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  1. #1
    Knobgoblin mooseantlers's Avatar
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    Default Why do some type forums have the two middle letters but this one has second and last?

    Why do some type forums have the two middle letters but this one has second and last?
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  2. #2
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    .
    Last edited by Tyrinth; 04-06-2012 at 05:19 PM. Reason: I'm oblivious.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    They're grouped by each of the 4 Temperaments.

    Go here:

    http://www.4temperaments.com/thewhy.html

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    Intuitive people focus on mental processes which are thinkings and feelings, whereas sensors focus on physical phenomena which is more action and decision oriented like perceiving and judging is my idea.
    NT= Abstract Utilitarian
    NF = Abstract Cooperator
    SJ = Concrete Cooperator
    SP = Concrete Utilitarian

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    It's Keirsey's fault.

    If we followed Jung, we would actually be divided into SPs, SJs, NPs, and NJs. (Se/Si/Ne/Ni).

    However, Keirsey felt that while P and J make a big huge wild difference between the sensing types, with the intuitives the bigger difference is between T and F.

    If you read Please Understand Me II it will explain all that.

  6. #6
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    It's Keirsey's fault.

    If we followed Jung, we would actually be divided into SPs, SJs, NPs, and NJs. (Se/Si/Ne/Ni).

    However, Keirsey felt that while P and J make a big huge wild difference between the sensing types, with the intuitives the bigger difference is between T and F.

    If you read Please Understand Me II it will explain all that.
    Keirsey even went so far as to say ISFPs and ISTPs shouldn't even be real types and aren't defined by the dominant function. He was that hung up on everyone falling into a strict hedonist/"in constant action" kind of category.

    Jungians think ISTPs are just like INTPs with only minor differences, but this is based on the ISTPs as "introverted thinking" types". INTPs are logicians, philologists, and architects in the way they think, but ISTPs are completely disinterested in such pursuits.

    "Uncomplicated in motivations."

    I think it's only partly true. Devil's in the details.. But he's an INTP. The model of reality is more important than any actual reality set before him. Kind of like those guys who read PUA books.

  7. #7
    Knobgoblin mooseantlers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Keirsey even went so far as to say ISFPs and ISTPs [/i]
    Sounds like an asshole.
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  8. #8
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    It's Keirsey's fault.

    If we followed Jung, we would actually be divided into SPs, SJs, NPs, and NJs. (Se/Si/Ne/Ni).

    However, Keirsey felt that while P and J make a big huge wild difference between the sensing types, with the intuitives the bigger difference is between T and F.
    well, it's not a crazy idea per se.

    For concretes, who operate in and/or are focused on the tangible external world, openness/closure in the external world plays a huge role.

    For intuitives, who are operating/concerned more with the connections between things rather than the things themselves, the TYPE of connection (which is typically woven of either T or F priorities) typically has value in considering.

    However, I think these are just various frameworks/ways of looking at things. There is some value in doing the standard SJ/NJ/SP/NP breakdown as well, or the NF/NT/SF/ST breakdown. New things can be learned from how we categorize the data.

    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Keirsey even went so far as to say ISFPs and ISTPs shouldn't even be real types and aren't defined by the dominant function. He was that hung up on everyone falling into a strict hedonist/"in constant action" kind of category.
    Where did he say that, exactly?

    Jungians think ISTPs are just like INTPs with only minor differences, but this is based on the ISTPs as "introverted thinking" types". INTPs are logicians, philologists, and architects in the way they think, but ISTPs are completely disinterested in such pursuits.
    I find it kind of ironic how different INTP and ISTP is from each other, despite being so close in some ways. The logic rules are the same, but the assumptions and priorities of data being examined can be so different that very different results can be achieved (one of the most typical being how ISTP often sees INTP as just pissing away time on meaningless distinctions that the INTP considers to be of prime importance, etc).
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  9. #9
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Where did he say that, exactly?
    I was going to give a page number (203), but it's in the first Keirsey/Bates version. I have the second edition too and it's just Keirsey and revised. I guess that's good to know.

  10. #10
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    I was going to give a page number (203), but it's in the first Keirsey/Bates version. I have the second edition too and it's just Keirsey and revised. I guess that's good to know.
    Okay, thanks. I really had not seen that and was curious about where you read it.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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