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  1. #31
    Don't pet me. JAVO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esoteric Wench View Post
    This impending decision is causing my ISTP a LOT of stress. He doesn't know what happiness is and he's unsure if he's ever experienced it. Ergo, he's unsure if we should get married.
    I'd be a little uncertain about marrying an esoteric wench too! :horor:



    Maybe a more objective definition of happy would help? Since you're living together currently, he can ask himself if he would prefer things to be different. If so, identify what things. Either work on changing them together, or decide if they're deal-breakers.

  2. #32
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    Thumbs down Re: ISTP/ENFP living together

    Quote Originally Posted by missfixit View Post
    How on earth is that frigid? It's called reality.
    Golly, this conversation was gettin' too serious for my INFP taste... I was just playin' around; honest

    Quote Originally Posted by JAVO View Post
    I'd be a little uncertain about marrying an esoteric wench too! :horor:

    Maybe a more objective definition of happy would help? Since you're living together currently, he can ask himself if he would prefer things to be different. If so, identify what things. Either work on changing them together, or decide if they're deal-breakers.
    ^INTP's = witty+smart+charming+++

    ---
    Hmmmmmmmmm what's wrong with this whole "ISTP/ENFP living together" picture as described by the OP? class, anyone??

    I suddenly feel like breaking out the violin...

    It's like a "Monet"... far away it's a beautiful masterpiece, but up close it's a horrible mess, ugh!!!

    Surely I'm not the only nerrrrd here that sees the classic breakdown of male/female dynamics in the worst way. Time for me to keep it real by throwing in my passionate INFP opinion... which comes straight out of the gut... aka, "the well of infinite wisdom" lol!

    First of all, your man should be more concerned about making *you* happy and not himself. <<That alone should prompt a girly up and leave! ("cya!" )

    I believe your first mistake though is living together. "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?" ...wellllz, i'm jist sayin'.

    Besides, what's wrong with low/no pressure living in your own place and dating? If you're uncertain about a relationship, it's best to back off, not move-in ... ugh, just a thought!

    -crickets-

  3. #33
    One day and the next Rainne's Avatar
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    Weathergirl: District 38 is sunny. Slight rock showers this morning. Chance of rock showers into the afternoon—20 percent. District 39 is cloudy. Chance of rock showers this afternoon—10 percent.
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    Edward: Really.

  4. #34
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  5. #35
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by perfectgirl View Post

    First of all, your man should be more concerned about making *you* happy and not himself. <<That alone should prompt a girly up and leave! ("cya!" )
    What?!

    I hope this is sarcasm.
    -end of thread-

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randomnity View Post
    What?!

    I hope this is sarcasm.
    lol nope

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by perfectgirl View Post
    lol nope
    oh, I iz' soz' gonna get you!














  8. #38
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by perfectgirl View Post
    First of all, your man should be more concerned about making *you* happy and not himself. <<That alone should prompt a girly up and leave! ("cya!" )
    Wow! I appreciate you sharing your honest opintion perfectgirl. However, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with your opinion here.

    I don't want to derail this thread's original topic by talking about INFP's dominant Fi and how the INFPs I know (some of which are my best friends) can get so focused on how they think things SHOULD be that they forget to look at how things really are. I suspect there is a little bit of this going on here. That and perhaps a little youthfulness and lack of life experience. (Just a guess but right now this is the best guess I've got.)

    Let me just say that I would not want to date a man who put his happiness before mine. I (once again respectfully) suggest that you shouldn't either. Such notions may sound all well and good in books or on the movie screen, but in real life they don't play out well.

    I want a man who wants my happiness AS MUCH as he wants his own. I want a man who is an equal and who will challenge me.... not cowtow to my whims or blindly subsume his own needs for mine.

    Quote Originally Posted by perfectgirl View Post
    I believe your first mistake though is living together. "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?" ...wellllz, i'm jist sayin'. Besides, what's wrong with low/no pressure living in your own place and dating? If you're uncertain about a relationship, it's best to back off, not move-in ... ugh, just a thought!
    Again, I don't want to go too off topic here. The point of this thread was my ISTP's DLLD (Dreaded Logical Loop of Doom, see earlier posts).

    However, let me just say that we lived four hours apart when we started dating so the trial period was a way for us to be in the same town together while he keeps his apartment in his original town for a couple of months. Sometimes economic realities trump ideals. (And this is not a bad thing.) And as for the milk and cow, unless you are of the ilk that believes in being celibate up until marriage then I see little difference between sleeping with your boyfriend while maintaining different apartments and a time limited trial run of living together. Again, I respect your right to have your opinion, but let me gently suggest that after you've lived long enough to see all the shades of gray in these things, you'll see that one dimensional cultural cliches about milk and cows don't really help in a three dimensional world.

    Thanks again, though, for your honest input.

  9. #39
    Senior Member toast's Avatar
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    My istp has this outlook on happiness too. He is always saying he isn't and has never been "happy", even when he definitely isn't 'unhappy' with things. He is very oblivious to 'meaning', but seems to know its there and just 'escaping' him. He doesn't really equate "fun", "comfort" or "pleasure" with "happy." Its a sort of pursuit he brings up when he is depressed or feeling insecure. He also talks about having difficulty coming to big decisions based on his feelings about them, and seems to envy that in others. He takes long periods of time to process things he considers "big" & usually longer if he feels the pressure of expectations or a deadline. It sounds like maybe stress like that in your situation, but if it happens a lot it could be depression and youth (as in he isn't ready to see marriage as you might). Seems to me like the best time for an istp to marry would be much much later in life than for an enfp.
    ____________________________________________
    "In my soul rages a battle without victor. Between faith without proof and reason without charm." - Sully Prudhomme

  10. #40
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toast View Post
    My istp has this outlook on happiness too. He is always saying he isn't and has never been "happy", even when he definitely isn't 'unhappy' with things. He is very oblivious to 'meaning', but seems to know its there and just 'escaping' him. He doesn't really equate "fun", "comfort" or "pleasure" with "happy." Its a sort of pursuit he brings up when he is depressed or feeling insecure. He also talks about having difficulty coming to big decisions based on his feelings about them, and seems to envy that in others. He takes long periods of time to process things he considers "big" & usually longer if he feels the pressure of expectations or a deadline. It sounds like maybe stress like that in your situation, but if it happens a lot it could be depression and youth (as in he isn't ready to see marriage as you might). Seems to me like the best time for an istp to marry would be much much later in life than for an enfp.
    Very interesting, toast! This thread has helped me more than I expected. I think you articulated what my ISTP goes through very, very well. I like the term koan to describe his ruminations. A koan is a question which cannot be understood by rational thinking, yet it may be accessible by intuition. "Am I happy? What is happiness?" are questions that seem to baffle my ISTP. Intuition is way, way down on the ISTP's function of hierarchies. It is really difficult for him to tap into it at all, much less while feeling time pressure.

    My ISTP is 41 and this is his first toying with the idea of marriage and the first time he's lived with a girlfriend. I'm 39 and was married once before. It's interesting to watch him work out the finer points of living with someone. I learned such things so long ago that I didn't even remember that at one time I had to learn them.

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