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  1. #11
    Senior Member Bamboo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanveane View Post
    Any suggestions as to what an ISTP might appreciate or respond to when they are feeling low?
    * Keep sugar-frosted sympathy to a minimum
    For me, when someone seems to be saying things just to make me feel better, I basically stop listening (possible rationale on why that happens available above). I don't want to feel better. I want to BE better.
    Instead of sympathy, offer advice that will help me actually move on/improve.

    * Offer advice with reasoning of why said advice is useful
    If you went back and read that first bullet point without the explanation, would you understand it as well? Why?

    * Humor
    Laughing is good for you when you feel bad.

    Teasing is not only acceptable, but highly effective at getting me to see the situation from another perspective.

    * Point out flaws in reasoning, blind spots, and confirmation bias
    I'm not offended if someone tears apart my reasoning

    While difficult to prove, I think feeling bad is often associated with:
    - missing points completely (aka blind spots): point out what I don't see so I can plan for it better
    - confirmation bias, which is really just an extension of blind spots.
    Don't know how much it'll bend til it breaks.

  2. #12
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kendoiwan View Post
    My best advice would to be find the angle. If he's anything like me, there's a song or a movie, a t.v. show, a book (some form of art) that embodies exactly what it is that bothers him. If you can find that angle he'll talk about it freely and objectively as possible and relate it to what's going on with him.
    For me, it's nostalgic music with meaningful lyrics. But the best thing are those long walks around a nice setting with water.

  3. #13
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sanveane View Post
    I have a friend who is ISTP. (Definitely Dominant Ti, and very practical. I used to think he was INTP but he is far too practically minded.)

    He told me the other night that he has been really down for months. I was very taken aback and told him I would never have known... He started to talk about it and then stopped abruptly and said if he talked about it, it would feel worse.

    I would like to be there for him if possible. I don't understand his inner world well. My instinct is to not probe him too much but to let him know if he wants to talk I am there to listen. (Well, my instinct really is to hug him but he would probably freak out.) I want him to talk, he typically buries things that are painful or feeling oriented. Any suggestions as to what an ISTP might appreciate or respond to when they are feeling low?
    Read one of Naomi Quenck's books "Beside Ourselves" or "Was That Really Me" (essentially the same book). What you describe is indicative of Ti dominant types while in the grip. Some tale-tell signs will be emphasizing logic to an extreme, hypersensitive to relationships and emotionalism. Things that may trigger these episodes is being around people expressing strong emotions, when our values and feelings are not recognized or affirmed, our need for silence and solitude are not being met and feeling controlled by arbitrary circumstances.

    ITPs are the one type that even those closest to them never realize when in the grip. We keep important things to oursleves. The one thing that she suggests is not to intrude and not to try and help Ti dominant types work out their problems. It sounds as though your instincts are serving you well in reading him. Allow him to work through his problems. You sound like a great friend in appreciating his needs. He will tell you if, and how, you can help but don't take it as a slight if that request never comes since we are also the most independent types. Good luck and good luck to your friend.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Bamboo's Avatar
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    These are some good posts. Some commentary:

    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    But the best thing are those long walks around a nice setting with water.
    Talk to them during an activity. It's more comfortable and enjoyable. Worst thing you could do would be to corner that person into their private space and start a conversation with them about something they don't want to talk about in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    What you describe is indicative of Ti dominant types while in the grip. Some tale-tell signs will be emphasizing logic to an extreme, hypersensitive to relationships and emotionalism. Things that may trigger these episodes is being around people expressing strong emotions, when our values and feelings are not recognized or affirmed, our need for silence and solitude are not being met and feeling controlled by arbitrary circumstances.
    I second all of this.

    ITPs are the one type that even those closest to them never realize when in the grip. We keep important things to oursleves. The one thing that she suggests is not to intrude and not to try and help Ti dominant types work out their problems. It sounds as though your instincts are serving you well in reading him. Allow him to work through his problems. You sound like a great friend in appreciating his needs. He will tell you if, and how, you can help but don't take it as a slight if that request never comes since we are also the most independent types. Good luck and good luck to your friend.
    Bolded parts especially true. If I don't ask for someone's help, that doesn't mean I don't find them valuable. Forced help will not be appreciated.
    Don't know how much it'll bend til it breaks.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by phoenity View Post
    Who said anything about disappearing!? It's like you already know me. This is actually something I've done all my life. Gone out of people's lives without a backward glance or a goodbye, for various reasons, whether I was trying to push them away, or if I just needed an extended period alone. I've never looked at it as me "disappearing", but then again I've never thought about how other people perceived this behavior, or whether they take it personally.
    You know you really drop off the face of the earth when an INFJ thinks so!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bamboo View Post

    While difficult to prove, I think feeling bad is often associated with:
    - missing points completely (aka blind spots): point out what I don't see so I can plan for it better
    - confirmation bias, which is really just an extension of blind spots.
    He is extremely intelligent and rather skeptical. So the above, when it occurs, is difficult to unseat. I just try to make observations in a cause and effect style. I think it may be the best way to speak with him.

    Everything you wrote is so applicable!

    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    Read one of Naomi Quenck's books "Beside Ourselves" or "Was That Really Me" (essentially the same book). What you describe is indicative of Ti dominant types while in the grip. Some tale-tell signs will be emphasizing logic to an extreme, hypersensitive to relationships and emotionalism. Things that may trigger these episodes is being around people expressing strong emotions, when our values and feelings are not recognized or affirmed, our need for silence and solitude are not being met and feeling controlled by arbitrary circumstances.

    ITPs are the one type that even those closest to them never realize when in the grip. We keep important things to oursleves. The one thing that she suggests is not to intrude and not to try and help Ti dominant types work out their problems. It sounds as though your instincts are serving you well in reading him. Allow him to work through his problems. You sound like a great friend in appreciating his needs. He will tell you if, and how, you can help but don't take it as a slight if that request never comes since we are also the most independent types. Good luck and good luck to your friend.
    Thank you, very interesting. I will try and find one of them. The bold parts in the first paragraph are particularly apt. I have recognized those things in him. He is towards the extreme end of the spectrum of those behaviors. I have often felt really conflicted about my desire to help him, not wanting to intrude but able to see certain solutions along the lines of better planning.

    Reading over the last few posts is very encouraging... These are the kinds of things I instinctively want to do with him. It's been hard to know if my natural way of reacting has been useful. We are meeting up this weekend to talk. Definitely going to try Kendo's suggestion, would never have thought of that.

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