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Thread: ESTJ traits

  1. #1
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Default ESTJ traits

    My sister is almost certainly an ESTJ and I want to know more about the type. Being an INFP and the opposite type, we have tended to clash a bit in the past but we are getting to a place where we get along better. She's not someone that is all that interested in MBTI so it would be nice to discuss the type here. And I find most of the descriptions a little unimaginative, saying little more than " very organized" and "a natural leader" in a variety of different ways.

    If you are an ESTJ or know one well, tell me about yourself/them. What are some ESTJ traits beyond the obvious stuff? What would we be surprised to know about ESTJs? I'm looking for more positive stuff but the odd insightful flaw is welcome.

    To start off, here is a little about my sister. She:
    - is a natural leader ( ) and whatever situation she is in somehow she ends up in positions of authority
    - is lively and sociable people person and a bit of a party girl
    - has high expectations for herself and holds others up to the same standards.
    - is extremely loyal but unfortunately people often fail to reciprocate this.
    - is hard-working, responsible and reliable even when she doesn't want to be. She often gets unfairly used by others for this reason.
    - has strong values and sticks to them resolutely. This can cause problems when she won't allow exceptions to the rule.
    - thinks she is not good enough in some way, that she is not what she should be. This feeling particularly seems to arise when around our ESFJ cousin.
    - is very laid back and easy-going in general but if someone crosses her they experience the full force of her wrath.
    - is very assertive and not afraid of verbal confrontation.
    - has a great sense of humour and has a rather silly streak.
    - is a mix of toughness and soft femininity.
    - practically every guy that knows her is at least a little bit in love with her.
    - not easily tempted to getting into relationships. When she does she is a really excellent, understanding and fun girlfriend.
    - likes to makes sure the people she cares about are taken care of.

    Anyone identify with these qualities?
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  2. #2
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Come on people! Help me out here. Everyone must know an ESTJ. They make up around 10% of the population!
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  3. #3
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Sounds like my gf, who is an ESTJ. Don't really know what you want to know...the Ask an ESTJ thread is great, EJCC does a wonderful job answering questions.

    I will say, that ESTJ women are probably confused for Fs because they play the social game very, very well. And ESTJs are typically typed as people's bosses even if they aren't, simply because people are idiots.



  4. #4
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    - not easily tempted to getting into relationships. When she does she is a really excellent, understanding and fun girlfriend.

    Anyone identify with these qualities?
    Every ESTJ I have known, man or woman, has undoubtedly been the boss in the relationship = not always fun for the other person. I would even go as far as to say that in most of these cases, the other person was oppressed.

    I looked up the word "oppressed" to make sure it was the word I really wanted to use. It was:

    op·press   /əˈprɛs/ Show Spelled[uh-pres] Show IPA
    –verb (used with object)
    1. to burden with cruel or unjust impositions or restraints; subject to a burdensome or harsh exercise of authority or power: a people oppressed by totalitarianism.
    2. to lie heavily upon (the mind, a person, etc.): Care and sorrow oppressed them.
    3. to weigh down, as sleep or weariness does.
    4. Archaic . to put down; subdue or suppress.
    5. Archaic . to press upon or against; crush.

    Surely, there are people in relationships with ESTJ's who find them fun. I've just seen (in my handful of examples) that as time goes on, the demands of the ESTJ often increase and the relationship becomes much less fun for the partner. Other than that one glaring difference, I agree totally with the many wonderful qualities that you listed about them.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  5. #5
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    my best friend is an ESTJ female

    some quirky little traits of hers here

    - she takes very good care of her clothes... to the point where she has shirts and such from high school that look brand new

    - she loves movies, and therefore reads up on the new ones coming out, keeps her collection well organized and updated and anticipates the Academy Awards every year!

    - she loves historical fiction books and cookbooks... and works on perfecting recipes and makes notes about how she did it so that she can make the most perfect versions of the food possible

    - she's a stickler for matching wines and foods... meaning I got a phone call when she was on her honeymoon asking what cheese she should match with a specific wine they'd picked up in Napa Valley

    - she loves to travel, and never forgets to pick people up souvineers while there
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

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    Rainy Day Woman MDP2525's Avatar
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    I don't understand the oppressive status of ESTJ's. I've never felt this way with any ESTJ I've known. I've felt more oppression from a couple ESFJ's IRL than anyone else. I'm not acting the right way for their satisfaction.

    Anyway good list. I'd add:

    -able to stand up for what they believe in even though it's not the popular opinion. They make valiant underdog fighters.
    ~luck favors the ready~


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  7. #7
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    I don't understand the oppressive status of ESTJ's.
    Again, I'm not ESTJ-bashing here. I think the list in the OP listed some great traits - all of which are true of ESTJ's.

    But, what I've observed is that the ESTJ oppression tends to really wear their partners down over time. I know an ESTJ male who tells his ESFJ wife (when she wanted to get a job) that she'll never be able to get a job after having been a housewife for so many years. Basically: "LOL. Think about it. You don't have any skills. Who in their right mind would hire you?"
    Or, "all you have to do all day is clean, do laundry, and cook a decent meal, and you can't even do that right. This meal sucks." This kind of stuff - very frequently.

    I know an ESTJ female who does similar things to the ESFJ male she is with. When he says, "I'm going to apply for that job!" She will say something like this in a very condescending tone: "Ha ha. Honey, you couldn't even get the last job you applied for and the qualifications for this one are much higher, so how in the world do you think you'll get this one? Come on now, be more realistic honey." And it's not like "honey" - I love you. It's more like "honey" - you're a stupid, freaking moron.

    I know another ESTJ female who basically lays down the law with any boyfriend she has. She dictates what goes on and you get the feeling that the boyfriend(s) wants more of a voice. I've wanted every boyfriend she has had to "grow a pair" and stand up to her when she talks down to them.

    Over the course of 10, 20, 30 years, hearing these types of things every day can wear you down. It can take the confidence right out of you, to the point to where you literally don't believe in yourself anymore. You start to think that you absolutely need the ESTJ because you can't do it on your own - because you have no skills, you don't do things right (ever), and you're basically a big lame-tard. I can't say it's characteristic of every ESTJ, I can just say I've seen it first hand in these examples and it aint pretty.

    Friends of these ESTJ's don't always see it. It's the family members and those that are in the home on a regular basis that see it going on. Neighbors, for instance, think these ESTJ's are "great providers, good people". And they are! But, yeah, that's the "oppression" I'm talking about. Again, I can't say it's characteristic of all ESTJ's. But, I can say I've seen it first-hand with 3 of them (and signs of it with many others I've known).
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  8. #8
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    I don't know what sort of ESTJs you know, but those aren't common traits in the ones I know

    my ESTJ that I'm closest to never nags anyone or oppresses them... we used to be roommates with an ENTJ as well... the ESTJ one was the chill one who'd let me be my happy ESTP self as long as my piles of books didn't get onto her desk space, which was something I could comply with just fine! The ENTJ was the nut job of the living arrangement... she tended to yell at BOTH of us because she never saw us working but we got better grades than she did

    Never felt the slightest oppressed by ESTJs... I'd never screw one over, but I feel comfortable in their presence and trust them to treat me well
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  9. #9
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    I have two ESTJ cousins. They both have a great sense of humor and are a blast to be around, but they're both control freaks. One of my best friends is ExTJ (either a balanced ESTJ or an ENTJ, probably the former), and he's extremely chill. The only problem with this one is that I hardly ever see him, because he's always working.
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    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    - concerned about image
    - very responsible
    - know where things are and are good at keeping up with unpleasant tasks
    - find it difficult to relax when things are left undone
    - find it hard to pass responsibility to someone if they are not sure it will be done correctly
    - excellent at taking care of their things
    - lovers of food and enjoy trying new things. Pleased to introduced loved ones to new stuff.
    - love travel
    - enjoy investing
    - usually have very extensive music collections and they have a wide knowledge base about the eclectic music they listen to.
    - tend to seek solitude under stress
    - can be the life of the party
    - initiator rather than responder
    - need to be prepared for every eventuality can make them rather pessimistic about their expectations for people's behaviours
    - dislike having major decisions left up in the air and will choose hastily without enough thought to implications rather than leaving it hanging.
    - avoid potentially emotional situations most of the time, if they are not sure how to proceed or if they believe things could get awkward.
    - don't usually stay in contact after a relationship is over
    - what is, is kind of mentality. Can't see the point of wasting energy in what could have been or should be if it's not straightforward to change.
    - good with taking orders from someone over them
    - expect compliance without too much questioning from those under them
    - surprisingly easy going about a lot of things
    - competent at a wide variety of skills, curious and lifelong learners, independent
    - not always sensitive to what needs to be said at the moment so much as saying what they perceive as true. May wish to get on to the solution, where they have something to contribute, rather than listen to the preliminary stages of people talking about the problem
    - sometimes a little impulsive or quick in decision making, but stick with whatever they've chosen and follow through
    - like to choose practical, needful gifts of high quality
    - prefer to have less stuff, but have it be very high quality
    - take pride in seeing how much use they can get out of something, feel guilty just buying needless items on a whim
    - unsentimental about the past
    - good documenters. Foresee times when having a longterm record will be useful and necessary
    - more interested in people and things within their immediate scope of control/involvement
    - appear more confident than they may be. More open to changing opinions than they may seem on the outside (but usually won't tell you that you changed their mind!) Need more reassurance than they may seem to, but even those close to them often are not aware of that. Find it difficult to state emotional needs particularly (maybe are somewhat unaware of them until they all come out and then it is embarrassing?)
    - much harder on themselves than you'd know
    - like to take care of people they are close to in particular
    - not much tolerance for people who dress or act outside of what is ordinary for the group/culture they are part of
    - vocal about opinions and state them bluntly.
    - younger ones particularly are partiers and they like to be the hub of a social circle. They are the organizer of social events or catalyst for them having them. They enjoy feeling that they are part of a group/culture/community of people.
    - frugal themselves, but can be very generous with other people if the occasion warrants it.

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