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  1. #21
    Junior Member missfixit's Avatar
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    For me, once I am stuck in the Dreaded Logic Loop of Doom (DLLD) the only thing that can pull me out is another person.

    This might be why I am not attracted to other Introverted thinkers. Someone has to slap me and say "get a grip" or "you're being ridiculous", or maybe give me some insight as to why the things I'm anxious about aren't that big of a deal.

    Generally this has been my ENFJ mother. Sometimes it's the ENTJ boyfriend. But somebody I TRUST has to force me out of it. I can also get into a Chicken-Little-the-sky-is-falling-we're-all-gonna-die-on-Tuesday mentality if get trapped long enough.

    I have also learned that I will never make romantic decisions based on my feelings, and that's ok. I just can't.

  2. #22
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by missfixit View Post
    For me, once I am stuck in the Dreaded Logic Loop of Doom (DLLD) the only thing that can pull me out is another person.
    OK, that cracked me up. I think we're going to shamelessly co-opt DLLD in our home.

    Quote Originally Posted by missfixit View Post
    I have also learned that I will never make romantic decisions based on my feelings, and that's ok. I just can't.
    I would love to hear more about this. OK, that's true, but also my ISTP boyfriend is in the room with me here and he wants to know more about this.

    If you don't make them based on your feelings, how do you make them? Thanks so much missfixit.

  3. #23
    Junior Member missfixit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esoteric Wench View Post
    I would love to hear more about this. OK, that's true, but also my ISTP boyfriend is in the room with me here and he wants to know more about this.

    If you don't make them based on your feelings, how do you make them? Thanks so much missfixit.
    Let me put it this way. If my feelings are good toward a person, then they cease to be important in the decision making process. I have to make a decision based on whether the relationship is logical for me.

    So for instance, if I fall "madly in love" (whatever that means) with a man who lives 2,000 miles from me and we can't pick up our lives to move toward one another, then it doesn't matter how much I love him-- I can't do it. I'm not an NF and I won't pine about what could have been.

    But if the relationship seems feasible and comfortable, but my feelings are highly negative, THEN I will try to figure out why I feel that way. then feelings are useful. But only in that scenerio.

    I don't have rapturous feelings that take me on an LSD high or anything. I can usually separate my feelings from my thinking on a subject.

    On the other hand once I make a decision to commit it's done. There's no going back. I don't give up commitments like that. So it's a huge step and I get stuck in endless self-doubt.

  4. #24
    Junior Member missfixit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by perfectgirl View Post
    ^ Wowz, that's frigid!

    Say it ain't so!
    How on earth is that frigid? It's called reality.

    That's a real example. There is a really great guy who asks me to marry him about every other week, but he lives many states away and I won't uproot my children and move across the country to be with him. Because other things take priority over my romantic feelings, and my kids come first.

    Not frigid -- I love my kids.

  5. #25
    Senior Member countrygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by missfixit View Post
    There is a really great guy who asks me to marry him about every other week, but he lives many states away and I won't uproot my children and move across the country to be with him. Because other things take priority over my romantic feelings, and my kids come first.

    Not frigid -- I love my kids.
    Sounds practical. Why doesn't he move to where you live if he wants to marry you?

  6. #26
    Junior Member missfixit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by countrygirl View Post
    Sounds practical. Why doesn't he move to where you live if he wants to marry you?
    because he has children too. See? Somebody would have to uproot their kids. So reality takes precedence over our feelings. I don't think he's an NF. Although he persists in asking me, nevermind that i've turned him down about 40 times so far. I wonder what his type is, he's incredibly persistent. I know he's an E/J.

    Anyway that's not the point. lol

    The point is that my feelings have to take a backseat to my thinking. And that's ok.

  7. #27
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by perfectgirl View Post
    Wowz, that's frigid! Say it ain't so!
    perfectgirl, I don't think that this is frigid. But I do think it is VERY different from the way you, an INFP, sees the world.

    I don't think I could have ever successfully dated an S (much less an ST) before mastering MBTI theory. Let me quote myself when I spoke about this issue in another thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by Esoteric Wench View Post
    I talk about love with a capital L. This is the kind of love that the angels sing about. That you stand upon a mountaintop and proclaim to the world. That poets write about. This is love in its conceptual form. And being able to articulate one's feelings is really important for this kind of love. (How very NF of me, btw.)

    There was a time in my life that I would have said this kind of love was the only real kind of love there was. That is Real with a capital R. And, I would have been ready to tell the Sensors I know that there was something wrong with them because they didn't express their feelings in the way I did. I might have accused them of being unable to dig deep into their feelings. Sort of like they had some emotional block. I might even have gently encouraged them to go to therapy to help them get in touch with their feelings and get unblocked.

    I've since come to understand that I was looking at things the wrong way. I was assuming that everyone thought like me. This was such a fundamental assumption for me that it had never even occurred to me that there was another way to think about love.

    My boyfriend is a concrete thinker. He does not speak my native language (of abstraction) very well at all. So when he hears me make heartfelt declarations about how much I love him, he sometimes asks himself, Why don't I feel that way, too? Is there something wrong with me? Do I just not care for her as deeply as she cares for me? When he told me he was worried that he was fundamentally flawed in some way, here's what I told him:

    "You exude love. You show me you love me everyday in dozens of little ways. Like when you gave me your jacket to keep me warm last night. Like when you made me omelets for breakfast yesterday. Like when you remembered how I said I didn't like the towels folded in a certain way and you folded them differently because you thought this would please me. These are all acts of love. This is love in its tangible form. And, this is you. There is nothing wrong with this.

    "If you wait around until you can articulate your feelings in the way that I do, you're going to wait a very, very long time. You're never going to have these deep, meaningful emotional moments all the time that I have without even trying. You need to give up this idea that there is something wrong with you. There is nothing wrong with you. We just communicate our feelings in very different ways.

    "You ask yourself if you are a deep person. But you are asking the wrong questions. Instead, why don't you ask yourself if you could be happy with a partner who primarily expresses herself not with actions, but by speaking about concepts?

    "Are you willing to translate my expressions of love so you can understand them? Of course, I try to show you that I love you by my actions. But for me, the "money shot" is the act of me articulating my feelings. You need to ask yourself if that's enough for you. You need to ask yourself if you think I can make you happy for 30 years when in some ways we are speaking different languages and we will have to take this into account for the rest of our lives."
    So no, I don't think this was frigid. It just took me a very long time to figure this out.

  8. #28
    Junior Member missfixit's Avatar
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    My love is concrete. It does not sing songs or write poetry.

    If you lose your job I will step up to the plate and do whatever is necessary to keep us afloat. If you get sick I will take care of you. I will not abandon my commitment. And I show love through sex. lol

  9. #29
    Professional Trickster Esoteric Wench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by missfixit View Post
    My love is concrete. It does not sing songs or write poetry.

    If you lose your job I will step up to the plate and do whatever is necessary to keep us afloat. If you get sick I will take care of you. I will not abandon my commitment. And I show love through sex. lol
    This is why I love my ISTP sooooooo much! Sooooooo much. I completely suck at all that stuff. He is my rock. He is my eye of the storm. He can find my keys when I can't.

  10. #30
    Senior Member countrygirl's Avatar
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    Esoteric Wench, what you wrote was poetry to me, a love song

    To understand and respond to someone else's needs that is expressed differently than your own, I consider compassion. After all, we all have needs. May I receive and practise such wisdom as you.

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