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  1. #11
    Not Your Therapist Sinmara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jixmixfix View Post
    denial.
    Why don't you explain to me what is anti-Fe about it, then.
    Never wrestle with a pig. You will get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.



  2. #12
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinmara View Post
    Why don't you explain to me what is anti-Fe about it, then.
    Fe generally tries to seek harmony and adhere to social customs, right? Well, doing something like pulling out your genitals in public would naturally violate many social customs, and could quite possibly offend people. Unless you're on a nude beach or at a nudist colony, in which case it would be acceptable.

    It is actually a fairly crude gesture, and I think it's very similar to flipping someone off, or mooning them. In fact, I think that's what flipping someone off was originally meant to symbolize... think about it, what is "the bird" shaped like?

  3. #13
    Not Your Therapist Sinmara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Fe generally tries to seek harmony and adhere to social customs, right? Well, doing something like pulling out your genitals in public would naturally violate many social customs, and could quite possibly offend people.

    It is actually a fairly crude gesture, and I think it's very similar to flipping someone off. In fact, I think that's what flipping someone off was originally meant to symbolize... think about it, what is "the bird" shaped like?
    All right, adhering to social customs.

    Whose social customs? Who decides which customs Fe is expected to follow? I see this phrase bandied about the forum, but it's a vague and abstract concept that no one really specifies. Sure, I follow social customs -- of my peers and my community, which may or may not resemble your community and may or may not reflect what you personally deem to be socially acceptable. Most peoples' ideas of the way Fe should be expressed seems to be a reflection of an SJ attitude when really it's just a feedback-check of the people and culture around you.

    I do have to go back and acknowledge that the OP was talking about public exposure, which my mind glossed over since the following responses seemed to talk about people indulging in this behavior among friends. The people in my community are rather lax on the whole nudity thing and I could see myself horsing around in this manner.
    Never wrestle with a pig. You will get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.



  4. #14
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinmara View Post
    All right, adhering to social customs.

    Whose social customs? Who decides which customs Fe is expected to follow? I see this phrase bandied about the forum, but it's a vague and abstract concept that no one really specifies. Sure, I follow social customs -- of my peers and my community, which may or may not resemble your community and may or may not reflect what you personally deem to be socially acceptable. Most peoples' ideas of the way Fe should be expressed seems to be a reflection of an SJ attitude when really it's just a feedback-check of the people and culture around you.

    I do have to go back and acknowledge that the OP was talking about public exposure, which my mind glossed over since the following responses seemed to talk about people indulging in this behavior among friends. The people in my community are rather lax on the whole nudity thing and I could see myself horsing around in this manner.
    Well, I added the qualification later to my post that there's nothing wrong with exposing yourself on a nude beach or in a nudist colony.

    But yes, it depends on how the gesture is interpreted. I think what I mean is, you wouldn't just go to some place where people were very straight-laced and not used to that kind of behavior, and act the same way... right? You would try to get a "feel" for what they were okay with first, and not just do that with anyone. You said your friends were okay with it, but would you act that way around primarily total strangers?

    Also, it kind of depends on your definition of public. Are we talking in a room with your friends? Are we talking about in the middle of the street where everyone can see it? Do we mean in a church?

    I was kind of thinking of the middle of a crowded street in a major city like New York or something. If you're talking about a random bar in Los Angeles, things might be different...

  5. #15
    Not Your Therapist Sinmara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Well, I added the qualification later to my post that there's nothing wrong with exposing yourself on a nude beach or in a nudist colony.

    But yes, it depends on how the gesture is interpreted. I think what I mean is, you wouldn't just go to some place where people were very straight-laced and not used to that kind of behavior, and act the same way... right? You would try to get a "feel" for what they were okay with first, and not just do that with anyone. You said your friends were okay with it, but would you act that way around primarily total strangers?

    Also, it kind of depends on your definition of public. Are we talking in a room with your friends? Are we talking about in the middle of the street where everyone can see it? Do we mean in a church?

    I was kind of thinking of the middle of a crowded street in a major city like New York or something. If you're talking about a random bar in Los Angeles, things might be different...
    See, that's the miscommunication here: The OP complained about ESTPs wiggling their junk in public in a very general sense and we're filling in the details with our own assumptions. Oops.

    No, I personally wouldn't do it around a bunch of random strangers I might meet while I'm out and about in the world, since I don't know how they'll react. A bunch of strangers who are acquaintances of the people I know, however, I'd probably be fine with, because being friends with my friends leads me to assume they share similar values.
    Never wrestle with a pig. You will get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.



  6. #16
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    @Sinmara, I'm not so sure why you're so invested in this conversation. I thought you were ENJ, dear.
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
    you are only a troubled guest on the dark earth

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinmara View Post
    See, that's the miscommunication here: The OP complained about ESTPs wiggling their junk in public in a very general sense and we're filling in the details with our own assumptions. Oops.

    No, I personally wouldn't do it around a bunch of random strangers I might meet while I'm out and about in the world, since I don't know how they'll react. A bunch of strangers who are acquaintances of the people I know, however, I'd probably be fine with, because being friends with my friends leads me to assume they share similar values.
    Didn't complain just pointed it out it's quite different. This thread wasn't exactly suppose to be serious if you couldn't tell.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinmara View Post
    Why don't you explain to me what is anti-Fe about it, then.
    Basically what Athenian said but i'm not going to get into a whole philosophical argument about the nature of Fe since I'm being half serious.

  9. #19
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    Yes this is me! as well as getting my body out in any and all temperatures. Was it the alcohol or the personality? Don't know but there are guys I've known who just don't do this stuff no matter how much alcohol.

  10. #20
    Not Your Therapist Sinmara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind-Up Rex View Post
    @Sinmara, I'm not so sure why you're so invested in this conversation. I thought you were ENJ, dear.
    I was bored and had no one to talk to in Vent, so I decided to bother people in here.

    *boobsmack*
    Never wrestle with a pig. You will get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.



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