[ISTP] ISTP or ADD?

[Charmed Justice]

ah and EnFpFer.... I'm glad there's someone working as an advocate that questions the "system."

The system profits from well, we all know and understand. In America we have a pill for everything, we'll sell you poison just so long as the suppliers can maintain plausible deniability...Michael Jackson comes to mind.

True.

I believe a child deserves a thorough examination of all potential reasons for their behaviors before being given drugs which are blackboxed and untested on the pediatric group. My godson, who I had temporary custody of, had a minor heart attack on a trial of Risperidone, for what the psychiatrist suspected to be austism in combination with ODD and ADHD. The absolute scariest thing I've ever been through. So many of these drugs are household names, and as a result, their strength and severity are often taken for granted. Ritalin is also an extremely dangerous drug. A misdiagnosis is no joke at all.

 

[Walking Tourist]

This is a good point. I have auditory processing disorder, not ADD, although the two disorders can appear alike at times. There is no medication for APD. It's best to know about this before swallowing the pills.

A misdiagnosis is no joke at all.

 

[McRumi]

It's best to know a lot of things before swallowing pills.

 

[ayoitsStepho]

Alot of people that I've been surrounded by in my life had supposedly been diagnosed with ADD or ADHD. I read a few other posts in this thread, I really think its over diagnosed. How do we know these just aren't behavior problems? Or that we're not allowing these kids to get some real exercise and burn off the energy? I do believe there is such things as ADD and ADHD, but I think the number of people who truly have it, are smaller than what they make us all believe.
I also think it has alot to do with the difference of being a male and female. Usually boys have more energy and if they're not burning it off they're going to fidget and lose focus pretty easy. My brothers school tried to tell us that he had ADD and we thought that was ridiculous. We know how he works. He just needs to go outside and run off his energy and then he can relax and concentrate. But at the elementary school, they weren't letting any of the kids go outside and play. Kids didn't have recess at all.
I also think it goes into personality type as well. Some people just don't concentrate well. Doesn't mean you have a disorder. It just means that we have to come up with another way to teach these students. Not everyone is going to learn by just listening. Several kids/students learn hands on, or by seeing something for themselves.
The typical SJ classroom is not going to keep several SP students' attention. We're very hands on.

So I really think there are lots of other factors that play into all of this. I mean, as a nation, the kids are spending more time on the computers, tv, video games and not playing outside. Is it really a wonder that so many kids are being diagnosed with 'ADD' or 'ADHD'? It seems pretty obvious to me.

 

[McRumi]

Of course it is grossly mis-diagnosed. So is depression. That doesn't mean that clinical depression doesn't exist. It's arrogant ignorance to dismiss a known and proven neurobiological disorder because we live in a culture given to the quick fix.

This is no different than wacko Tom Cruise (who is not an ISTP, thank you) saying that post-partum depression doesn't exist.

Lets' distinguish between the phenomenon of misdiagnosis and over-medicating in many areas of our society and the existence of real disorders, like depression, autism, ADD, etc., regardless of how often those disorders are misdiagnosed and mis-treated.

 

[sLiPpY]

Alot of people that I've been surrounded by in my life had supposedly been diagnosed with ADD or ADHD. I read a few other posts in this thread, I really think its over diagnosed. How do we know these just aren't behavior problems? Or that we're not allowing these kids to get some real exercise and burn off the energy? I do believe there is such things as ADD and ADHD, but I think the number of people who truly have it, are smaller than what they make us all believe.
I also think it has alot to do with the difference of being a male and female. Usually boys have more energy and if they're not burning it off they're going to fidget and lose focus pretty easy. My brothers school tried to tell us that he had ADD and we thought that was ridiculous. We know how he works. He just needs to go outside and run off his energy and then he can relax and concentrate. But at the elementary school, they weren't letting any of the kids go outside and play. Kids didn't have recess at all.
I also think it goes into personality type as well. Some people just don't concentrate well. Doesn't mean you have a disorder. It just means that we have to come up with another way to teach these students. Not everyone is going to learn by just listening. Several kids/students learn hands on, or by seeing something for themselves.
The typical SJ classroom is not going to keep several SP students' attention. We're very hands on.

So I really think there are lots of other factors that play into all of this. I mean, as a nation, the kids are spending more time on the computers, tv, video games and not playing outside. Is it really a wonder that so many kids are being diagnosed with 'ADD' or 'ADHD'? It seems pretty obvious to me.

Reading your post makes me mad as hell. Take away recess and expect a child to be able to sit still and learn? Serve fake food in the cafeteria and expect a child to be able to convert that crap into the neurotransmit material that will allow for focus?

There's a school in Georgia where a principal said enough is enough. They serve breakfast, a healthy balanced lunch. They have recess.

Guess what, their students are able to sit still and behave in mass with rare exception. Which isn't to say there weren't a few who needed the auspices of a little extra help.

Just that looking over your post reminded me of seeing that story in the national media last year, thinking now why aren't all the schools doing that?

 

[Charmed Justice]

Do you remember the name of the school? The Appleton Wisconsin High School did the same thing-removing vending machines and all junk food items; and ultimately, featuring all natural foods cooked on site. They saw what amounted to an overnight change in what was originally a very dangerous, inattentive, student body. They also experimented with environmental ambiance, dabbling with how light, color, and sound impact the behaviors of the student body. That too yielded positive results, which makes sense. Marketing researchers spend quite a bit of time studying how musical tempo impacts buying behavior, and how lighting and colors make us act and feel certain ways. Here is the case study if you're interested: Case Study: Appleton Central Alternative Charter High School

 

[sLiPpY]

I wish I could remember, and have been unsuccessful in querying the article.

My favorite quote from that article as I recall was "Cake makes my tummy hurt." When describing the children's expressed preference for fresh fruit over other treats when being interviewed.

Thanks for sharing the case study, information like that is very helpful to even big kids like me.

 

[McRumi]

One of the biggest mistakes our "educators" did was to close our trade schools.

If I had kids, I'd definitely home school em. Our schools are toxic in more ways than one.

None of which changes the reality of ADD.

 

[McRumi]

I wish I could remember, and have been unsuccessful in querying the article.

My favorite quote from that article as I recall was "Cake makes my tummy hurt." When describing the children's expressed preference for fresh fruit over other treats when being interviewed.

Thanks for sharing the case study, information like that is very helpful to even big kids like me.

Sadly, a lot of the fresh fruit we grow in the USA is crap too. Tasteless, dull, insipid. Not to mention our meats etc. Full of chemicals and god knows what else.

We are poisoning ourselves little by little...and often not so little by little.

 

[sLiPpY]

Sadly, a lot of the fresh fruit we grow in the USA is crap too. Tasteless, dull, insipid. Not to mention our meats etc. Full of chemicals and god knows what else.

We are poisoning ourselves little by little...and often not so little by little.

I completely agree, and the cost of buying quality non-contaminated food is outrageous.

There's no comparison between Free Range, grazing, non growth hormone injected cattle and the crap they sell at the grocery counter.

 

[Charmed Justice]

I wish I could remember, and have been unsuccessful in querying the article.

My favorite quote from that article as I recall was "Cake makes my tummy hurt." When describing the children's expressed preference for fresh fruit over other treats when being interviewed.

Thanks for sharing the case study, information like that is very helpful to even big kids like me.

No problem, I'll have to go searching for it.

So many children and adults are undernourished by the standard diet, that's for sure.

 

[lookingglassworld]

I'm not ISTP but I have a short attention span as well. In school if it didn't interest me you might as well forget about getting good grades!! I usually just read a good book(Yes,I love to read) lol I didn't have any problem listing on the honor roll!!

 

[Heinel]

You guys should start a health advice panel here at TypoC.



Edit: Oh wow sneaky posters cutting my line :steam:

 

[McRumi]

ISTPs do not have short attention spans. They often work for very long stretches at a time...extremely hyperfocussded....but mostly in hand's-on activity. Our passive education system guarantees they will have problems. Those with ADD however lose focus even with hand's on activity. They lack the appropriate chemistry.

 

[iamathousandapples]

I used to be on a bunch of ADD/ADHD meds including ritalin. They never really did anything except made me extremely depressed. In fact, the three years since I've been off the meds has been way more productive than when I was on them.

...This is a lesson: make absolutely sure your child has ADD/ADHD before accepting the blanket diagnosis.

 

[McRumi]

I have been taking 80 mgs of Ritalin daily for 15 years. I have had not a single negative reaction...only positive ones. A person without ADD could not sustain this regimen without serious psychological, mental and physical damage.

Every person is unique. ADD is real.

 

[sLiPpY]

As McRumi points out, I do believe ADD or ADHD is real for many people. I grew up with a cousin that suffered from the more classic hyperactive symptoms. That poor kid was in constant motion and he couldn't help it at all. It wasn't a dietary or parenting issue my relatives were some very good, loving and caring emotionally balanced folks.

They were a bright spot in an often quirky picture.

I also believe there are many people unnecessarily medicated or concerned about life issues that can be addressed in a more holistic way.

Depression is a prime example. Some depression is just normal, it tells us that something about life sucks and we're supposed to cycle through that way...like when a parent dies. We're in a job that isn't a good fit. We're in a relationship that is not supportive of our emotional well being. We experience some form of loss...

Cycling through and being bummed out for even a lengthy period of time is perfectly normal in those circumstance.

By the same token, there are some who for whatever reason...one's body doesn't manufacture the stuff that leads to a balanced range of feeling.

I like that so many have shared on the topic, and am trying to be careful in my word choice so that people continue to feel comfortable sharing without feeling judged or invalidated.

 

[iamathousandapples]

I have been taking 80 mgs of Ritalin daily for 15 years. I have had not a single negative reaction...only positive ones. A person without ADD could not sustain this regimen without serious psychological, mental and physical damage.

Every person is unique. ADD is real.

The ritalin didn't actually do anything(or at least it didn't do what it was intended). A few of the later ones(Strattera, concerta) made me really depressed.

 

[Charmed Justice]

I used to be on a bunch of ADD/ADHD meds including ritalin. They never really did anything except made me extremely depressed. In fact, the three years since I've been off the meds has been way more productive than when I was on them.

...This is a lesson: make absolutely sure your child has ADD/ADHD before accepting the blanket diagnosis.

For sure. I actually found a neat article that Keirsey wrote on ADD: The Great A.D.D. Hoax - The Natural Child Project

The entire article is about Keirsey's work with SPs.