an act to me...

    I am working in a auditing company as an auditor just like the coworker... Coworker has about 10 years seniority in the company wrt to me and I am 4 years his junior by age as well single with no children... I have previous experience in a government office as well as some in the private sector...

    Our company is not a very institutionalized company in that there are rules and procedures in place but the upper management is willing to flex or even violate them so long as it is profitable... ESFP has a token title in the office and is responsible as the head-auditor over us... However, the company culture and the personnel at large have this "every man for himself" attitude... So the managers do not feel responsible for the well functioning of their departments and personnel but just concentrate on appeasing the management... In that sense, everyone in the department is expected to take care of his own shit and clients...

    ESFP was charged with preparing the next schedule for client audits and I had 2 new clients that had to go thru a first-time audit... ESFP's schedule already contained 4-5 old clients in the same city with the new one so I informed him about the new clients (assigned to me)... He told me he took note of that and would try to arrange it...

    Fast forward 2 days to today...I learn that he didn't include them in the schedule... I tell him "So you couldn't include them in the schedule" when I see him... He tells me "Yes I couldn't, if you had given me the details about the clients I would've..." ... I took a day off the day before so I say "You could've given me a call and I would've given them to you..." ...He starts telling me about how he got into trouble of arranging all the auditors for the schedule and that the managers still criticized it despite his efforts and how he's having problems in personal life... I say "I understand you are having problems and I appreciate your efforts to arrange the schedule but I felt left out of the loop when I found out that you hadn't included my clients in the schedule..." and I ask him "what should I do in future to avoid this happening again?"... He starts telling me how it is the duty of the respective auditor assigned to the client to make the schedule arrangement by himself for new clients and that I should do that in future... I say "But you didn't tell me this before when you agreed to include them in the schedule..."... He gets angry and tells me that he cannot be bothered with that... that I shouldn't trust him (he meant to say I shouldn't be reliant on him) with such things and that I should take care of my clients myself...(even though the schedule he made encompasses a part of our clientele assigned to several different auditors in the office)...

    I ask him that if we will not be able count on each other how we will be able to work together in the office... He gets angry, accuses me of acting paranoid and advises me to go thru a full-range psychological screening... He also adds that I've been acting like a difficult person since my first day in the office and starts recounting things that I've done that have offended him in the past and insinuates that I am the cause of this problem... I tell him that if he told me those things before I would've corrected my behaviour so as not to repeat them in future, and apologize for one occasion that I feel he's in the right... He says that we aren't children anymore and that he cannot tell me everything that I do that offends him and tells me to stop talking to and relying on him in future but just act in a professional manner and take care of my clientele on my own... Just as I am about to leave he tells me that I am acting like a child, after which I tell him that I feel the same way about him...

    He gets even more furious and threatens to beat me up if I don't leave him alone... As I am leaving he says "who are you to ask me for an explanation, like I owe you one..."...I come back and tell him that people talk about their problems otherwise it gets bottled up and are acted out thru other means... He gets even more furious and tell me to leave... I tell him that I was leaving but he's keeping talking behind my back... He tells me that he's barely holding himself and demands me to leave him alone...

    I walk away to my own desk... After some time I feel very relieved to have confronted him with this... I don't know where this'll go though...

    So what's your take on this long story? What the hell's going on? I was just expecting a genunine admission of his fault...I already arranged the schedule myself when I found out he hadn't... I was just offended that he disregarded me in the process and didn't keep his word...

    ???

  6. #366
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    @yeghor
    Either he has real issues and he's overworked, or he was just too busy watching Netflix or something. Probably a combination of both. When we ESFPs are stressed out, or at least when I am, we prefer to ignore those little things we think can cause us more stress. For example, when I've had finals and the period after these finals are stressful enough with new deadlines and shit, sometimes I just prefer not to find out what grade I got. It's not uncommon for me to avoid finding out my grade for half a year. It's just something sensitive and I hate it when people point out these sensitivities, but most people don't really seem to understand. I think this whole thing just touched some sensitive spot, so he probably ignored your requests because he thought it would cause him stress and then he decided to watch Netflix instead.
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  7. #367
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comeback Girl View Post
    @yeghor
    Either he has real issues and he's overworked, or he was just too busy watching Netflix or something. Probably a combination of both. When we ESFPs are stressed out, or at least when I am, we prefer to ignore those little things we think can cause us more stress. For example, when I've had finals and the period after these finals are stressful enough with new deadlines and shit, sometimes I just prefer not to find out what grade I got. It's not uncommon for me to avoid finding out my grade for half a year. It's just something sensitive and I hate it when people point out these sensitivities, but most people don't really seem to understand. I think this whole thing just touched some sensitive spot, so he probably ignored your requests because he thought it would cause him stress and then he decided to watch Netflix instead.
    He prefers candy crush and lately the word game on his smartphone... Thanks for the input

  8. #368
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    This is another instance that happened between me and my ESFP coworker... How would my actions described in the quote make you feel?

    Could this be an instance that he felt offended by me? Could it be that he is trying to get even through other means?

    How would you've felt in his place if I had told him to go check it on his own phone?

    Quote Originally Posted by yeghor View Post

  9. #369
    Senior Member yeghor's Avatar
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    @Comeback Girl @Marmotini @Jeffster

    I think "immature" versions of ESFPs (my ex, a coworker at previous workplace, probably my junior brother, my neighbour, an ex-friend that doorslammed me) are bane of my existence... I'd be glad id you could help me out with these:

    -Have never been able to get along with my junior brother till lately... Whenever I "N"ed him, he would shot it down without even discussing it... Would accuse me of acting childish in those instances... Do you relate to this? How does it make you feel when someone starts talking about abstract (nerdy) things?

    -My ex badmouthed me to our common social circle when I left her... She says she was diagnosed as bipolar... Relies on alcohol too much... Whenever I tell something in a group around her, she has a habit of yelling over me and shotting my thoughts down without discussing them...Any thoughts?

    -Neighbour tries to find excuses to give me unsolicited advice and show off his knowledge... Same thing happened with ex coworker... I graduated from a respective college in my country, that people hold in high regard... I guess getting the better of me knowledge-wise is a very nourishing source of satisfaction to some people... like a highly regarded narcissistic supply... Any thoughts...?

    -Ex coworker was acting passive aggressive towards me... Her words and actions did not match in that when I inquired if there was something she was irritated with me she would tell there wasn't anything of the sorts but would try to outmanuveur me at every opportunity... Caught her lying occasionally about joint-work... She would expect me to soothe her insecurities daily... It was as if every day, her self-satisfaction level would hit rock-bottom, the level of rapport between us would reset itself and I had to prove my non-hostility to her on a daily basis... She also would try to command me around or try to make do things for her and act out (mostly in a passive aggressive manner) if I refused... I felt as if that gave her some kind of self-satisfaction... Again I felt like I was being treated like a prized narcisstic supply... She was also very seductive and promiscuous as well as prone to rage (her eyes would flare up)... Would act tomboyish sometimes and like a small girl other times... She would also take some kind of "raw" primal pleasure from organizing dinners, birthday parties etc where should act like a host (ISFJ shadow?)... During those times, her eyes would darken like that of a beast (as if she was running a script)... She also would bake cookies when she wanted to apologize for past offenses (ISFJ shadow?)... I guess she had an ESTP father... She was becoming aware of her actions (she acted like ISFJ but had a very active and uncontrollable ESFP shadow) but still couldn't control it... She was in her early 30s... I suspected she had Borderline Personality Disorder... Any thoughts?

    -Ex college friend, an ISFJ probably, started acting like an ESFP in his late 20s... Started to ridicule and shot down my thoughts and ideas (they were boring him)... Wanted to be the center of attention... Developed some kind of entitlement and attitude... He would want to do more Se activities but I wasn't ready... Started competing with me for female attention as well as tried cockblocking me a few times... I told him how I was feeling about all this... He started acting cold and snarky towards me but denied any problem when inquired (passive aggressive mode)... When I pressed further and asked him to treat me like man and be direct he told me that I was trying to control him and accused me of not being man enough...and doorslammed me... We met a few times since then around other people but I didn't pursue to contact him... He was just out of a relationship with an ESxP girlfriend who tried to take advantage of his ISFJ self so was stressed out but the bastard didn't tell us about it till lately... I am not angry with him though cause he was supportive when I was going thru bad times... We just parted ways... Any thoughts?

    So do these resonate with you? Were you like this when you were younger or less mature?

    Edit: How did you view geeks and nerds while growing up (i.e. in high school for instance)? How did they view you? Was there some kind of animosity (particularly against those of the same sex, i.e. competition)?
    Last edited by yeghor; 04-20-2014 at 08:22 AM. Reason: Bold

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