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  1. #341
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    In regards to #2, is he likely to try and hide from me the fact that he is stressed and tense?
    If he's anything like me...at first, yes. But for ISFJs we heavily rely on our partners for emotional support so if you show yourself as being someone he can talk and confide in, someone who can encourage him, he'll start to open up to you quickly.

    Or at least he will if he's anything like me

    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    And are there likely tells for when he is more mildly stressed (I can tell when he is very stressed easily), that might be more difficult to pick up on?
    Hmm...I'm not sure what to tell you. We try very hard not to let our minor stuff show, it feels inappropriate/not manly/whatever silly convention you want to use.

    My advice? Ask him exactly what you just asked me, he'll adore you for it

    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    As far as 3 and 4 go. Okay. That makes sense.
    Tell your man I said, "You're welcome"

    On a serious note though: I don't know what his libdo is like so I can't say how he'll respond to that. I'm an Sx-dom and I have a very high libdo so I *always* respond well to flirting. But that's me.

    And about 5, that shouldn't be too difficult. So it sounds like he will be studying me like a book (if he likes me, and since the other night he started talking about things several months down the road together, I would tend to assume that would be a yes, unless it was some sort of a strange test?). I suppose it is fitting that for once I be the specimen under the microscope so to speak. [/quote]

    It could be that. I know that, for me, when I start talking about spending the future with her (as I did with my ex) it means I'm commiting myself to this relationship so yeah he could very serious about you.

    However, that being said, I'd be leery of Fast Forwarding and Future Faking (google those terms along with "Natalie Lue" if you've never heard of that).

    I don't very much he's testing you and if he is, you've got bigger problems than being a rat in his particular maze.

    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    I would tend to assume that for sensates, the concept of being nurtured would tend to be very sensual (not right now, necessarily meaning sexual, though it could) such as having a meal made for them, massage, music, candlelight, even maybe doing some cleaning for them so that they don't have to?

    Actually, could you elaborate on what the concept of being nurtured means for you, and would likely mean for SJ's more specifically for you over and above what you already described?
    I think some of what you said is part of it but sort of missing the point. For me, feeling nurtured and being made to feel safe. If I can approach you about anything, if I can express whatever thought or feeling comes to mind, if I can touch you without knowing you'll pull away from me....all of that means the world to me.

    SJs, from my own experience and from what I've read, want helpmates. We want people who are partners in the truest sense of the word. We want people who will help us live the lives we want to live. We want to be able to lean on you and have you lean on us.

    Consequently...when I don't feel safe with you...my trust in you waivers and that alone can cause me stress. For me (and I imagine for a lot of SJs) the idea of an intimate relationship is: You and me against the world.

    Have to go now, hope that helped some...





    Thanks for taking the time to give me a lengthy reply.[/QUOTE]
    "The man who is swimming against the stream knows the strength of it."
    ― Woodrow Wilson

  2. #342
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinker683 View Post
    If he's anything like me...at first, yes. But for ISFJs we heavily rely on our partners for emotional support so if you show yourself as being someone he can talk and confide in, someone who can encourage him, he'll start to open up to you quickly.

    Or at least he will if he's anything like me



    Hmm...I'm not sure what to tell you. We try very hard not to let our minor stuff show, it feels inappropriate/not manly/whatever silly convention you want to use.

    My advice? Ask him exactly what you just asked me, he'll adore you for it



    Tell your man I said, "You're welcome"

    On a serious note though: I don't know what his libdo is like so I can't say how he'll respond to that. I'm an Sx-dom and I have a very high libdo so I *always* respond well to flirting. But that's me.

    And about 5, that shouldn't be too difficult. So it sounds like he will be studying me like a book (if he likes me, and since the other night he started talking about things several months down the road together, I would tend to assume that would be a yes, unless it was some sort of a strange test?). I suppose it is fitting that for once I be the specimen under the microscope so to speak.
    It could be that. I know that, for me, when I start talking about spending the future with her (as I did with my ex) it means I'm commiting myself to this relationship so yeah he could very serious about you.

    However, that being said, I'd be leery of Fast Forwarding and Future Faking (google those terms along with "Natalie Lue" if you've never heard of that).

    I don't very much he's testing you and if he is, you've got bigger problems than being a rat in his particular maze.



    I think some of what you said is part of it but sort of missing the point. For me, feeling nurtured and being made to feel safe. If I can approach you about anything, if I can express whatever thought or feeling comes to mind, if I can touch you without knowing you'll pull away from me....all of that means the world to me.

    SJs, from my own experience and from what I've read, want helpmates. We want people who are partners in the truest sense of the word. We want people who will help us live the lives we want to live. We want to be able to lean on you and have you lean on us.

    Consequently...when I don't feel safe with you...my trust in you waivers and that alone can cause me stress. For me (and I imagine for a lot of SJs) the idea of an intimate relationship is: You and me against the world.

    Have to go now, hope that helped some...





    Thanks for taking the time to give me a lengthy reply.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

    I am having some formatting problems here, let me see if I can fix them.

    He does open up to me and has confided quite a bit in me. Part of the reason I am not terribly concerned about intentional or otherwise fast forwarding, is because we took a very slow process in getting to know each other over a couple of months before we began dating.

    As far as asking him the question I asked you, I definitely will. But I am curious why he will "adore me for it."

    The nurturing element, I guess all of that seemed obvious enough to me that I didn't think to specify. Of course I will do everything I can to help him feel safe and comfortable. Very early on, it was clear that there were things that he seemed on one hand to want to discuss, but on the other hand, reluctant to do so for fear of my reaction. Every time this happens, I encourage him to share it with me, and I studiously give him a non-judgmental reaction and try and communicate that it is safe to be him around me.

    I guess what I am most looking for too, are things that I can do to help him feel safe and nurtured, above and beyond the obvious things such as not pulling away from him or being a safe person for him to confide in, and whether that translates to cooking meals, or massages or anything you can think of that would appeal and be comforting. On the one hand, I could ask him, but on the other, I could see some personality types preferring things that things like this be spontaneously given and not "have to be told to do it." so to speak.

  3. #343
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    He does open up to me and has confided quite a bit in me. Part of the reason I am not terribly concerned about intentional or otherwise fast forwarding, is because we took a very slow process in getting to know each other over a couple of months before we began dating.
    Okie dokie. Twas a thought I had, just thought I'd share

    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    As far as asking him the question I asked you, I definitely will. But I am curious why he will "adore me for it."
    Because it directly and very explicitly shows that you care about him and the relationship, which is catnip for xSFJs

    Quote Originally Posted by Netochka View Post
    The nurturing element, I guess all of that seemed obvious enough to me that I didn't think to specify. Of course I will do everything I can to help him feel safe and comfortable. Very early on, it was clear that there were things that he seemed on one hand to want to discuss, but on the other hand, reluctant to do so for fear of my reaction. Every time this happens, I encourage him to share it with me, and I studiously give him a non-judgmental reaction and try and communicate that it is safe to be him around me.

    I guess what I am most looking for too, are things that I can do to help him feel safe and nurtured, above and beyond the obvious things such as not pulling away from him or being a safe person for him to confide in, and whether that translates to cooking meals, or massages or anything you can think of that would appeal and be comforting. On the one hand, I could ask him, but on the other, I could see some personality types preferring things that things like this be spontaneously given and not "have to be told to do it." so to speak.
    The answer to all of your questions are the exact same: You need to ask him. The specifics you're seeking will be unique to him and him alone. He and I are both ISFJ males and while we may have some things in common, I have no doubt we're also very different in a lot of ways.

    Personally, I'm of the mind that it's better to ask, just to be sure, than to make assumptions about what does and doesn't need to be told. I realize my suggestions are very broad but thats because I'm trying to come up with ideas that virtually every ISFJ I can think of wouldn't react too badly.

    Perhaps if I gave you specific examples for myself, and then you can try to draw a correlation between behaviors? I don't know but I suppose it's worth a shot.

    For me specifically...

    a) I like being texted randomly and often. It shows me that you value me, that you enjoy talking to me, and that you want me to be an active role in your life.
    b) Ask me to accompany to you to things you have to do or suggest mutual outings. You don't have to plan it all out necessarily, just throw an idea out there, (i.e. "I'd like to see a movie this weekend") or something open ended like that. I'm not the most spontaneous person and I have a hard time suggesting plans because I want to do something THEY want to do as well and it's helpful for me when my partner gives me at the least some sort of general idea.
    c) Tell me how good I look today or praise me on a recent accomplishment. I realize this may sound kind of odd as it's normally the man who has to tell the woman how good they look....but I like it too. "Desirable" is not a characteristic I have often been ascribed with so when someone tells me that I look handsome or what have you...it brightens me up. Puts a skip in my step.
    d) Be yourself. I strongly suspect, like my ex, you are and will over think the shit out of this discussion and your questions. Try and realize that we adore being in your presence and you just being you is just fine with us.
    e) Don't fret over my silence. Just because I may not be saying anything doesn't mean I'm bored or disinterested...it may mean I'm processing, thinking about something or that I simply don't have anything meaningful to add. I don't know about other ISFJs but I hate filler conversation. If I don't have anything useful to say, I'd rather just stay quiet.

    Any further specifics would be situational so I don't know what else really to list.
    "The man who is swimming against the stream knows the strength of it."
    ― Woodrow Wilson

  4. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinker683 View Post
    Okie dokie. Twas a thought I had, just thought I'd share



    Because it directly and very explicitly shows that you care about him and the relationship, which is catnip for xSFJs



    The answer to all of your questions are the exact same: You need to ask him. The specifics you're seeking will be unique to him and him alone. He and I are both ISFJ males and while we may have some things in common, I have no doubt we're also very different in a lot of ways.

    Personally, I'm of the mind that it's better to ask, just to be sure, than to make assumptions about what does and doesn't need to be told. I realize my suggestions are very broad but thats because I'm trying to come up with ideas that virtually every ISFJ I can think of wouldn't react too badly.

    Perhaps if I gave you specific examples for myself, and then you can try to draw a correlation between behaviors? I don't know but I suppose it's worth a shot.

    For me specifically...

    a) I like being texted randomly and often. It shows me that you value me, that you enjoy talking to me, and that you want me to be an active role in your life.
    b) Ask me to accompany to you to things you have to do or suggest mutual outings. You don't have to plan it all out necessarily, just throw an idea out there, (i.e. "I'd like to see a movie this weekend") or something open ended like that. I'm not the most spontaneous person and I have a hard time suggesting plans because I want to do something THEY want to do as well and it's helpful for me when my partner gives me at the least some sort of general idea.
    c) Tell me how good I look today or praise me on a recent accomplishment. I realize this may sound kind of odd as it's normally the man who has to tell the woman how good they look....but I like it too. "Desirable" is not a characteristic I have often been ascribed with so when someone tells me that I look handsome or what have you...it brightens me up. Puts a skip in my step.
    d) Be yourself. I strongly suspect, like my ex, you are and will over think the shit out of this discussion and your questions. Try and realize that we adore being in your presence and you just being you is just fine with us.
    e) Don't fret over my silence. Just because I may not be saying anything doesn't mean I'm bored or disinterested...it may mean I'm processing, thinking about something or that I simply don't have anything meaningful to add. I don't know about other ISFJs but I hate filler conversation. If I don't have anything useful to say, I'd rather just stay quiet.

    Any further specifics would be situational so I don't know what else really to list.
    Usually I also prefer to ask and know. However, I know with some types, particularly feelers, they feel like you should know somehow and if you have to ask, than it means that you don't care as much as you should.

    But all this is good advice, and of course I will over analyze (at least, from your perspective). It is what I do. :-)

    Thank you for going over all this with me. :-)

  5. #345
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    Communication issues arise due to your (or my un-) balanced nature; you're bothered by cynicism and idealism. What is it that you feel or think when someone is too much of either?

  6. #346
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deceptive View Post
    Communication issues arise due to your (or my un-) balanced nature; you're bothered by cynicism and idealism. What is it that you feel or think when someone is too much of either?
    Cynicism: You can express cynicism on neutral topics my Fe is in minimal or no contact with. Say on politics, or work. Applying it to people whose feelings mean something to me may lead to a write down of your value as a person.

    Idealism: A lot of things are real to me because of Si, and I don't like that being challenged. I may be genuinely interested in the beginning, but I switch off quickly.


  7. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unionruler View Post
    Cynicism: You can express cynicism on neutral topics my Fe is in minimal or no contact with. Say on politics, or work. Applying it to people whose feelings mean something to me may lead to a write down of your value as a person.

    Idealism: A lot of things are real to me because of Si, and I don't like that being challenged. I may be genuinely interested in the beginning, but I switch off quickly.

    Thank you.

    I'm glad you're taking over this thread, I will have questions to ask. I know I was going somewhere (less vague) with that question but I don't remember what. I will come back to this.

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