[MBTI General] NT's and SJ's working together

[Giggly]

I have a new colleague that I've been working with for the past month who I believe is an NT. I'm still not sure if he's NTJ or NTP but he's definitely full of ideas.

The thing is, we HAVE to work together on a project with a deadline and it's just the two of us doing this. Here is where the problems come in....

I love his ideas (it's one of the things that excited me about working with him) but we have work to get done and he keeps coming up with new ideas every week on how to get the project done rather than just doing it the tried and true way that has been done in the past - which, at this point, since we've wasted so much time talking about his ideas, is what I want to do now.

I know this sounds so stereotypically NT vs SJ but I don't know what to do now. How do I get him to produce the results by the deadline yet let him crank out his new ideas?

I have more on the line than him if this doesn't get done because he can more easily find a new job due to his credentials and experience (which I don't have).

And before anyone says.... I have already explained this to him a few times, to which he replies that he understands and for me not to worry, that he will get it done the old way, but then 2 days later he's back to focusing on a new idea and hasn't done any work.

Please help an SJ work well with an NT.

 

[EJCC]

What I tend to do in those situations is emphasize to the NT, throughout the entire brainstorming process, that we need to focus on what's doable, with the resources we have, and with the time allotted. Being logical people -- if not always practical -- they can't really argue with the necessity of that point, so it gives our brainstorming a framework and limits the NT's wealth of ideas to a much shorter list.

Edit: Of course, it sounds like you have a very limited amount of time left. You'll probably have to really put your foot down. Easier for a Te-dom like me, probably, than for you. But unless you're extremely clear, I don't know if he'll get the message. He needs to know that it's in his interest to keep his eyes on the prize and get it done quickly, I think. Hence the "doable... with the time allotted", in the previous paragraph.

 

[Pseudo]

I think you should play it like you'd love to continue with the new ideas but the higher ups just want it to get done. I know I also respond to things having to get done. don't be afraid to say "look these ideas are good but we need to make a plan and get it done". Also long as it seems more of a team thing than a bossy thing I think the NT would respond well.


For me personally I respond best when people make me feel like a valuable team member by outlining what it is that needs to be done rather than trying to manipulate or boss me into doing things. If I like/respect people, I'll get things done for them. If I don't have a clear picture of "why" things need to happen I just push against that. I think I actually appreciate being reigned in but I need concrete reasons why or it just won't seem real to me. Also, I don't know if this is all NTs but I tend to procrastinate and then hammer out a project at the end. Free running ideas for 80% of the project and then one or two sessions of non-stop, focused execution. It's easier for me to stay up for two days than to work in small increments. My SJ friend prefers to plan everything because she know she can't put aside things like eating or sleeping or her numerous other schedule activities. Where I see 72 hours of time left, she sees 24 hours of available work time. So maybe your partner doesn't feel the same time crunch as you yet

 

[FDG]

Probably needs to be reprimanded by upper management...if you've already told him that everything needs to be done quickly, there doesn't seem much you can do.

Edit: an organizatiorial possibility could be the following: there is an allotted amount of time per day (say, 1.5-2 hours) in which he can/will work on his ideas. For the rest of the time, he has to execute "normal" work. This setup would have the added benefit that he would be forced to work more intensively during those 2 hours, and maybe bring one idea to fruition.

 

[Coriolis]

And before anyone says.... I have already explained this to him a few times, to which he replies that he understands and for me not to worry, that he will get it done the old way, but then 2 days later he's back to focusing on a new idea and hasn't done any work.

Please help an SJ work well with an NT.

Sounds more like INTP than INTJ to me. INTJ is usually quite willing and able to work to a deadline, and might be driving YOU to stay on track. Have you tried sitting down with him and together planning out how you will get the project done in the allotted time? This plan can include some of his new ideas, as well as established ones that would be useful. This would also show if his idea of available time remaining coincides with yours.

 

[INA]

I have a new colleague that I've been working with for the past month who I believe is an NT. I'm still not sure if he's NTJ or NTP but he's definitely full of ideas.
The thing is, we HAVE to work together on a project with a deadline and it's just the two of us doing this. Here is where the problems come in....

And before anyone says.... I have already explained this to him a few times, to which he replies that he understands and for me not to worry, that he will get it done the old way, but then 2 days later he's back to focusing on a new idea and hasn't done any work.

Please help an SJ work well with an NT.

can't say this guy is NT just because he comes up with ideas. He evidently has no idea how to do the work required. What he is is a flake. I don't subscribe to the half-baked idea that flake = INTP. I for one would brook none of this flaky nonsense, so I'd be de-partnered from this jerk in a minute.

Whenever he claims you shouldn't worry and that he'll do it the old way, do you point out that he's said that before and you're nowhere closer to the goal? Maybe he's not doing the work the old way because he doesn't know how, and he's hoping/expecting that you'll do the work for both.

Suggest that you absolutely need to move ahead, and his strategy is not working for you, so if he's unable to do what's required then you two will have to speak with your supervisor to help him find his way or go your separate ways on this project. It's nice to not want to rat him out to superiors, but in no circumstance should you jeopardize your own position.

 

[Winds of Thor]

Maybe since NTs think of time as segmented blocks of time instead of your usual continuum of time, he may be envisioning doing his work at the last minute, or..block of time as he sees it.

One idea might be to go-ahead and make a project schedule and delegate inch-stones for each team member to track progress of project stages complete, although some NTs wouldn't like this approach. Teammate accomplishments could be tracked say, in one column yours, checkmarking, and in another column, his. Then keep your management updated once a week or every two days. That way management sees who's responsible for what.

If anything else, management should know Your responsibilities, progress and efforts. If it's the team that you're responsible for, which it kinda sounds like the project may have been given to you that way, that sucks due to the circumstances. (I don't know how big your company is) but on the bright side, it's always acceptable to ask management for additional help/people to get a project done. That way you avoid criticizing another's work. That's what I would do.

 

[Pseudo]

Probably needs to be reprimanded by upper management...if you've already told him that everything needs to be done quickly, there doesn't seem much you can do.

Edit: an organizatiorial possibility could be the following: there is an allotted amount of time per day (say, 1.5-2 hours) in which he can/will work on his ideas. For the rest of the time, he has to execute "normal" work. This setup would have the added benefit that he would be forced to work more intensively during those 2 hours, and maybe bring one idea to fruition.

I think the NTJ vs NTP really matters. I know this would not work for me^.

 

[FDG]

I think the NTJ vs NTP really matters. I know this would not work for me^.

Would not work for me either, to be completel honest, lol.

But letting everything pile up until the deadline is near does not seem to be compatible with Giggly's goals.

 

[RaptorWizard]

In my opinion, your work buddy sounds like he is probably an INTJ.

Reason - the focus on advancing new ideas into a plan of action in accordance with his own vision, which is very much like what Dario Nardi describes as the Process Manager and Purposeful Futurist brain functions, the former dealing with brainstorming for progress on projects, and the latter dealing with forseeing potential developments for change.

Based on my studies of personality psychology, though all NTs could potentially possess these traits, an INTJ in the mix is most likely the best expert at doing what I described above.

 

[Giggly]

Thank you everyone for your advice and comments.

This is a new working relationship and I think I'm just going to be confused and biting my nails until the deadline comes.

*sigh*

 

[Honor]

I have a new colleague that I've been working with for the past month who I believe is an NT. I'm still not sure if he's NTJ or NTP but he's definitely full of ideas.

The thing is, we HAVE to work together on a project with a deadline and it's just the two of us doing this. Here is where the problems come in....

I love his ideas (it's one of the things that excited me about working with him) but we have work to get done and he keeps coming up with new ideas every week on how to get the project done rather than just doing it the tried and true way that has been done in the past - which, at this point, since we've wasted so much time talking about his ideas, is what I want to do now.

I know this sounds so stereotypically NT vs SJ but I don't know what to do now. How do I get him to produce the results by the deadline yet let him crank out his new ideas?

I have more on the line than him if this doesn't get done because he can more easily find a new job due to his credentials and experience (which I don't have).

And before anyone says.... I have already explained this to him a few times, to which he replies that he understands and for me not to worry, that he will get it done the old way, but then 2 days later he's back to focusing on a new idea and hasn't done any work.

Please help an SJ work well with an NT.

Sorry to hear about this frustrating situation you're in, Giggly. I say smack him! No, just kidding. You should discuss this with him one more time including pointing out that you don't mean to re-hash an old issue but that you're concerned that he's not making any progress on the project, that he promises to go back to the "old way" but doesn't, which is putting you in a difficult situation as a colleague. Maybe he really will get all of the work at the last second done and just has a different style of working than you or maybe he really just doesn't have any focus and isn't being realistic about the deadline. If it gets close enough to the deadline that it's obvious he won't finish all of his work in time, then speak with your supervisor about this.

 

[Honor]

Thank you everyone for your advice and comments.

This is a new working relationship and I think I'm just going to be confused and biting my nails until the deadline comes.

*sigh*

Sorry, buddy.

 

[King sns]

Give him smaller deadlines- just explaining that you need to get stuff done may not work. Bring the bottom line to him. "This needs to be done at this time on this date" may work. It sounds like he's open and understanding but can't help straying from the goals. It's definitely a perceiver thing, sounds like Ne all the way. NTJ's would pick a good idea and stick with it and move a lot faster.

 

[Pseudo]

Would not work for me either, to be completel honest, lol.

But letting everything pile up until the deadline is near does not seem to be compatible with Giggly's goals.

Yeah but putting her NT on a leash is going to piss it off and probably stifle a lot of it's productivity.

I hate group projects. Usually I just take my peice and work alone.

I just thought, maybe if she made time part of the problem? NTs like a challenge and being able to solve problems. If she frames the job not just as doing x, but as doing x by y time she can get the NT "need to succeed" drive going.

 

[Giggly]

He promised me he'll get some work done today! *crosses fingers*

I love group work when we get things done. I don't like it when we don't.

 

[kelric]

What he is is a flake. I don't subscribe to the half-baked idea that flake = INTP. I for one would brook none of this flaky nonsense, so I'd be de-partnered from this jerk in a minute.

This. *Unless*... he can actually back his methods up with results. Does he have a history of getting things done? Or is he new at your company? Don't get me wrong - some NTP's really *are* flaky and will take advantage of more industrious co-workers, even dragging you down with them. But there are others whose methods may appear flaky to more organized folks, but who produce excellent results very efficiently -- when the time comes.

One idea might be to go-ahead and make a project schedule and delegate inch-stones for each team member to track progress of project stages complete, although some NTs wouldn't like this approach. Teammate accomplishments could be tracked say, in one column yours, checkmarking, and in another column, his. Then keep your management updated once a week or every two days. That way management sees who's responsible for what..

Instead of this, just shoot him. He'll thank you. This is *not* the way to get any NTP I've ever met (especially myself ) to even give you the time of day. Seriously... there is almost *nothing* you could do to me at work that would offend me more than this. Hiring your 16-year old brother to manage my 41-year old experienced self might be close. Maybe. Either would make me totally disengage from you, your intended result, and any sense of obligation to do anything but look for other employment. And yes, I am understating this. This may be a great solution with the way some people like to work, but based on your description of the guy above, I'd never even broach the topic. It won't work, and simply bringing up the idea will do more harm than good.

Yeah but putting her NT on a leash is going to piss it off and probably stifle a lot of it's productivity.

I hate group projects. Usually I just take my peice and work alone.

*crosses fingers*

Honestly, it sounds like the two of you simply aren't a good mix. Not that it's any of your fault, but what are the chances that you can get this assignment done and then work with someone else the next time around? Even if this guy turns out to be one of those "burn the midnight oil" deadline-achievers, and your project is well-received, he's going to burn you to a crisp doing it. There are lots of different ways to achieve a goal, but not all of them are inter-compatible in group scenarios... and the NP vs SJ viewpoints are particularly angst-anger-frustration-inducing.

 

[kelric]

One idea might be to go-ahead and make a project schedule and delegate inch-stones for each team member to track progress of project stages complete, although some NTs wouldn't like this approach. Teammate accomplishments could be tracked say, in one column yours, checkmarking, and in another column, his. Then keep your management updated once a week or every two days. That way management sees who's responsible for what.

I'm going to append a bit to my earlier post. Of course, Craic did say that this suggestion wouldn't go over well with some NT's (I did see this the first time, but simply didn't reference it directly - thought it was obvious). None of that was meant to be an indictment of you, Craic. Let's just say that I have a lot of *old* history with people using pretty much this exact tactic on me (despite the fact that calling me out on performance was unwarranted, even in their own words - and yet they continued to do this), and yes, it hits a sore spot.

Of course, the response you'll get to any sort of workplace suggestion will vary a lot depending on the nature of the request and the other person involved. My point was, if perhaps a bit excitedly made, simply that this particular suggestion is very likely to cause more trouble than it's worth with someone like Giggly describes. Some things really are difficult to overstate.

 

[Giggly]

Update:

At 3pm today, I checked in and he had not done any work. I was so discouraged and felt hopeless. I left him a text at that time asking him what happened and didn't hear from him for hours. I thought he bailed. He then texted me just a few minutes ago telling me that he finished 1/4 of the work he had to do (what he said he'd do for today) and I checked and it's been done. Phew, I feel a little better now. He says he'll do the rest by the end of next week. Next Friday is our deadline so I hope he comes through! He did great.

 

[Giggly]

Oh, and he didn't do it the "old" way. He did it the way he wanted (something new).

I don't care, though, as long as it looks good and works.