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  1. #41
    Senior Member Dwigie's Avatar
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    Well I suppose my friend is an ISFP and here are a few traits that bother me about her:

    1. Avoidance, denial of negative feelings. "Put on a happy face 24/7"(PS: she can hate your guts deeply and will never show it. ._.' )

    2. She has this laid back attitude that is sometimes borderline laziness.

    3. She acts like an idiot, a helpless defenseless girl to get people to lower their defenses but could probably get to them easily if she wanted. (ISFPs are not harmless, nobody is)
    STOP acting like a victim! If you can withstand such crap then you're probably tougher than you guys think.(Also, they use the number 3 to get people to do things for them sometimes -.-)

    4. She whines about many things that are wrong with her life but doesn't do anything about it...(see number 2.)PS: They are things she could easily fix if she took time to do them.

    (From my own limited personal experience. Might not apply to all ISFPs)
    Sometimes I feel like I'm "on Mercury"-

  2. #42
    Intriguing.... Quinlan's Avatar
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    Interesting Pecan, I think the root of a lot of your problems with ISFPs seems to be a need for the ISFP to be emotionally expressive (verbally), like you see Fi in us and you desperately want that Fi to be Fe.

    We can be emotionally expressive (more likely through art though) but it almost feels like going against the grain, it feels unnatural. What I said before about sharing feelings and not them not feeling real/meaningful, perhap valid is a better word. For example when my wife (an Fe dom) shares her emotions, they feel more valid to her, when I share my emotions (an Fi dom) they somehow feel less valid almost tacky in a way. We generally express our F through Se, through touch, through art and action.

    As an ENTP i can understand your frustration as we don't share any primary functions and our function orders don't match at all, ENTPs are enigmas to me aswell.

  3. #43
    Intriguing.... Quinlan's Avatar
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    So much interesting stuff in this thread.

    i know you guys don't value conflict at all...i don't, but sometimes it is important to not allow boundaries to be crossed...what if your child is being bullied?..do you not stand up and say something bec you can't stand conflict, or do you just worry about your feelings not being ruffled up and to hell with your child's feelings and safety...this can be a real stinker of a problem...
    I would expect a healthy ISFP to deal with that issue in a calm and rational manner, what really bothers me personally about conflict is that most of it is unnessary, screaming matches aren't problem solving and problem solving is what I do.

  4. #44
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolfy View Post
    I have to admit...
    That's a pretty good description of my negative traits pecan.

    I hate you now and will never again eat pecan pie. If somebody offers me pecan pie I will give them a look of disgust but no reasons.
    LOL....

    Nuttier than a fruit cake, that one.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Grayscale's Avatar
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    im not familiar with any ISFPs on this board besides Jeffster and Sunshine, but they're definitely cool and likable people in my book.

  6. #46
    Intriguing.... Quinlan's Avatar
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    Just another thought, if we hate people but never show that we hate them, how do you know we hate them?

  7. #47
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinlan View Post
    Just another thought, if we hate people but never show that we hate them, how do you know we hate them?
    The deadly Care Bear stare?

  8. #48
    Charting a course
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    The deadly Care Bear stare?
    The accidental push in front of a speeding train?

  9. #49
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    I don't hate ISFPs although I'm pretty sure I could make myself hate them if I tried

    But one ISFP trait that annoys me to tears is the tendency to avoid conflict at all costs. Many ISFPs I know will avoid saying or doing something that needs to be done simply to avoid the potential of conflict arising. Most people don't like conflict, but ISFPs run for their life from it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quinlan View Post
    Just another thought, if we hate people but never show that we hate them, how do you know we hate them?
    I can tell when my closest ISFP friend is not fond of a person because his facial expression changes from the usual happy to grim when he sees the person in question. Then he tries to avoid being close to or interacting with the person.

  10. #50
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Okay, well since Wolfy, Quin, AND Penguin all took the time to go through this line by line, I can't let them show me up here. Thanks a lot guys for being un-lazy for once. :steam:

    Anyway, here goes...


    Quote Originally Posted by pecan111 View Post
    1-They either tend to look all soft and all, but I call it "the Great Sadness"...this version seems to be so depressed and scared and have some form of anxiety that permeates their personalities
    I don't really know what this means, but I am not usually depressed or scared.

    2-The other version tends to be very deadpan( they may be less preferential towards "F", not sure), but they can be very funny, but can cause enormous pain with others.
    What do you mean by "deadpan"? I don't think I have caused enormous pain to others. If I did, no one has told me.

    Version 2 is the type I can't deal with anymore. Some of the reasons why follow.
    -refuse to state their feelings and allow others to GUESS all the time. I do think some of them live in a world of FEAR that keeps them frozen all the time.
    definitely not true of me, I don't refuse to state my feelings

    -expect others to JUST KNOW how they feel and give it to them(think this is a trait of feelers in general)
    My face is pretty expressive, so much so that people will sometimes read things in it that aren't there - like my mom (INFJ) thinking I'm in a bad mood because I'm "scowling" when I'm really just concentrating on what I'm doing. If anyone ever wants to know how I feel, all they have to do is ask and I will tell them.

    -are hurt when they dont' receive what they expect, but you will pay absolute hell getting it out of them
    This is one of those things that doesn't seem like it's ISFP-specific. Isn't everyone hurt when they don't receive what they expect? If anything, I think that SP-type people get over that hurt faster than most others do.

    I don't know what "you will pay absolute hell getting it out of them" means.

    -conflict avoidant to the MAX and extreme (have a great friend whose son REFUSED to even sit down and talk to him about some issues going on in the household)
    This one is funny to me. Why is this a negative? Why would anyone WANT conflict? I mean, sure every once in awhile some drama can be exciting, but I find that some will occur anyway, even trying to avoid conflict. There's definitely no reason to seek it out. And I wouldn't refuse to discuss issues.

    -will put things and DOGS, especially, OVER people
    Too vague, need specific examples or scenarios in order for me to tell you what I would do. I don't like dogs, though.

    -will want a lot of weekend breaks , usually outdoors, BUT you must figure out that they supposedly want to spend time with you, BUT what I really think is that they want to experience nature AND not people
    This is another one that's funny. Wanting a lot of weekend breaks is a negative?? I want to experience nature AND people. If I'm experiencing nature, I love to share the experience with people.

    -(sorry, but its true a lot of the time)--LAZY!!!!, unmotivated
    Well, I already admitted my laziness, but like Quinlan alluded to, we can work extremely hard on something we're actually interested in.

    -can't seem to understand that people will disappoint, BUT that they DISAPPOINT deeply
    I think I understand pretty well that people aren't perfect, and all of us will disappoint somebody at sometime.

    -pay lipservice and will not follow thru- in other words, can be adroit liars and superficial people
    I need more specifics on this one too - pay lipservice to what? Will not follow through with what? What does "adroit" mean? I can be superficial, yes, I admit that, but again I don't think that's type specific. Anybody can be superficial. NFs might be the least likely, but even they can be.

    -STILL waters DO NOT run deep
    What does that mean?

    -good at being quiet, BUT NOT LISTENING...boy, this happens all the time
    I'm a really good listener when I'm paying attention. Yes, you do have to get my attention because I am always in the middle of something. That's just how I am, I'm not going to be sitting, twiddling my thumbs, waiting for someone to talk to me, I'm going to be DOING something with my time. But if I am focused on the person speaking, then I listen VERY well, and remember even the small details. Ask anyone who has chatted with me on Ventrilo here how often I will recall from memory what they said the night before, the week before, the month before, or longer.

    My mother and I actually came to an agreement about this. When I am driving and she is a passenger on long car trips, she likes to talk because it makes her feel less nervous about the trip, but she knows I won't be listening the whole time, so I told her if there's something she really wants me to remember, to get my attention and I will listen hard to that, but otherwise I will tune her out some and focus on the things I enjoy when driving such as the scenery and the roads and the music I've got playing, and just the feel of the drive and the experience.

    -want to be liked and loved but won't risk intimately alot of the time
    already addressed and pretty much admitted to this one

    -can be either good or LOUSy lovers
    Like the others said, this one can apply to anybody.

    -deadpan and boring-poker face to the max and you just can't get a feel for where they are at all
    Definitely not true for me, like I said, I have a very expressive face, and don't hide my feelings.

    -can be emotionally very dead once they give up, which you will likely never know because they won't tell you
    Don't know what this is about, give up on what?

    -can be very selfish with their THINGS, but won't share themselves with others
    Not true for me, I like sharing things and myself with others.

    -terrible at verbal communication
    I think this used to be true, but I have developed my verbal communication skills a lot with time and experience. It all came down to confidence, and I am much more confident now than I used to be.

    -i have known a few that were CHEATERS and very disloyal- others that were very loyal and were faithful
    Yeah, you just said we can be either, and again this can apply to any type.

    -have terrible attitudes about money...just either won't budget or won't compromise
    I have a GREAT attitude about money. I believe it should be used to enjoy life! Budget, smudget. I make sure my son's needs are taken care of, and I also make sure he has plenty of opportunity to have fun, get exercise, learn new stuff, etc. Sure, I do get in a jam now and then, but I always figure out a way to get out of it. I always have, so I figure I always will.


    -NEED kindness from others, but when you ask for somethign specific from them, they won't be kind in return
    Not true for me, you ask me for something specific, I will do my best to help you however I can. It is the vague requests that I have trouble meeting, not the specific ones.

    -can have serious issues with using others and lying
    Hmmmm...using others - I don't try to. Or only if someone lets me maybe? I dunno, it's too vague again. I guess you could say I have used my girlfriends, but then they've used me too, and only to the extent that we let each other. I used to lie a lot, not so much anymore. But almost never in a sinister way - always just embellishing stories that I thought weren't exciting enough or to my parents to try to avoid getting in trouble as a kid.

    -won't fight for what is right or valued, will NOT stand up for family or anyone for that matter, but boy try and say no to their latest "toy" want
    I'd need to know a specific situation and how I would "fight" or "stand up" for someone. I feel I would do anything I ever could for my son. And I am quick to defend anyone I feel is unfairly attacked, it is a natural instinct with me. Sometimes I even go too far in that and defend someone who didn't need it.

    -will refuse to apologize for hurts they caused, but boy, you sure are expected to bend for them
    I can admit I have been stubborn about apologizing if I didn't feel like I did anything wrong. It's like giving up a piece of my freedom to bow down to standards that I don't accept.

    --sometimes strive for this inner ideal but won't care to do the work necessary to understand the monetary or social cost. they will decide this on a moment's notice sometimes and then expect you to foot the bill.
    Again, too vague for me to know what to say about this one.

    -some are extremely insecure, but this is true with all types
    ....

    -can make themselves sick because of the avoidance tendencies.
    I think I used to do this, I had to shift as I matured. Now I have a quicker temper, but I get over stuff quicker now too. I don't let it build to sickness levels.

    --and lastly, they can absolutely HATE someone, but they will remain invisible and without opinion bec. they want you to think they actually like you!, when they don't- after all, who hates the UN-opinioned?
    I don't hate anyone. I certainly don't like EVERYBODY, but I do my best to love them.


    Remember, this is nearly 30 years of working with MBTI types. I don't mean to sound like they are all like this. I consider all their development over their lifetimes...some are very good people and very loving, in their way, but the other version just seem to have turned into the evil twin...Its like they go to the dark side and just camp there.....

    your comments, thoughts, feedback????
    Remember that all people are still individuals. And even if you have encountered 300 people that typed as ISFP, the next 300 could be quite different in some ways. Obviously there are some things we have in common, that's what makes us identify ourselves in this way, but a lot of situation-based stuff goes into what makes up our total personality. I like what David Keirsey wrote about the difference between temperament and character. Temperament is our inborn traits and character is our learned traits. Two people can start from the same basic framework and lead very different lives because of the different decisions they make in similar situations.
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

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