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  1. #1
    soft and silky sarah's Avatar
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    Default uses of type, and why I'm leaving

    This probably isn't the best place for this, but I feel like I ought to at least explain myself, since I've been asked to...

    It's not just that it's a new year, and at this time I always feel the need to make some changes that I think will help me accomplish my goals and give me time to do things I really want to do. Although that may be part of it. I'm simply not enamored of the way many people use psychological type, and am no longer interested in logging in every day to read complaints and generalizations which have no substance behind them, and I've noticed that responding to these posts mostly only gets me damned as being politically correct or oversensitive. It's a shame that being fair, honest and sensitive to how type is used is thought by many to be a detriment rather than an asset.

    I believe it's true that you catch more flies with honey, and maybe I haven't been diplomatic enough in this forum. I admit I do have a quick temper, (although it dissipates pretty fast) and I also admit that I have a hard time suffering fools gladly. I think in this instance, the people I don't care to have anything more to do with are those who have chosen to use pscyhological type as a weapon to bash "types" of people who have hurt them in the past (and they're quick to label whole types as being a problem, never just individuals), or people who would rather complain about their relationships or communication problems than actually take steps to make things better.

    I passionately believe that the only positive way of using type is to see it as a tool that informs you as to the best way to ask the right kinds of questions, and also frame people's responses in a positive way. It also seems obvious that most of what's labeled as type-related really isn't. Your ex-boyfriends' messy habits, your bosses lack of thoughtfulness, your best friends' flightiness, your mother's bossiness, etc., is probably related more to what they grew up with and what's going on in their individual lives, not their "type code". I suspect most of what people like to believe is type-related is actually just the result of individuals we know having lived at a certain time, in a certain place, under certain circumstances, and that if type had anything to do with the expression of these behavior traits, it influenced the motives behind the expression of them, not the behavior itself. Yes, I believe there are observable patterns of behavior and that this is to some degree related to type (as Keirsey would say), but patterns that relate to temperament are not the same thing as patterns of contextual behavior. It seems to me that the more you actually learn and understand about type, the less you see it as being about labeling contextual behavior, and the more you begin to understand what's meant by the core needs and values that drive people, and the better you can understand that each set of needs and values are valuable, good, and worth including people of each type in your life as much as possible, because diversity is good.

    I'm done reading forum posts for the reasons I mentioned, but I wanted to say I've really enjoyed some of the conversations I've had here, and that I really would rather just privately use type in a way that I feel is positive rather than log in every day to see the same old gripes related to contextual behavior being linked to type codes. Anyone who feels like talking with me about type is welcome to send me a PM (I'll get email notification of it) and I will gladly respond, as I've enjoyed meeting a number of people here.

    (I will not, however, be responding to anyone who just wants to start a fight or diss me for being politically correct.)

  2. #2
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarah View Post
    I believe it's true that you catch more flies with honey, and maybe I haven't been diplomatic enough in this forum. I admit I do have a quick temper, (although it dissipates pretty fast) and I also admit that I have a hard time suffering fools gladly. I think in this instance, the people I don't care to have anything more to do with are those who have chosen to use pscyhological type as a weapon to bash "types" of people who have hurt them in the past (and they're quick to label whole types as being a problem, never just individuals), or people who would rather complain about their relationships or communication problems than actually take steps to make things better.

    I passionately believe that the only positive way of using type is to see it as a tool that informs you as to the best way to ask the right kinds of questions, and also frame people's responses in a positive way. It also seems obvious that most of what's labeled as type-related really isn't. Your ex-boyfriends' messy habits, your bosses lack of thoughtfulness, your best friends' flightiness, your mother's bossiness, etc., is probably related more to what they grew up with and what's going on in their individual lives, not their "type code". I suspect most of what people like to believe is type-related is actually just the result of individuals we know having lived at a certain time, in a certain place, under certain circumstances, and that if type had anything to do with the expression of these behavior traits, it influenced the motives behind the expression of them, not the behavior itself. Yes, I believe there are observable patterns of behavior and that this is to some degree related to type (as Keirsey would say), but patterns that relate to temperament are not the same thing as patterns of contextual behavior. It seems to me that the more you actually learn and understand about type, the less you see it as being about labeling contextual behavior, and the more you begin to understand what's meant by the core needs and values that drive people, and the better you can understand that each set of needs and values are valuable, good, and worth including people of each type in your life as much as possible, because diversity is good.
    I totally agree with everything I bolded. I feel exactly the same way. I've had so many people confuse, annoy, and frustrate me with that kind of behavior, even ones I've thought of as friends previously for other reasons. I've wanted to leave before, too (and for the same reasons), but I never had the willpower to stick to that resolution. Something always pulled me back. Maybe you'll be pulled back, too, eventually... or maybe your will is stronger than mine. We'll see, won't we?

  3. #3
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    Oh man.... sarahs posts were like some of the few I actually enjoyed, now I feel like leaving :[

  4. #4
    Member anainani's Avatar
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    yea, I feel like leaving too now

  5. #5
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukepd View Post
    Oh man.... sarahs posts were like some of the few I actually enjoyed, now I feel like leaving :[
    Quote Originally Posted by anainani View Post
    yea, I feel like leaving too now
    No, no, please don't. We can't afford to lose any more SP members!

    If you go, people will just keep believing the stereotypes unhindered. If they see how you actually are by your presence on the forum, that alone will make them question the stereotypes. Without actual SPs, people will be totally free to wallow in their distorted perceptions unchecked. Surely that isn't what you want to happen?

  6. #6
    WTF is this dude saying? A Schnitzel's Avatar
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    Don't use the forum as a personal crusade. That will only wear you down and will give you nothing in return.

    I use it to socialize and joke around. It's a good place to use humour that is natural to you without societal constraints, socialize, share and look at art, but I'm always going to avoid in engaging in Typology discussions openly. If you already have the theory you're interested in ironed out in your head what's the point in engaging in the discussion directly related to Typology?

  7. #7
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    No, no, please don't. We can't afford to lose any more SP members!

    If you go, people will just keep believing the stereotypes unhindered. If they see how you actually are by your presence on the forum, that alone will make them question the stereotypes. Without actual SPs, people will be totally free to wallow in their distorted perceptions unchecked. Surely that isn't what you want to happen?
    Yeah, that's what I feel too. I think we need to stick around and keep speaking up where we can, try to at least make a little difference maybe. I never called Sarah "oversensitive" but I did say I think she was reading sinister agendas into things that weren't necessarily there. But anyway, by the nature of SPs, not many of us usually want to spend a lot of time talking about theoretical stuff, so any input we can offer seems like it would have some value. I'm surprised that I'm even still posting here, but what keeps happening is every time I think I'm sick of it, something pulls me back in.

    So, anyway, I will miss Sarah's input but I hope she will chime in from time to time. She's already graciously agreed to help me with my Artisan Temperament thread, so hopefully we can do some more edu-macating soon. Meantime, I wish Sarah all the best and thank her for her contributions here, and even for her scolding me in private, because sometimes I need that.
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

    "I like the sigs with quotes in them from other forum members." -- Oberon

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  8. #8
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Fare well, Sarah.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  9. #9
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Allow me, if you will, to share a bit of a personal anecdote.

    When I first arrived on this board, I was treated like Satan. Apparently, ENFJs are hideous, awful, back-stabbing, psyche-twisting, baby-eating freak shows that LIVE to devour human beings by the carload. I had no idea this was the general perception, and I took a great deal of flak. I rode it out and realized that two things were occurring:

    1. I was up against petty random bitter jerks.

    2. I was up against good people who'd had bad experiences and needed some positive contact. I gained a lot of friends that were initially at odds with me, people that I find truly fascinating, smart and fun to be around. My board buddy, for example - "Whatever". She'd had a horrendous experience with a nasty piece of work that left her VERY gunshy of ENFJs. I took it upon myself to befriend her because I liked her, she was funny, and I thought we would make great friends. All of the above is true.

    As to the Group 1 people, how did I overcome them? Obviously, I sent them to Hell. Where else does a devil like me send clownshoes like that?? No need to leave!
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  10. #10
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Yeah, what Pink said. She's better than me at the saying stuff. Fluh.
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

    "I like the sigs with quotes in them from other forum members." -- Oberon

    The SP Spazz Youtube Channel

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