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  1. #41
    Blind Guardian Haven's Avatar
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    They don't bother me much most of the time, I just assume people will say as much as they care to. If the answer is important to me because I need it for some purpose then I get very impatient and irritated and I'll just find out some other way if I can.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Holy Necro Thread Batman!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    Oh god really?

    Can I answer here or this an sj forum?

    But they're not being evasive to be evasive if that makes sense. They likely just wanted to give a brief description. Some people don't like to bore others with the details.
    But...but...I'm an SJ....details are what I sprinkle all over my Cheerios every morning!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    Never mind. Should've read more first. Maybe sometimes evasive people are being evasive on purpose.
    The OP was actually my now ex-girlfriend and I'm inclined to think she was just very closed up. Objectively speaking this isn't a bad thing but it doesn't make it more difficult for me to connect with someone when I always feel like I'm not being given all the information I need...

    Quote Originally Posted by digesthisickness View Post
    My first reaction to a third-degree is to escape. A lot of ISFJs approach conversation in this way. Their version of chatting makes you feel like they're accusing you of something and they come off as controlling. If you know them well, but are tired of it and no longer give a crap if they leave, then it's really very clear that one of the best ways to piss them off and feel less controlled is to be evasive.
    BUT WE JUST WANT TO LOVE YOU!!! WHY WON'T YOU LET ME LOVE YOU?!?!?!?!

    /extends hands out longingly

    Ok, in all seriousness, I've been told I can come off as a little intense when I enter into a conversation that is important to me so I imagine some other people I've spoken too in the past might feel as you do.

    Which is a shame, because I don't want to scare people off

    Quote Originally Posted by nicolita View Post
    depends on the situation for sure.

    sometimes a person doesn't want to answer a question because it makes them uncomfortable or the time/place aren't right, and if that's the vibe i get then i try to leave it alone.
    99% of the time, I'm the same way.

    Sometimes though, I feel like something REALLY needs to be cleared up or discussed and I'll hound after them for an answer until we resolve it or they flip out on me.

    Quote Originally Posted by nicolita View Post
    if i think the question needs an answer and i feel the conditions aren't such that the person's at risk of like saying something in front of another person or whatever, then i can't stand them. basically if someone's avoiding something i need them to discuss in order to deal with something, and they won't give me a straight answer so we can work toward a resolution, i get frustrated.

    other than that, if it doesn't really matter or is maybe better left untouched at that time, then i'm cool with taking the signal and letting it lie.
    Likewise

    Quote Originally Posted by Misty View Post
    Relatable, but I think I should open up more in the future after reading the thread.
    Well, to be fair, I'm an Sx-dom and an Si-dom, so I imagine I can come on really strong when I'm hunting for an answer to question that I *REALLY* need answered.

    Quote Originally Posted by Misty View Post
    I disclose very little to others for no reason other than preference and didn't understand how that affected other types of people, especially on an everyday basis such as in the OP. It sounds like putting your own feelings about talking above the other person's. Reading about how this behavior can come off as devious or undermine relational trust, I do not think it's okay upon consideration to put someone in that position in situations where your reason is so much smaller, like just not feeling like talking at the moment, or not thinking what you have to say is interesting, or just not liking to talk about what you do. No one has to be an open book, but that's just flippant. I don't think being an open book is necessary, but don't want to be like this.
    I find this statement incredibly endearing and it makes me want to hug you

    I wouldn't fret about it, this could very well be a fault of mine. When I wish to connect with someone, evasive answers can actually cause me a small degree of stress. When a family member or S.O. is being evasive with me, this can cause me a lot of stress. This could very well be abnormal and/or strictly a problem or flaw that I need to deal with.

    Quote Originally Posted by superunknown View Post
    You would hate me. I can't give a straight answer to save my life.
    Nah, I just wouldn't trust you....or I'd expect you to do the opposite of whatever it is you say you were going to do :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Haven View Post
    They don't bother me much most of the time, I just assume people will say as much as they care to. If the answer is important to me because I need it for some purpose then I get very impatient and irritated and I'll just find out some other way if I can.
    Likewise.

    Must be an xSFJ thing
    "The man who is swimming against the stream knows the strength of it."
    ― Woodrow Wilson

  3. #43
    ✿ڿڰۣஇღ♥ wut ♥ღஇڿڰۣ✿ digesthisickness's Avatar
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    Okay, your response to me was adorable, true, but the responses you gave to everyone else pretty much backed up what I said.

    It can get to be a vicious circle because you can consciously know that the ISFJ has your best interests at heart, is just interested, etc., but it's that dogged-ness, that seeing one thing out of place in someone's home and asking about it, it's the silence followed by the out-of-nowhere comments like, "There's something I have to get off of my chest and you're not going to like it, but it's how I feel" and I don't know about you, but others I've known have not been able to handle truth well. They claim to treasure it when it's theirs and they must express it, then when it comes to the other person's, which they claim to want, they don't take it well and emotionally react suddenly. Which just teaches the other person to never tell them the truth.

    And, that destroys intimacy.
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  4. #44
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by digesthisickness View Post
    Okay, your response to me was adorable, true, but the responses you gave to everyone else pretty much backed up what I said.

    It can get to be a vicious circle because you can consciously know that the ISFJ has your best interests at heart, is just interested, etc., but it's that dogged-ness, that seeing one thing out of place in someone's home and asking about it, it's the silence followed by the out-of-nowhere comments like, "There's something I have to get off of my chest and you're not going to like it, but it's how I feel" and I don't know about you, but others I've known have not been able to handle truth well. They claim to treasure it when it's theirs and they must express it, then when it comes to the other person's, which they claim to want, they don't take it well and emotionally react suddenly. Which just teaches the other person to never tell them the truth.

    And, that destroys intimacy.
    The only time I've ever experienced what you're describing with my ex and it honestly smacks of a history of emotional abuse and fear of intimacy. My ex and I had a really bad relationship and were both very sensitive to the criticism of the other and as such very reluctant to express our needs for fear of offending. I agree that this sort of situation will destroy intimacy, not to mention it's very destructive and unhealthy to be in.

    However, I feel that honesty and disclosure are all crucial components of a healthy relationship and I've found that people who are very closed up I end up dramatically misunderstanding them due to their reluctance to open up. Basically, the more a person opens up to me, the easier it becomes for me to get to know and understand them so that when something is . When a person is very closed up, I have to constantly double back because their actions may not match their earlier words and because I don't know them as well as I might a person who is more open, I have to try and find an explanation (from them or on my own, depending on how much they're willing to communicate) and more they retreat from me...the more I have to chase them down.

    Now, keep in mind, the only time I really get "dogged" about this sort of stuff is with my immediate family and my SO, my SO most especially. She's my partner and I *need* her to be open with me. When my SO starts getting really evasive or closing up on me, the only thing that does is drive me away. Obviously the exception to this is if she's suffered a loss, dealing with some sort of medical or psychological issues (depression, etc) at which case I will gladly slide into the role of "supportive boyfriend" role....but otherwise, I really really REALLY need her to trust me and be open with me. This is a non-negotiable for me, I am *SO* over dating emotionally unavailable people and I will not apologize for this, sorry.
    "The man who is swimming against the stream knows the strength of it."
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  5. #45
    ✿ڿڰۣஇღ♥ wut ♥ღஇڿڰۣ✿ digesthisickness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinker683 View Post
    The only time I've ever experienced what you're describing with my ex and it honestly smacks of a history of emotional abuse and fear of intimacy. My ex and I had a really bad relationship and were both very sensitive to the criticism of the other and as such very reluctant to express our needs for fear of offending. I agree that this sort of situation will destroy intimacy, not to mention it's very destructive and unhealthy to be in.

    However, I feel that honesty and disclosure are all crucial components of a healthy relationship and I've found that people who are very closed up I end up dramatically misunderstanding them due to their reluctance to open up. Basically, the more a person opens up to me, the easier it becomes for me to get to know and understand them so that when something is . When a person is very closed up, I have to constantly double back because their actions may not match their earlier words and because I don't know them as well as I might a person who is more open, I have to try and find an explanation (from them or on my own, depending on how much they're willing to communicate) and more they retreat from me...the more I have to chase them down.

    Now, keep in mind, the only time I really get "dogged" about this sort of stuff is with my immediate family and my SO, my SO most especially. She's my partner and I *need* her to be open with me. When my SO starts getting really evasive or closing up on me, the only thing that does is drive me away. Obviously the exception to this is if she's suffered a loss, dealing with some sort of medical or psychological issues (depression, etc) at which case I will gladly slide into the role of "supportive boyfriend" role....but otherwise, I really really REALLY need her to trust me and be open with me. This is a non-negotiable for me, I am *SO* over dating emotionally unavailable people and I will not apologize for this, sorry.
    I wouldn't want you to apologize. For what, being yourself? Ha! Nah, I was just trying to show how it can get to be a chicken and egg situation after a while. How people can start to be evasive accidentally then later on purpose and why it may happen. No, ISFJs can be that way, sure, but that way works for some people.

    But, it's annoyance at evasive answering that started this thread, so I was simply trying to explain why it may happen. Not because anyone is bad or wrong or anything, but just how they naturally approach and how some people naturally hate that approach.
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  6. #46
    Insert Snarky Quip Here Stigmata's Avatar
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    You probably wouldn't like me then, as I'm the master of the evasive answer. I'd like to think it makes me seem more mysterious, but in reality it just makes me seem like a reclusive asshole.

  7. #47
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by digesthisickness View Post
    I wouldn't want you to apologize. For what, being yourself? Ha! Nah, I was just trying to show how it can get to be a chicken and egg situation after a while. How people can start to be evasive accidentally then later on purpose and why it may happen. No, ISFJs can be that way, sure, but that way works for some people.

    But, it's annoyance at evasive answering that started this thread, so I was simply trying to explain why it may happen. Not because anyone is bad or wrong or anything, but just how they naturally approach and how some people naturally hate that approach.

    I understand. I appreciate your feedback
    "The man who is swimming against the stream knows the strength of it."
    ― Woodrow Wilson

  8. #48
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    yes I hate evasive answers. It usually means they are hiding something from me, which i hate, or they are leading me on in some way.

  9. #49
    Temporal Mechanic. Lexicon's Avatar
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    Evasive answers can be bothersome when trying to communicate, but I try to be patient. I'm not always the most direct in my own responses, due to a variety of factors, so I try to extend that understanding to others before getting frustrated. Sometimes people don't completely realize they're being evasive- just as some people may not realize they've stumbled upon what's considered emotionally guarded ground- they could be perceived as invasive, regardless of intent. Emotional reactions cloud language, at times, I guess.

    It's not my style to question people directly most of the time on matters that may be potentially uncomfortable, but sometimes, it's necessary. Usually when someone's being evasive, I attempt to be as open with them as possible- why I'm asking what I'm asking, what sparked the query, how that input would be useful or relevant. If it's due to a problem someone has specifically come to me to help them with- & I still can't get anywhere after explaining, I'll eventually say, "look, I'm only trying to understand your pov here, not out to judge. Information is useful, even if it's not pleasant. You explicitly asked me to help you resolve something, and I'm happy to help if I can. However, I'm not a dental surgeon, so I'm not gonna sit here pulling teeth."

    In the end, if it's distressing the person, then I divert from being direct with that topic when viable, & try to find different ways of bringing that information out of them more comfortably.


    *EDIT* Dammit, I already posted in this thread a year ago.. I knew it seemed familiar.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexicon View Post
    I think some people can be highly sensitive to direct question-after-question exchanges, especially if it's something they don't commonly see in your general behavior. I've been on both ends of this sort of interaction. Neutral questioning/curiosity - leading to defensiveness &/or inaccurate conclusion-jumping on the part of the recipient.. or being questioned by someone repeatedly about something very ho-hum, wondering what the big deal is. The former I attribute to general Ti- just knowing for the sake of knowing/data collecting, I guess. The latter I attribute to intuition & feeling, perhaps. Deviation from a given pattern, trying to pick up on any emotional undertones. Ofc there can be many other factors at play here, as to how/why the questioning is perceived as somehow threatening or otherwise ''bad'' in some way. Fatigue, present stressors &/or recent conflicts, perhaps... these things can leave certain people walking-on-eggshells for a good stretch of time, afterward. And let's not forget potentially unknown personal sensitivity to a seemingly benign topic.

    The people I tend to get defensive reactions from the most are other feelers, generally, when I question them. The others are NT's, who, as stated above, seem to inaccurately attempt to figure out my motivations for asking, & try to answer accordingly. It's silly/gets annoying. /shrug

    Humans are messy.

    *embraces senility*
    Last edited by Lexicon; 10-23-2013 at 02:16 PM. Reason: durr.
    03/23 06:06:58 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:06:59 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:21:34 Nancynobullets: LEXXX *sacrifices a first born*
    03/23 06:21:53 Nancynobullets: We summon yooouuu
    03/23 06:29:07 Lexicon: I was sleeping!



    04/25 04:20:35 Patches: Don't listen to lex. She wants to birth a litter of kittens. She doesnt get to decide whats creepy

    02/16 23:49:38 ygolo: Lex is afk
    02/16 23:49:45 Cimarron: she's doing drugs with Jack

    03/05 19:27:41 Time: You can't make chat morbid. Lex does it naturally.

  10. #50
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    I think I am most likely to be evasive if

    1. Someone keeps on asking for details, and isn't satisfied with the details I can keep giving. My Si can only go so far, and then there's an attitude of "well, why didn't you know that." The reason is sometimes absent-mindedness, but sometimes because usually all I need is the principle or the conceptual underpinning of something. Once I have that, the details are not strictly necessary. I respect the need for details, I think, but i just kind of get tired out and need some space. After a certain point, I think someone has enough details, and asking for more is just overkill. As though, if I give enough details, the other person will be able to predict exactly what will happen.
    2. Someone's going into emotionally sensitive territory, and hasn't reached that level of familiarity with me. Here, also, there is a response demanded in the moment that I feel unable to keep up with to the extent of satisfying them. Usually, I can't really retreat, and have to acknowledge them right away. But, the other person won't like what they get right away. This is not because I need time to come up with a lie, but because people demand a harmonious reaction that I can't provide.


    In both cases, I guess, I give them when I want someone to leave me alone. It's not something I can never answer, but it's something I can't answer in that moment.
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