[ESTP] Changing into an ESTP?

[stellar renegade]

That's why I go with Keirsey theory. It's the only thing that actually makes sense to me. It's integrated instead of separated into tiny bits like the other systems.

 

[Athenian200]

That's why I go with Keirsey theory. It's the only thing that actually makes sense to me. It's integrated instead of separated into tiny bits like the other systems.

I think Keirsey only works for SPs.

It doesn't work so well for me... I only barely relate to the NF archetype. I actually relate to something that looks like a cross between some parts of the NF archetype, a few parts of the SJ archetype, and a couple pieces of the NT archetype. In other words, I can relate to all three of the non-SP archetypes.

As far as I'm concerned, that's pretty much how Keirsey's divides up... SPs and non-SPs. No other meaningful distinctions.

 

[stellar renegade]

Seems to work pretty well for everyone I've introduced to it. They say it describes their respective temperaments very nicely. I've yet to read the Rational description to my friend but it sounds just like him.

I think you're just trying to make things too complicated. Typical Idealist.

 

[Aerithria]

Oh well that makes even less senseSe is secondary i suppose.....lol wow fuck MBTI.

You're attempting to correlate the two systems too much. Both systems use the first and last letter to determine the functions, but in different ways. Socionics does it by using the J/P to determine which function comes first, and then uses the I/E to determine the orientation of the function, so an ISTp becomes Si/Te. MBTI uses the J/P to determine the extroverted function, and uses I/E to determine which function set comes first (the introverted one vs the extroverted one), so an ISTP becomes Ti/Se. Make any sense?

Seems to work pretty well for everyone I've introduced to it. They say it describes their respective temperaments very nicely. I've yet to read the Rational description to my friend but it sounds just like him.

I think you're just trying to make things too complicated. Typical Idealist.

Athenian is right. The reason it works well for SPs and SJs is that it accurately describes their mode of perception, which is why it's easy for them to relate to those profiles. However, NF and NT say nothing about anything. It doesn't tell their mode of perception or mode of judgement, so while there are some people that relate to it, there are many others that don't. It's also happened that two people from the same temperament can both relate to that temperament, yet both seem completely foreign to each other simply because one happens to be an NP and the other an NJ.

Though I've also read pages on how ISTPs can look like INTs and ESFPs like ENFPs, so even then it can be hard to tell.

 

[stellar renegade]

Athenian is right. The reason it works well for SPs and SJs is that it accurately describes their mode of perception, which is why it's easy for them to relate to those profiles. However, NF and NT say nothing about anything. It doesn't tell their mode of perception or mode of judgement, so while there are some people that relate to it, there are many others that don't.

Can you be more specific? KTT focuses on external observations and not trying to get inside the heads of other people, that's probly why. It tells what it looks like to observe a temperament from the outside, that's why it's so easy to use.

It's also happened that two people from the same temperament can both relate to that temperament, yet both seem completely foreign to each other simply because one happens to be an NP and the other an NJ.

Though I've also read pages on how ISTPs can look like INTs and ESFPs like ENFPs, so even then it can be hard to tell.

Sure, there might be similarities, but there's always the fundamental distinction between temperament.

Of course NPs look different from NJs. NPs are inquirers and thus structurers, while NJs are enterprisers and thus stratifiers. That doesn't entail that they're not both Rationals. Each temperament is split down the middle like that. Have you read up on the temperaments? Plus there's alot more that goes into the theory besides just temperament that you probably don't realize, like I just showed you.