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  1. #11
    Senior Member Auto/Virtuosi=L.A.P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I have this with my T/F, as you can see.

    This is why I think Temperament is a bit contrived. It really only works well if your letters aren't close. If you're on the border between INFJ and INTJ, you're going to look like an NT at sometimes, and an NF at others. I've been told as much. There's not some fundamental difference in motivation that exists equally across all preference strengths, types within a temperament, or function orders.
    I can agree with you. Human behavior can't be pegged 100% to these results, or even be the best guide to finding mates. Although I myself can't ignore what accuracy I see in it, it makes sense to give less credit to it than what we see ourselves. Plus, we'd be boring if it were so easy to apply.

    As for seeming like one type at a point and another type at another... Cool. haha I guess we have what we want. I just go with ISTP since it's more my behavioral territory. Do you agree with your typing for the most part?
    And there I stood... The devil of a command that featured death...

  2. #12
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auto/Virtuosi=L.A.P. View Post
    I can agree with you. Human behavior can't be pegged 100% to these results, or even be the best guide to finding mates. Although I myself can't ignore what accuracy I see in it, it makes sense to give less credit to it than what we see ourselves. Plus, we'd be boring if it were so easy to apply.
    Yep, that's what I mean. I think it really depends on the person as to which letters are more important. Yeah, temperament can be a good guide if all your letters are strong, or the weak ones don't coincide with temperament boundaries, but it gets messy when they're not, or if you don't fully identify with either archetype.

    I can't just accept that it works that way when my experience and common sense says it doesn't.
    As for seeming like one type at a point and another type at another... Cool. haha I guess we have what we want. I just go with ISTP since it's more my behavioral territory. Do you agree with your typing for the most part?
    Yeah, for the most part, though sometimes I seem NT-ish. Ultimately, I'm too sentimental and sensitive to be one, though, even if I can be harsh and cold from time-to-time.

    Do you sometimes feel NT-ish as well? Just curious.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Auto/Virtuosi=L.A.P.'s Avatar
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    Glad you asked, actually. I had never given much thought to being like either SP or NT. In fact...sheesh, now that I look into it, I heavily fall into both categories on and off all the time. The sensing half of me is super inclined to adventure and daydreaming about it. The intuitive half makes me somewhat a perfectionist and hard worker. I even think they overlap. Being perfectionistic is such a thrill for me as a musician. I think too much as I particularly dislike it, and I'm all around independent. heh Wow... Who would have me? lol

    Sentimental and sensitive? Yep, that is very INFJ-ish, just from my experience with them. I've got an INTJ father and brother. So I can understand what you mean by the coldness. yikes. Really glad you asked me 'cuz I wouldn't have looked into the NT thing.
    And there I stood... The devil of a command that featured death...

  4. #14
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    The only attribute anywhere near 50% in most cases is E/I.

    Claims of being "really borderline" between stats on any of the other scales is almost always a symptom of poor self-analysis and a lack of background in typological theory.

    (For instance, many people mistakenly believe they are borderline P/J, but they're not. This is due to the MBTI's oversimplification of the true nature of P/J...the same happens with other attributes. People operate based on arbitrary surface characteristics shown by some people of their type and lose focus, deciding they are just "very borderline" because they don't understand the concepts enough to make a clear decision.)

    So yes, occasionally, but not nearly as often as people think.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  5. #15
    Senior Member Auto/Virtuosi=L.A.P.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    The only attribute anywhere near 50% in most cases is E/I.

    Claims of being "really borderline" between stats on any of the other scales is almost always a symptom of poor self-analysis and a lack of background in typological theory.

    (For instance, many people mistakenly believe they are borderline P/J, but they're not. This is due to the MBTI's oversimplification of the true nature of P/J...the same happens with other attributes. People operate based on arbitrary surface characteristics shown by some people of their type and lose focus, deciding they are just "very borderline" because they don't understand the concepts enough to make a clear decision.)

    So yes, occasionally, but not nearly as often as people think.
    Really? I'll keep that in mind. I guess the only real solution to being successfully typed is knowing yourself. Yet, ironically, many take these tests to find out just that. Ironic. oh well, let the good times roll. haha
    And there I stood... The devil of a command that featured death...

  6. #16
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    The only attribute anywhere near 50% in most cases is E/I.

    Claims of being "really borderline" between stats on any of the other scales is almost always a symptom of poor self-analysis and a lack of background in typological theory.

    (For instance, many people mistakenly believe they are borderline P/J, but they're not. This is due to the MBTI's oversimplification of the true nature of P/J...the same happens with other attributes. People operate based on arbitrary surface characteristics shown by some people of their type and lose focus, deciding they are just "very borderline" because they don't understand the concepts enough to make a clear decision.)

    So yes, occasionally, but not nearly as often as people think.
    I take exception to your assertion. I've been studying the theory for a while now, and I'd say I understand typology pretty well. But I still think I have more in common with INTJs than INFPs, even though I'm supposed to be an NF. Are you telling me that disagreeing with Keirsey means I don't understand the theory well enough?

    Sorry if I misinterpreted, I'm just kind of oversensitive to Keirsey supporters these days, because they keep saying things that make absolutely no sense and don't apply to me. It can be frustrating.

  7. #17
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I take exception to your assertion. I've been studying the theory for a while now, and I'd say I understand typology pretty well. But I still think I have more in common with INTJs than INFPs, even though I'm supposed to be an NF. Are you telling me that disagreeing with Keirsey means I don't understand the theory well enough?

    Sorry if I misinterpreted, I'm just kind of oversensitive to Keirsey supporters these days, because they keep saying things that make absolutely no sense and don't apply to me. It can be frustrating.
    Keirsey is bullshit. A cursory functional understanding shows that INFJs are far more similar to INTJs than to INFPs because they're both dominant in Ni.

    More importantly, though, you have the J in common with them and that's much more important than T/F or even N/S. The most important letter, by far, is P/J. You're probably more similar to ESTJ than you are to INFP!

    New temperaments based on functional attitudes instead of arbitrary surface characteristics:

    EP Explorers (dominant Pe, secondary Ji, tertiary Je, inferior Pi)
    IP Observers (Ji, Pe, Pi, Je)
    EJ Leaders (Je, Pi, Pe, Ji)
    IJ Analysts (Pi, Je, Ji, Pe)
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  8. #18
    triple nerd score poppy's Avatar
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    Sim's right on that one.
    "There's no need to be embarrassed about it, Mr. Spock. It happens to the birds and the bees!"

  9. #19
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Keirsey is bullshit. A cursory functional understanding shows that INFJs are far more similar to INTJs than to INFPs because they're both dominant in Ni.

    More importantly, though, you have the J in common with them and that's much more important than T/F or even N/S. The most important letter, by far, is P/J. You're probably more similar to ESTJ than you are to INFP!

    New temperaments based on functional attitudes instead of arbitrary surface characteristics:

    EP Explorers (dominant Pe, secondary Ji, tertiary Je, inferior Pi)
    IP Observers (Ji, Pe, Pi, Je)
    EJ Leaders (Je, Pi, Pe, Ji)
    IJ Analysts (Pi, Je, Ji, Pe)


    You saw those too?! You're not one of them, then. You understand functional order and believe it's as important as the individual letters, AND you agree with me about the bookend letters being the most clear temperament distinctions.

  10. #20
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    ^ Yup.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

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