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Thread: SJ's and Art

  1. #1
    Senior Member tkae.'s Avatar
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    Default SJ's and Art

    This'll be fun

    Okay, so, this comes out of the other thread I just saw asking about SJ artists, and from me immediately thinking about my mom, an ESFJ, who "doesn't get it".

    Quite often I catch her saying, "That's pretty," or, "That's stupid, who'd pay for that?"

    We also had quite a knockdown-drag out about Lady Gaga's recent fashion statement (i.e. the "Meat Dress"), and about how she thought it was disgusting (as opposed to me, who thought it was beautiful).

    So, basically, here's how it's gonna work:

    Below, I'll present to you a series of paintings from various artistic eras. You're to comment (a simple sentence of like/don't like and why/why not) on each of them.

    OR

    You can answer down at the bottom a few simple questions about what you think of art and the "high class" culture surrounding art.

    It's your choice.

    So, are you ready, my lovely SJ friends?

    Let's go! :workout:

    The Mona Lisa



    Starry Night



    Gleaners



    Water Liles



    Guernica



    Onement 1



    Campbell's Soup Can (Tomato)





    Questions:

    Do you prefer more "useful" art (simple paintings used for decoration), or do you prefer art that has meaning in it, even if you don't understand it?

    Do you like to learn the meanings behind art?

    Do you think you "get" art?

    What do you think of art such as that of Picasso or Andy Warhol, with less realism and more meaning behind the face value?

    Do you enjoy going to museums?

    What do you think of people who go to museums?

    What do you think of artists?



    Enjoy!
    "Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away." -Ekaku Hakuin
    http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b1...psdunkqmep.png
    5w4 . IEI . Chaotic Good
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  2. #2
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    I'll do both!
    Quote Originally Posted by tkae. View Post
    The Mona Lisa
    Eh. A portrait. Overrated.

    Starry Night
    Lovely. I really like his style - especially the textures and lines.

    Gleaners
    I like the historical aspect, but it doesn't strike me as beautiful - it's too straightforward and not as aesthetically interesting. More like a book illustration than something to put on the wall. (My mom - INFJ - loves this sort of thing, though.)

    Water Liles
    I like some of his water lily paintings more than others - it really depends on the color and the layout. I guess I don't like the color in this one as much.

    Guernica
    I think that I'd like it more if I knew a reason/story behind the style and the layout - i.e. if I took some time to analyze it, maybe with the help of someone who knew what they were talking about. In the meantime, not so much.

    Onement 1
    Paintings like this are nice when I like the colors, and I don't like these colors at all, so I don't like it.

    Campbell's Soup Can (Tomato)
    I love his bold, cartoonish style, I love that he was open about the message he was sending with these, and I love that the Campbell's Soup cans were kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy. I would also totally put something like this up on my wall.
    Questions:
    Do you prefer more "useful" art (simple paintings used for decoration), or do you prefer art that has meaning in it, even if you don't understand it?
    I guess, both. I like art with meaning that isn't "useful" when it's up in a gallery - i.e. it's still useful in a certain context - but preferably the art I'll have in my home will be decorative and meaningful. If it's not decorative, then my house will be full of ugly art. If it's not meaningful, it will be shallow and materialistic and easily replaced, instead of personal and classic.
    Do you like to learn the meanings behind art?
    Yes!!! Especially if it's historical.
    Do you think you "get" art?
    It depends on whether the artist is fairly obvious with their message. If they aren't, I feel like I need some historical background and/or someone to bounce ideas off of (which is why I always go to museums with friends, so we can discuss the art as we look at it). Also, some abstract art has no meaning whatsoever, and was an effort of blind creativity. I know this for a fact because my dad (INTP) used to paint excellent abstract paintings that had no meaning for him whatsoever.
    What do you think of art such as that of Picasso or Andy Warhol, with less realism and more meaning behind the face value?
    I don't get Picasso, but I get Warhol. And in my opinion, Warhol's work is much more realistic and pleasing to the eye. I don't know enough about Picasso's work to "get" it, but I feel like I'd enjoy Warhol's work for purely aesthetic reasons even if I didn't know the story behind it. So it really depends.
    Do you enjoy going to museums?
    With friends, yeah. (As mentioned above.)
    What do you think of people who go to museums?
    I dunno. They're probably a diverse enough group that it wouldn't be fair to judge them all at once.
    What do you think of artists?
    Again, can't put all of them into a little box. Some of them paint for the sake of painting, some have a social/political message, etc. But generally (and this goes for museumgoers, too), the more pretentious they are, the less I like them.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



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  3. #3
    Klingon Warrior Princess Patches's Avatar
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    I'll probably write out a more articulate response later, but given that right now I'm ill and high on Nyquil this response will have to suffice:

    I adore Monet and Van Gogh. I hate Rothko with the burning passion of 1000 suns. I know you didn't post Rothko, but I just had to throwit out there that I despise him.
    “Everybody has a secret world inside of them. All of the people of the world, I mean everybody. No matter how dull and boring they are on the outside, inside
    them they've all got unimaginable, magnificent, wonderful, stupid, amazing worlds. Not just one world. Hundreds of them. Thousands maybe.” -Neil Gaiman

    ~

  4. #4
    Senior Member Gerbah's Avatar
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    Oooh, I like this thread. Will reply later.
    the shoheen ho of the wind of the west and the lulla lo of the soft sea billow - Alfred Graves

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    Senior Member Gerbah's Avatar
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    Do you prefer more "useful" art (simple paintings used for decoration), or do you prefer art that has meaning in it, even if you don't understand it?
    It depends. I can enjoy both. Personally though I don’t like putting pictures up in my home as decoration.

    Do you like to learn the meanings behind art?
    Yes, I like to know what the layers of meaning and context are.

    Do you think you "get" art?
    I don’t “get” every piece of art I look at but generally I think I can appreciate art.

    What do you think of art such as that of Picasso or Andy Warhol, with less realism and more meaning behind the face value?
    I don't think that because the (superficial) technique is less realistic that that makes the meaning more meaningful. I think this depends more on the sincerity of the artist. Vermeer for example I find very profound and complex although his work is realistic and was intended for decoration of people's homes.

    Do you enjoy going to museums?
    Yes. Especially art museums. I’m not so interested in historical or science exhibitions.

    What do you think of people who go to museums?
    I never thought about this. Nothing much I guess. Every person will be there for a different reason and the fact that they’re there doesn’t tell me much about what kind of people they are.

    What do you think of artists?
    I think truly sincere and gifted artists are rare. Some artists are just disturbed people who need an outlet. They’re maybe sincere but they produce a kind of creative diarrhea. Some artists can be more of the intellectually pretentious sort but want to be “deep”. But artists who are really authentic and at the same time have a real ability to communicate something relevant to others are relatively few.
    the shoheen ho of the wind of the west and the lulla lo of the soft sea billow - Alfred Graves

  6. #6
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Most SJs I know like museums of any kind. If it's in a museum, then there is already a stamp of value on the art, especially one of historical significance (ie. the artist played a role in some art movement).

    My ISFJ mom mostly likes realistic art that is aesthetically pleasing. She told me once that she likes art in general (and she married two offbeat artist types, so she really has a thing for creative weirdos), but doesn't know enough about what is "good" to have much of an opinion on a lot of it. That struck me as an interesting comment, because it would never occur to me to need a consensus before forming an opinion on whether a piece of art is good or bad. It illustrated Fe for me very well - value is determined by an external gauge. I think this is why she also need a back story on the painting - what it means, when it was painted, why it was painted, who the artist was/is as a person, etc. This shows her the value, and her Si appreciates this info to complete her impression of the art. If she comes across something similar in the future, then less explanation is needed to prove value, because she's already familiar with the concept.

    Of course, I also think everyone responds to art in a purely aesthetic manner also, and that combines with other impressions to make a call on whether it's "good" or "bad".
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  7. #7
    Member Will2911's Avatar
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    Intresting topic.


    Quote Originally Posted by tkae. View Post
    This'll be fun

    Okay, so, this comes out of the other thread I just saw asking about SJ artists, and from me immediately thinking about my mom, an ESFJ, who "doesn't get it".

    Quite often I catch her saying, "That's pretty," or, "That's stupid, who'd pay for that?"

    We also had quite a knockdown-drag out about Lady Gaga's recent fashion statement (i.e. the "Meat Dress"), and about how she thought it was disgusting (as opposed to me, who thought it was beautiful).

    So, basically, here's how it's gonna work:

    Below, I'll present to you a series of paintings from various artistic eras. You're to comment (a simple sentence of like/don't like and why/why not) on each of them.

    OR

    You can answer down at the bottom a few simple questions about what you think of art and the "high class" culture surrounding art.

    It's your choice.

    So, are you ready, my lovely SJ friends?

    Let's go! :workout:

    The Mona Lisa

    I have never understood the appeal. It's a picture of a fairly
    Insignificant woman.
    Starry Night

    A picture of the sky with far too many colours in it. Not at all realistic.

    Gleaners
    More intresting then the previous two, but not by much.
    Water Liles

    Doesn't intrest me at all, I'm afraid. I'd rather go and look at actual Water Lillies then a picture of them, at least that's outdoors.

    Guernica

    Huh? What on earth is that all about. Oh god it's horrible.

    Onement 1

    Not really sure what this is, but it's not as offensive to my eyes as the last one.
    Campbell's Soup Can (Tomato)

    Okay... What purpose does this serve? It's a picture of a tin of soup, something I can see everyday in the shops. I always liked to see pictures of things which I normally wouldn't be able to see, like battles and great Heroes


    Questions:

    Do you prefer more "useful" art (simple paintings used for decoration), or do you prefer art that has meaning in it, even if you don't understand it?

    I like Pictures of Battles and pictures of Heroes and war leaders. I like having pictures on the wall, but I like them to be important or intresting. I don't see the point of Art for Arts sake, it should always be useful.
    Do you like to learn the meanings behind art?
    Not really, As I say I like more traditional Art, where there is only one meaning to it
    Do you think you "get" art?

    If you mean the modern arty rubbish which means walking around a gallery and acting pretensiously, then no. It's not really my thing, I'm a great reader and film lover, but pictures I never got.

    What do you think of art such as that of Picasso or Andy Warhol, with less realism and more meaning behind the face value?
    To be honest, I don't see the point. It is in my eyes worthless.

    Do you enjoy going to museums?

    Yes. There great. But I do prefer the historical ones, and going around stately homes and such.
    What do you think of people who go to museums?

    No issues, it shows a keen intrest in the past

    What do you think of artists?

    Depends which sort. I think a lot of them are up there own backside pretensious idiots. But there are a few who I like.



    Enjoy!

  8. #8
    Senior Member tkae.'s Avatar
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    Thanks for the responses everyone!

    It's great seeing all the different opinions to things

    I'll try to get around to detailed responses over time!
    "Not knowing how near the truth is, we seek it far away." -Ekaku Hakuin
    http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b1...psdunkqmep.png
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  9. #9
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Will2911 View Post
    I always liked to see pictures of things which I normally wouldn't be able to see, like battles and great Heroes


    Questions:

    Do you prefer more "useful" art (simple paintings used for decoration), or do you prefer art that has meaning in it, even if you don't understand it?

    I like Pictures of Battles and pictures of Heroes and war leaders. I like having pictures on the wall, but I like them to be important or intresting.
    http://theempirefurniture.com/wp-con.../napoleon1.jpg

    I've always liked this one. I like it because of these things:
    1. the craftsmanship! the skill!
    2. the historical context
    3. just how much of Napoleon's ego you can see in there
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  10. #10
    Member Will2911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    http://theempirefurniture.com/wp-con.../napoleon1.jpg

    I've always liked this one. I like it because of these things:
    1. the craftsmanship! the skill!
    2. the historical context
    3. just how much of Napoleon's ego you can see in there
    I like that Pic, one of the best of old Boney

    Although, is it the original, the colours are slightly different, and I notice it is stamped with Google.

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