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  1. #91
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Actually, someone I know might be an unhealthy ISFJ - take a look at this...

    Negative points:
    - Holds grudges
    - Can be moody
    - Once said she hates people
    - Not empathetic
    - Can be sensitive
    - Pretty stingy with money

    Positive points:
    - Loves to plan get-togethers with people she knows well
    - Polite, shy
    - There are others (good and bad points), but I don't feel like going through all of them.

    I've got the I, S, and J down. But I don't know if she's a T or F. Does this sound like an unhealthy ISFJ?

  2. #92

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    ISFJ's are not usually stingy with money though.

  3. #93
    Perfect Gentleman! =D d@v3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning_Rider View Post
    ISFJ's are not usually stingy with money though.
    Well... you can't be stingy in any way and actually be a "happy" person. On the other hand, you can't just go out and spend money like you own a mint press or a printery. :rolli:
    Freedom Isn't Free. [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  4. #94
    Senior Member Hinastarr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    • Subtle guilt trips through self-victimization
    • Actively being a paragon of virtue, to use as leverage later ("If I'm perfect, then you have no excuse to be upset with me.")
    • Generally passive-aggressive (occasionally downright aggressive if they feel justified or people they love are threatened)
    • Self-pity/withdrawal/self-castigation
    • Mentally able to block out things they don't want to address (denial and repression)
    • Can keep a record of wrongs easily
    • Prone to wild speculation when things are forced outside the box (i.e., weak N abilities)


    Those are the things I generally have experienced.
    This list sounds eerily like my mother, particularly what's been bolded.

    My mother has been codependent of a man in an emotionally abusive relationship for some 18 years, and tends to spiral between one moment (literally) classifying him as the living incarnation of the devil and the next, this almighty, almost worshipable figure. It's very perplexing, really.

    She has succesfully mastered the tactic of self-victimization and never yields from stressing her virtues and gooddoings. She claims constantly to have a stored "personal Pandora's box" in her heart filled with ill-will and harsh memories she threatens people with unveiling, and will become offended even with tap of a finger.

    Despite clearly seeking my advice and wanting a person to vent to (she stresses this enough verbally), she quickly resorts to regression and denial, instead placing the blame on the 'terrible, unappreciative" people surrounding her.

    I've tried continuously to tell her to fend for herself and stop tolerating the antics of my father (from whom she, ironically, expects romantic and touchy-feely gestures and affection), only to then here her deny having any issues in her marriage and hear her describe her husband as the kindest, most helpful man you could acquaint with.

    Her passive-agression has lately reached a new extreme, particularly after my father's last visit which, apparently, "broke her heart", as she now speaks constantly of getting "revenge and letting the world know who she is." I've what sense there is in seeking vengeance and burdening herself so much with hatred and despair, which only sets her off into a greater, and very long-lasting, rampage.

    I truly don't know what to do for her anymore. I've tried to assist and counsel my mother to the best of my abilities, but nothing seems to assauge her.

  5. #95
    Member Space Socks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hinastarr View Post
    This list sounds eerily like my mother, particularly what's been bolded.

    My mother has been codependent of a man in an emotionally abusive relationship for some 18 years, and tends to spiral between one moment (literally) classifying him as the living incarnation of the devil and the next, this almighty, almost worshipable figure. It's very perplexing, really.

    She has succesfully mastered the tactic of self-victimization and never yields from stressing her virtues and gooddoings. She claims constantly to have a stored "personal Pandora's box" in her heart filled with ill-will and harsh memories she threatens people with unveiling, and will become offended even with tap of a finger.

    Despite clearly seeking my advice and wanting a person to vent to (she stresses this enough verbally), she quickly resorts to regression and denial, instead placing the blame on the 'terrible, unappreciative" people surrounding her.

    I've tried continuously to tell her to fend for herself and stop tolerating the antics of my father (from whom she, ironically, expects romantic and touchy-feely gestures and affection), only to then here her deny having any issues in her marriage and hear her describe her husband as the kindest, most helpful man you could acquaint with.

    Her passive-agression has lately reached a new extreme, particularly after my father's last visit which, apparently, "broke her heart", as she now speaks constantly of getting "revenge and letting the world know who she is." I've what sense there is in seeking vengeance and burdening herself so much with hatred and despair, which only sets her off into a greater, and very long-lasting, rampage.

    I truly don't know what to do for her anymore. I've tried to assist and counsel my mother to the best of my abilities, but nothing seems to assauge her.
    Sounds like an isfj with a bit of BPD. The extremes (in my opinion) of her behavior are rather unnerving. She claims to have a black-mail list of evidence, and this I think is what keeps an isfj (of this degree) from releasing herself from the issues. You have to disarm her by getting her to examine her grudges and to see the effects they'll take in the long run. Sounds like she is rather short sighted because her expectations are immediate and relational to what she believes she has done for others.

    Us ISFJs have a difficult time forgiving ourselves and we need reminders so that they eventually stick with us.

    In my case, it has been most helpful and eye opening when the person I care about the most tells me I am wrong. She already looks to you for some comfort, but she has to know that her behavior is taking a toll on you. I don't know if its harsh, honest criticism that she needs, but it has certainly helped me and a few other ISFJs I know.

    Of course, there are more factors I'm sure, and I don't want to continue assuming.
    What is your relationship like with her, and any others aside from your father?

  6. #96
    Senior Member Porcelain Hearts's Avatar
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    The consequences of the passive aggressiveness is severely taxing in my parents' case. My mother and father have been divorced for almost 15 years, but still live together to keep the family. They've both been seeing other people. However my mom just recently revealed that she still harbours feelings for my dad after finding out he's been seeing someone. It was 15 years of distraction/resentment/suppressed emotions. Where did this come from? It came to a surprise for my father as it has to myself and my brothers. My dad is now faced with a dramatic decision to choose between my mother and the woman he's been seeing for six years. My mom has held a grudge for this long, it's almost scary to think it won't happen again. She always hoped my father could make up for his wrongdoings or provide in the way she expects him to without asking. She's remembered every single wrong my father has committed since marriage as her own justification for him to make amends. It's like she can't live in the future. She's too guarded (especially because of her strict upbringing) to trust anyone else, especially for dating.

    My dad... I've asked who he has more feelings for, but he's a rationalist. He doesn't choose with feelings. He chooses with responsibility and is willing to start a relationship again. My mom can't support herself; it's weird, she's a hard-worker, but her careers never took off. What he is scared about is her unconscious ability to exaggerate or lie to get information that she's seeking or to protect someone from getting hurt. She never means any harm by doing so, but I don't know how being passive aggressive has ever worked for her and in all honesty, I can't even trust her myself.

  7. #97
    Member Space Socks's Avatar
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    Too be honest, for ISFJs, PA has always been our default defense. It is a poison we both take and give, and unfortunately abuse. I myself am learning to confront all my problems rationally and feel I've matured quite a bit from that PA stage. The only times I see myself returning to this mode is when I'm forced to be around someone who I simply cannot confront without setting an even worse environment for myself. I'm currently in a situation where I cannot escape this notion, and so I am grateful for being instilled with the skills to block out the presence of negativity that I associate with said person. In my mind, I've forgiven myself and the other(full confrontation and forgiveness) for the issues between us and so I remain neutral for now. By neutral, I mean being respectful towards their presence because they are still human, just one who has done me wrong.

  8. #98
    Senior Member Porcelain Hearts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Space Socks View Post
    Too be honest, for ISFJs, PA has always been our default defense. It is a poison we both take and give, and unfortunately abuse. I myself am learning to confront all my problems rationally and feel I've matured quite a bit from that PA stage. The only times I see myself returning to this mode is when I'm forced to be around someone who I simply cannot confront without setting an even worse environment for myself. I'm currently in a situation where I cannot escape this notion, and so I am grateful for being instilled with the skills to block out the presence of negativity that I associate with said person. In my mind, I've forgiven myself and the other(full confrontation and forgiveness) for the issues between us and so I remain neutral for now. By neutral, I mean being respectful towards their presence because they are still human, just one who has done me wrong.
    Letting go can be hard, but I believe you when you claim you release these tensions with the right reasoning. You're probably responsible by nature and unfortunately, many people aren't. Different people offer different things, and it puts trust into different outcomes.

  9. #99
    Junior Member Fire's Avatar
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    • Martyrdom
    • Nagging and criticism
    • Perfectionism/Never happy
    • Prolonged instability leads to inertia
    • Expect the worst
    • Gossips
    • Lets self go/Laziness

  10. #100
    Senior Member Mitsuko Souma's Avatar
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    I think a good fictional example would be Bellatrix Lestrange from the Harry Potter series. She seems to be an ISFJ and is extremely "unhealthy."

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