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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Domino View Post
    I think I would be so outraged by being jerked around that it would take 20 grown men to hold me back from saying curtly "You tell me what game you're playing so I can return it to the Toys R Us."
    I understand the frustrations here, but what if there are misperceptions that's lead to that conclusion? Saying something like that might cause irreparable damage this early on. Pick your battles. If one must, then it's best to form it as a question, rather than a statement.

  2. #42
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    I understand your angle - I just have difficulty believing that the enfj hasn't had ample opportunity to make her intentions clear.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
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    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  3. #43
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I don't agree with those in this thread that assume the worst in people and hastily door slam. It's obvious you're crazy about her, so I think it's wise to keep any bad 'possible realities' in the back of your mind. In the forefront, considering the probable reality, she may genuinely like you.
    What makes something the more probable reality, according to your calculations?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I believe most people have good intentions.
    It's not so much their intentions that matter as their actions. Two people can have the same exact intentions (e.g., "I want this relationship to work out") but execute them in wildly different ways, and to better or worse effect.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    If you go into relationships with a paranoid-bad attitude, then you're not really open to 'reality'. (Reality is what 'is', regardless of what one perceives.) You're also liable to subconsciously treat people unfairly; consequently, pushing them away.
    Yeah, you shouldn't enter into relationships with a "paranoid-bad attitude," but you should be wary before entering into them. It's the latter that facilitates the former. That's just common sense. Openness ought end where naiveté begins.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    If she's lashing out at you because you're not reciprocating fast enough, then that's your queue to respect yourself enough to walk away (no matter how crazy about her you are). If she genuinely likes you, she won't let you walk too far. She'll figure out a mature respectful approach.
    But that she didn't figure out a mature, respectful approach in the first place speaks volumes about her.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    What makes something the more probable reality, according to your calculations?
    ^In the context of this thread: past experiences, limited facts of these two acquaintances in a newly forming relationship, and my positive view of the world. My calculations have served me well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    It's not their intentions that matter so much as their actions. Two people can have the same exact intentions (e.g., "I want this relationship to work out") but execute them in wildly different ways, and to better or worse effect.
    Understood. We're on the same page. Again, when two people first meet, there's little to go on, and one of the key players is terrified of confronting the other key player; obviously, more actions are required before passing a firm character judgement. However, more actions will not happen, if the OP makes false assumptions and reacts accordingly. I'm suggesting she make the positive assumption that her friend has good intentions, until proven otherwise. That's the healthy approach. My reasoning is within the context of the details provided in this thread.

    I'm not sure they're at that point yet of executing, "I want this relationship to work out"; meaning, I think they're still acquaintences.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Yeah, you shouldn't enter into relationships with a "paranoid-bad attitude," but you should be wary before entering into them. It's the latter that facilitates the former. That's just common sense. Openness ought end where naiveté begins.
    Do you want to fight??



    ...cuz I'm not disagreeing with ya.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    But that she didn't figure out a mature, respectful approach in the first place speaks volumes about her.
    Yeah, you're right.

  5. #45
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    ^In the context of this thread: past experiences, limited facts of these two acquaintances in a newly forming relationship, and my positive view of the world. My calculations have served me well.
    So you're not actually saying to take reality as it is, but rather to use your preferred interpretive lens. It's important not to get those things confused.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Understood. We're on the same page. Again, when two people first meet, there's little to go on, and one of the key players is terrified of confronting the other key player; obviously, more actions are required before passing a firm character judgement. However, more actions will not happen, if the OP makes false assumptions and reacts accordingly. I'm suggesting she make the positive assumption that her friend has good intentions, until proven otherwise. That's the healthy approach. My reasoning is within the context of the details provided in this thread.
    And I'M saying that deferring character judgment by ignoring or rationalizing worrisome actions, under the mistaken belief that you don't have enough information, or that you're being closed-minded/too negative/paranoid, does nothing but waste your time and energy AND needlessly make you vulnerable to personal injury. And I don't think you're in a position to say what's a "healthy approach" or not.

    It seems that we do agree that assuming the worst too soon/on too little evidence AND hanging on blindly in the face of damning evidence are both unhealthy/irrational approaches to relationships. Where we disagree, however, is on the following:

    (1) Assuming the best of people. (I think it's best to be neutral or slightly wary.)
    (2) The OP does not have enough info to make a judgment. (I think she does.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I'm not sure they're at that point yet of executing, "I want this relationship to work out"; meaning, I think they're still acquaintences.
    Yeah, it was an example. That's what "e.g.," means. You didn't think that I literally meant to suggest that "I want this relationship to work out" was either party's actual intention, did you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Do you want to fight??



    ...cuz I'm not disagreeing with ya.
    Yes I do, and yes you are. You even disagree with me that we're disagreeing. Haha.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Yeah, you're right.
    But if you agree with this, then why wouldn't you agree that the OP has enough information to go on to make a judgment?
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    So you're not actually saying to take reality as it is, but rather to use your preferred interpretive lens.
    Hmmm... no, that's not what I said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    It's important not to get those things confused.
    Okay, thx for the clarification. I actually defined reality a couple of posts ago (scroll up).

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    And I'M saying that deferring character judgment by ignoring or rationalizing worrisome actions, under the mistaken belief that you don't have enough information, or that you're being closed-minded/too negative/paranoid, does nothing but waste your time and energy AND needlessly make you vulnerable to personal injury.
    Yep, that goes without saying. And I think timing is everything too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    And I don't think you're in a position to say what's a "healthy approach" or not.
    I feel happy and healthy.

    Orangey, You have a right to your opinion as do I. It's all good. Breathe, relax, release.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Yeah, it was an example. That's what "e.g.," means. You didn't think that I literally meant to suggest that "I want this relationship to work out" was either party's actual intention, did you?
    Welcome to the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Yes I do, and yes you are. You even disagree with me that we're disagreeing. Haha.
    It's light-hearted kiddie stuff. Non-issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    But if you agree with this, then why wouldn't you agree that the OP has enough information to go on to make a judgment?
    Who am I to place judgment on the poor soul I've never met in real life, based soley on hearsay off the Internet. I feel more comfortable providing the OP with some ideas, leaving the options open and allowing the OP to decide for herself.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Hmmm... no.
    Yes.

    Here you recommend that one try their best not to colour their perceptions of reality with a bad attitude.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    If you go into relationships with a paranoid-bad attitude, then you're not really open to 'reality'. (Reality is what 'is', regardless of what one perceives.).
    Then here you said that the way to determine the "most probable" reality is by deliberately colouring your perceptions with a positive attitude.

    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey
    What makes something the more probable reality, according to your calculations?
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    ^In the context of this thread: past experiences, limited facts of these two acquaintances in a newly forming relationship, and my positive view of the world. My calculations have served me well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Okay, thx for the clarification.
    You're welcome.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Yep, that goes without saying. And I think timing is everything.
    Good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I feel happy and healthy.
    I don't think anyone is in a position to declare whether one's approach to other people (suspicious, trusting, neutral, etc.,) is healthy or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Orangey, You have a right to your opinion. It's all good. Breathe, relax, release.
    I was never under the impression that I didn't have the right to my opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Welcome to the game.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post


    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Who am I to place judgment on the poor soul I've never met in real life, based soley on hearsay off the Internet. I feel more comfortable providing the OP with some ideas, leaving the options open and allowing the OP to decide for herself.
    What? Of course the OP has to decide for herself. That's the whole point, right? She presented the scenario, gave us some details, and asked what we think based on the information we've been provided. She asked us for our judgment on the situation given those parameters, not to make a decision FOR her. We're none of us in a position to decide whether to allow the OP to make her own decision or not, so your saying that is meaningless.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I'm not fighting with you. You're right. Now let it go.


    But there's nothing to let go.
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  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    It's not so much their intentions that matter as their actions. Two people can have the same exact intentions (e.g., "I want this relationship to work out") but execute them in wildly different ways, and to better or worse effect.
    And you can have the same action with different intentions so

    People can read into things all the want, but in the end all there doing is playing a game when they do this. Them against the other person, who is gonna win? Relationships arent about winning, its about 2 people getting along and working together.

    If the other person wants to play a game, let them and enjoy it or walk away.

  10. #50
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    Good attitude, good intentions, good karma.

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