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  1. #1
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    Default ESTP Intimidation

    Bugger the xNTJ's - they're big pussy-cats and we all know it.

    No, what scares me is going to get my car fixed.

    I'm certainly no sissy myself, but when I go into the garage and find myself confronted with all these ESTP's covered in grease and smelling and looking terribly manly, and I stand there waiting for someone to notice I'm there and they just carry on with their "throwing coins at each other across the reception room with no apparent regard for the customers standing between us" game, so that I'm forced to wait around awkwardly or try to catch someone's attention, and the guy asks me loads of questions involving arcane practical, mechanical, manly knowledge, rolling his eyes at my ignorance, while his workmate DELIBERATELY (I swear!) times his use of a noisy tool with my turns to speak - and he says "okay come back and get it tomorrow morning" with a friendly thump on my shoulder that almost has me knocked onto the floor... well. It's enough to make me feel positively metrosexual - or at least, hideously inadequate.

    See, all the "me" that would usually be full of counter-bluster and witty replies seems to crumble and disappear under the frank and vaguely pitying gaze (how can you not know what a calliper is? are you some kind of retard? oh, you poor intellectual fool, you never learned the important facts of life did you?, he seems to say) of the benevolent yet awesome-in-a-scary-way ESTP and I find myself babbling or just remaining silent!

    Do any of you realize how scary you can be??
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  2. #2
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    I think you're just intimidated by the fact that they know more than you do about cars, not the fact that they're ESTPs.



  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    I think you're just intimidated by the fact that they know more than you do about cars, not the fact that they're ESTPs.
    No no no no, I'm never usually intimidated by people knowing more than me about something. It's not that. I mean ha, most people know more than me about something, but by the same token few people know more than me about my specialist subjects, so it all balances out. It's not that, it's just the sheer... ESTP-ness of it all. They don't make me feel inadequate on the grounds of not knowing about cars, it's more on a level of personal inadequacy... that air about them... hard to explain, I was hoping someone who related might find a way to explain it better than me lol

    It's not just at the garage either, anywhere where there's a majority ESTP vibe, I find it very difficult to know where to place myself and I do feel very inadequate as a male despite all I know and believe about the traditional expectations of masculinity being a pile of horse shit. Somehow, when I'm presented with people for whom those expectations seem to be effortlessly achieved, all of a sudden I want to achieve them and feel like I'm nothing because I can't!!
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  4. #4
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    Just talking about it with my INTJ who is currently present, we're throwing around the idea at the moment here that being in the ESTP environment sometimes triggers the "I want to be a cowboy/soldier/other macho stereotype" chip that's latent in most guys from when they were kids, and somehow that's at the root of the feelings of intimidation - because it's obvious that whilst he and I couldn't be soldiers, these guys could. Just an idea, as I say.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  5. #5
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    Your masculinity is under threat, eh? Just run your mouth, and blabber about car stuff. Check from a book before if you don't know. Throw in something about hydrogen using cars possibly in the future (they'll probably take it as a joke, a car needs some muscle). You're masculine enough sweetie.

    Disclaimer: just messing with you.
    I don't find the ESTP scary..

    Unspoken social standards in the space, that you sensed and responded to. Your's wasn't possibly the 'norm' behavior they'd respond to/ were used to, thus making you wait.. or they just weren't feeling like ending their game just yet. Customers stroll in all the time.

    There's that certain air of masculinity, and.. something around them. Don't mind them.

    Maybe I could relate on the level that there've places where I've felt really masculine, since I didn't really reach the standard in the place. Like the time surrounded by ESxJ girls chatting away about make up, hair, and so on with great passion. And The Housewife's. God help me.

  6. #6
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    Just an idea, as I say.
    I have to ask if you felt like you were walking into a 'den' of some animal. I find that there is a sort of familiarity that causes built in social standards, and when an interloper comes in, they feel totally out of place because... they don't know them. They can sense them, but they can't behave in that way.

    My guess, anyway.

    edit: I meant among ESTP dens, but it happens with other types. Just somewhat differently.

  7. #7
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I have to ask if you felt like you were walking into a 'den' of some animal. I find that there is a sort of familiarity that causes built in social standards, and when an interloper comes in, they feel totally out of place because... they don't know them. They can sense them, but they can't behave in that way.

    My guess, anyway.

    edit: I meant among ESTP dens, but it happens with other types. Just somewhat differently.
    Interesting concept, because although I know little about cars personally, I never feel intimidated by mechanics or going into Home Depot or anything similar. In fact I sense a thrill of possibly learning something new, enjoy the comraderie of being around simple common folks and being taught secrets from their infinite knowledge.

  8. #8
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    Nah PT I think with me it lies nearer the centre where I actually sorta wanna be like them, and being presented with their environment sorta makes me wonder if all the things I've told myself about how I don't care to be like that haven't just been props to defend against or paper over a secret desire to be a soldier, as it were, like any little boy... I guess most other environments I go into, with most other types, I figure I can easily chameleon into it and fit in right from the word go, but not with these guys, I just don't have it in me. And I guess the sheer rarity of that alone maybe makes me want it.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  9. #9
    soft and silky sarah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    Bugger the xNTJ's - they're big pussy-cats and we all know it.

    No, what scares me is going to get my car fixed.

    I'm certainly no sissy myself, but when I go into the garage and find myself confronted with all these ESTP's covered in grease and smelling and looking terribly manly, and I stand there waiting for someone to notice I'm there and they just carry on with their "throwing coins at each other across the reception room with no apparent regard for the customers standing between us" game, so that I'm forced to wait around awkwardly or try to catch someone's attention...

    Oh, so customer service means squat to these businessmen (which is what they are underneath the grease and manly exterior)? Maybe you could look into getting a new mechanic, then. There are guys out there who know how to fix cars AND treat their customers politely. It takes a while to find one, but it's totally worth the effort.

    When you do finally find a mechanic who doesn't ignore you and/or drown out your questions with his power tools, you can always send a letter to your former mechanic telling him in plain language why you're not frequenting his business and why you're also going to spend the rest of your life recommending others not take their cars to his business for repairs either.

    Sarah

  10. #10
    soft and silky sarah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I have to ask if you felt like you were walking into a 'den' of some animal. I find that there is a sort of familiarity that causes built in social standards, and when an interloper comes in, they feel totally out of place because... they don't know them. They can sense them, but they can't behave in that way.

    My guess, anyway.

    edit: I meant among ESTP dens, but it happens with other types. Just somewhat differently.

    Good point --- any time you walk into a room of like-minded people who are all more knowledgeable than you are about a subject you need to know at least something about, you're likely going to feel a bit intimidated, even if they're trying to be nice and helpful.

    Sarah

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