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  1. #31
    Controlled Mischief StephMC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seamaid View Post
    That's really fascinating, and I'd like to know more. My ISTP and I were walking across a bridge at nighttime, and I pulled him aside twice to kiss him. Both times, I initiated this "PDA" (I mean no one aside from cars could see us) and while it felt great for me, I could tell he was not as comfortable with it. This is the stuff I live for, but he only gets sorta mushy in his apt. I don't get it... How can it not occur to him that when the moon is full and the stars are out and the wind blowing through our hair (well, my hair - he's shaved) that it's obviously the perfect setting for amour?
    I know it must be confusing. It all depends on the scenario....and I've been that way for different reasons. Putting myself in his shoes, since it's only been a month, my guess is he's still feeling a little cautious. Getting an ISTP to be 110% comfortable with you takes time, patience and consistency. Even a million heart-to-hearts within a week won't have the same effect as being around you and talking to you (about anything) frequently within a month (at least for me). We can get to the point where a little PDA like a short, sweet kiss is okay just about anywhere, but making out in front of strangers or even friends (unless alcohol is involved. Maybe booze him up?) gives me the shivers. I guess it's because I suspect I'm drawing attention to myself (a private part of myself, at that) and I prefer flying under the radar.

    Quote Originally Posted by seamaid View Post
    And the initiating outings part: I can see how it could naturally work with you being ISTP and him being ENFP, but in my case, being the girl, I'm not sure if I should initiate the dates. Wouldn't that come off as pursuing him, and given ISTP's love of independence, wouldn't that turn him off? But then if I don't do anything, would he be snatched away by some girl who's more forward, more 'E'? He totally confuses me.
    That's the tricky part about two introverts dating. One's going to have to play the "extrovert" at the beginning of the relationship. If he's slackin, by all means, initiate! I'd like to think that ISTPs won't string you along... we'll be honest with you if we suspect you have strong feelings for us. We certainly don't mind being pursued unless we tell you otherwise. Of course, we don't want someone calling us every day to hang out, but a few texts/calls every day or so and asking to go hang out every few days isn't going to spook us. It'll show us consistency in you, and we'll trust you just that much more. We <3 consistency when it comes to new relationships. And soon enough, he'll respond and show a little more initiative. So again... time + patience + consistency = key to opening an ISTP up

    Maybe a guy ISTP has a little more perspective on whether you should initiate or not... I've never really had much experience being put in that situation... as I am a stubborn ass.

  2. #32
    full of love Kingfisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StephMC939 View Post
    but basically we like going with the flow rather than initiating things. It brings flavor to our lives). To express my affection to him, I'd nearly always drop what I was doing to reciprocate my appreciation for him initiating (Does that make sense?).
    i agree with that.
    and i think it's fine to initiate things with a male ISTP. just don't have too intricate of plans, a general idea is much better than a specific detailed plan. i like it when my girlfriend will come up with an idea of something for us to do, and then allow me some leeway in deciding the specifics and details - making the travel arrangements, calling the restaurant for reservations, and whatnot. i like to spend a lot of time with the person i am dating, but i often don't have specific ideas of what to do. i am really open to doing a wide range of things, and for me it is more important that i am doing them with the person. what we are doing is not so important.


    i don't especialy like PDA either. i guess it is an issue of being uncomfortable with it. but i feel like in pubic it is hard for me to completely focus on the person i am with, whereas at home in a private setting i can focus entiely on the person and be more present to what is going on between us.

  3. #33
    Senior Member seamaid's Avatar
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    Oh man, you guys are so helpful! I feel I can understand him better now, without having the awkwardness of actually asking him why he's doing this or why he's not doing that. As for going with the flow, I think INFPs and ISTPs totally click in that regard. Along with sense of humor... we really enjoy bantering with each other. We make great "partners in crime".

  4. #34
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    I will give ISTPs mad credit with the humor thing. Despite our huge differences, they often get my more 'intuitvely' based esoteric jokes that leave everyone else in the dust. Same for ESTPs. They constantly impress me in that regard.

  5. #35
    Senior Member seamaid's Avatar
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    Another thing about my ISTP guy... after a month, he still has yet to call me. He prefers to text (and email)! I've called him once, and we made some chitchat, but... unless I suddenly become chatty Kathy overnight, I'd be hard put to ring him again cuz I feel like I'm forcing a conversation on him. I am more comfortable texting too, but it's definitely less intimate and doesn't help us grow closer.

  6. #36
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Are your needs being met? A general rule is that if your needs aren't being met, but his are, then it's your responsibility to do something about it.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by seamaid View Post
    To Steph and Udog: It's definitely reassuring to hear that you guys think my ISTP is genuinely interested in me and pursuing me in his own way. I tend to think so too, except in the long, long stretches between dates, or even during dates, when I don't hear a peep from him about how he *feels* about me. Plenty of quips, emails and texts to be sure, filled with things that make me belly-laugh, but not necessarily beyond what he'd write to a friend, as opposed to a girlfriend. I wonder if I'll ever, ever get him in a love letter writing mode...! Ha, maybe if he was a GI somewhere far away? (There I go... making up romantic fantasies...)

    To an NF who's just used to guys saying "sweet nothings" to her replete with pet names and very obvious, spontaneous physical affection, it's just very odd to be with someone who always leaves me guessing as to whether he'll hold my hand while walking down the street... or not. But yes, I try to keep in mind all the little things he does for me that he wouldn't do if he didn't care. Plus, if it's any indicator, he's certainly spent enough money on dinners and activities with me by now. Very gentlemanly, for sure.
    We leave you guessing because we're always guessing. We make it up as we go along.

    Personally, I don't think I'd ever be writing love letters. I can't think of enough to say. Unless, like you said, we were far apart and our communication was infrequent, then, maybe.

    Texts and emails are easy because we can be direct and concise. Phone conversations can be somewhat awkward because I'm not very good at making up things to say. But maybe once he gets to like you enough, maybe he'll enjoy calling you. There may still be that silence where no one has anything to say, but it's OK because what's more important is that we're connected experiencing the present moment together.

    With people I am close to, and I'm getting better about being comfortable being this way around people I don't know well, is that we can be together and not say a word, and it's very blissful, especially when the setting is particularly nice. It's not that I'm in my head thinking about other things. Rather, it's that my mind is quiet, likely focusing on nothing more than the timelessness of the present moment, and the fact that I am spending it with you, right now. This moment is passing faster than our mind can perceive it passing, and we will only experience it again as memories of us together.

    Only the people who are close to me, or are similar to me, correctly understand and accept this way of being for what it is. To others, especially those with certain "social expectations" don't seem to understand it, and consider it as aloofness. I am not detached from anything, just maybe not attached in the same way you are.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colors View Post
    I've interacted with a couple of INFPs and I wouldn't describe our interactions like that way... More like we're both equally wordy about what we're interested in once we get to know each other somewhat. I'll listen to an elaborate fantasy (and then comment/joke on the feasibility). Then I'll go on about some elaborate explanation/summary of something (and they'll comment on its accuracy/ moral implications).

    As a whole, I'm really drawn to IxFP imaginations and strong viewpoints of the world, but INFPs seem to be less likely to be offended by my jokes (and more tolerant of my social gaffes). I don't think they are as amused by my antics as I am by theirs, but I suppose what I contribute is listening skills without bringing lots of my own emotional baggage?

    Definitely a type with which there is more to talk about if we agree on subjects because we can hash out the details of how we reached this decision (as oppossed to say... most ESTJs I'm been acquainted with because they won't really elaborate or explore something already in mutual agreement- so it is acutally much more enlightening to oppose them). Very hard to communicate with when disagree in final judgements.
    Exactly how I generally communicate with INFPs too

    I actually really like INFPs they make weird choices though and often it does feel like you should try and save them from the heartache they are about to cause themselves

  9. #39
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    Seamaid he probably loves you and can't bring himself to express it

    I was in love with an INFP so deeply but every time a situation came up where I should of just taken control and made things happen I didn't

    Quote Originally Posted by StephMC939 View Post
    Maybe a guy ISTP has a little more perspective on whether you should initiate or not... I've never really had much experience being put in that situation... as I am a stubborn ass.
    Two introverts hmm I think the feeler should defiantly be the one to initiate, I actually think the T would take the turn down worse and also the T will be straight up with you about if they feel the same way

  10. #40
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    This is all very interesting to me because up to yesterday, I always thought this guy I used to date/have been trying to figure out why our relationship failed was an INTP. It finally struck me that he is an ISTP, and that was the big problem. I would consider this thread to be further confirmation.

    I'm not exactly positive whether I am an INFP or an INTP (I always test INTP, but I was more of an INFP as a child), but seamaid certainly describes how our relationship was almost perfectly. I was always focused on the 'connection', searching for 'deeper meaning' in what he said, when now I think he was just saying things as is, no subtext involved.

    Our relationship: We had great talks, the best talks I've had with anyone in my life- exactly the same sense of humor, we both are into literature, film, world events. The first time I met him, I was the most comfortable I had ever been with a person at an initial meeting, ever. Because of all of this, I considered us to be one in the same.

    After we started dating, he never touched me/barely acknowledged me in public. He never referred to me as his girlfriend. But in the basement of his house (this was in high school), when we were alone, he couldn't keep his hands off me. And he would give me the look as you mentioned. We never talked at these times, we only ever talked on the phone. The phone was for conversation. Being alone together was for....

    Well, eventually things dwindled (I went to college, the physical aspects ended with no discussion why, although I still wanted them very badly- I was very much in love with him). We were friends for a time, which was a good thing to be, in retrospect, but then that faded, too. Ten years later I decided to email him and we began to talk again as if we'd never stopped, although we were living thousands of miles away from each other. He told me I was a good writer and that he still had a letter or two of mine from years ago. I took this to mean that he still had feelings for me. (Stupid romantic sensibilities... ) But it was always me initiating everything, which was incredibly stressful for me. And then I decided to tell him my feelings, which was also incredibly stressful for me- I keep those well-hidden, for selective audiences only... His response was to mention the practical... "we live across an ocean, you have your life, I have mine..." I considered the practical to be incredibly unimportant and dismissed it as being unimportant to him, too, because we were so alike, right? He was just saying those things, but he didn't really mean them...

    And then he actually called me a couple of times, entirely of his own volition. He seemed nervous about it, giving some long-winded excuse as to why. He told me he was 'hot and bothered'- he didn't say he was for me, specifically, just that he was- but I think he meant for me... Anyway, so things seemed fraught with potential. And then we actually got together. And he looked terrified, and he avoided looking at me, and I came on too strong, and it was all too terrible. I imagine that the fact we were with a group of people the whole entire time didn't help things, but I think he planned it that way. I think he wanted the security of his best friends surrounding him, because he knew that if he was with people he would be less willing to come in contact with me. But I don't know. That's probably me searching for deeper meanings again...

    Sorry to blabber, but add my experience to the pool of data...

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