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  1. #81
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Oh by the way, the garage situation was in fact entirely fictional, just a story to illustrate a point, an amalgamation of my experiences with ESTP's in RL channelled into a single fictional situation. And yes, three of the ESTP's I was thinking of in writing that example have indeed been tested and have self-confirmed their types. As it happens, when I became confused about why I was being so misunderstood here, I asked one of them who happened to be handy what he made of it. He does have the advantage of knowing me well enough to know that I wasn't going to be simply whipping up type hate, but all the same, he did say that he could see what I mean and, a mechanic himself, agreed that the example was quite typical... he also agreed with the idea of ESTP being more the type to engage with the customer, IF he had a strong J boss on his back and a commission-based salary to think of, but he said that if there were a bunch of guys like him in a place where pay didn't depend on number of jobs done or customer feedback (as it generally doesn't here), that's pretty much what it'd be like.

    And thanks PT for talking sense as always (and you were spot on about why I wasn't here, all except you didn't account for the busy life of the ENTP ), and Anja, for the votes of confidence
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

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  2. #82
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    I'm glad you returned sub.

    I had some thoughts on it all, having at least a passing acquaintance with your background. And I hesitated to say more considering that I didn't care to make assumptions.

    In the future it would be a safe thing to mention that you are giving a hypothetical example. Yeah!
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  3. #83
    Senior Member Gabe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    Couldn't an ultimate realist easily become kind of nihilistic and hedonistic? I don't see why the two are mutually exclusive. I enjoy MBTI, etc, but I don't take it super seriously, I guess. Any time you divide people into groups based on similarities you're going to get some inaccurate stereotyping and even if a stereotype is generally true, it certainly isn't going to be true of everyone in the group. I don't see it as being terribly harmful unless you use it as a rigid guideline or something.
    (what's the nihilist/hedonist stuff about?)

    Superficial typologies: Remember high school? Nerds, goths, Jocks, or whatever bullcrap steoreotypes they had at your place (unless you were reallllly lucky).
    Well, there's no 'jock brain' or 'nerd brain' in reality, just like there's no 'female brain' or 'male brain' in reality (ok, I had to add that one in there). In other words, those typologies are not based on any actual innate charictaristic, so they're true, and then when the effect that made them appear true for a while (high school, culture) dissapears, POOF, they suddenly all become untrue, just like so many discredited economic ideas and supposedly proven social scientific hypotheses.
    The way I see type theories is that there's a multitude (near infinite) amount of behavioral outcomes that can stem from the preferences for how you tend to think, tend to interact with people, and your core psychological needs.

    So saying that stereotyping is inevitable is a cop-out. Just saying "ESTPs are imtimidating" is implying a causality that probably isn't there. You could say "ESTPs attempt to intimidate people in such situations....., or ESTPs seem intimidating if/when/...." I wouldn't know if those things are true or not.

    Not trying to use type theory to actually explain something about something defeats it's purpose. You might as well revert to the old "Well, He's just being a guy" form of cop-out.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukepd View Post
    You have nothing but your opinion. Would you like some respectable website references?
    There wasn't that much highly scientific about the first post and I just told you about my own observations seem similar to his. I don't respect website references to be more true then my own opinions, which is derived from reading on internet and observing reality + reflecting (thinking if it makes sense and trying to see patterns).

    Just going on facts on internet (wich is written by a human being and can have faults) without any reflecting just leaves me indifferent. I don't want to be a follower unless there's some wisdom in the author.

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