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[ESFJ] Ask an ESFJ too!

Nicodemus

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Ask her that question and you have half the rent. A question like "What do you like to know about me ?" She'll rain questions on you and you can select a few that will already help her.
I believe I did that by saying, in German, "Ich weiß nicht, was ich dir erzählen soll". You can read her response above.

I dont know your mum but one thing is often true with Mums, especially if they have sons: they can have sometimes a kinda reproachful attitude towards you, like "why dont you call ?" (tho you called 1 day ago), like "I dont know you anymore !" (well thats called growing up and its perfectly fine as long as one gets to know each others again).
The 'I don't know you anymore' thing has been standing between us for the last five years or so. It has been a fact for an even longer time. I am okay with it, but she, apparently noticing it more lately, is not. I only call her when I have formalities to settle, but I have encouraged her to call me if she wants to. The same policy seems to work fine with my father (ISFJ).
 

entropie

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Well the problem is, if you tell an Fe "I dont know what to tell you about", he can understand that as "I dont want to talk to you right now" and will respect your feelings. By the same time tho you do increase his curiosity to find out what you are so secretive about, especially when you are a relative. So best things to do with Fe people is always to feed them something, doesnt need to be something serious, just a bit from your life, like maybe a funny story you had in the supermarket or an intresting discussion you had on the internet. Dominant Fe have an unique quality, you can basically talk to them for hours about anything and tho they understand only half of it, they are comforted by the pure fact that you are talking with them and are communicating.

If you dont want to talk to them at the moment or maybe forever, you are of course in a diffcult position. Not talking anymore with relatives is near to impossible and if you do it, it will always result in them worrieing or being even pissed at you. Its like the saying "You can choose a friend, but you cant choose family".

Here's one attempt to motivate you: maybe talking more to your mother and getting on a new level of relation with her as a grown-up can present you with different perspectives and new insights about her. She prolly has some more life experience than you have and its always good to know a lot of peoples life experience, especially when you are writting stuff or when you want to develop your own self.

One critical notion: fathers generally are ultimatively calm and dont burden their sons. This doesnt mean tho that he doesnt want to talk to you as much as your mother does. Sometimes, and I know that from my own Dad, the things fathers say and the things fathers want are in absolute opposition.
 

Nicodemus

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Well the problem is, if you tell an Fe "I dont know what to tell you about", he can understand that as "I dont want to talk to you right now" and will respect your feelings.
That may actually be true.

By the same time tho you do increase his curiosity to find out what you are so secretive about, especially when you are a relative. So best things to do with Fe people is always to feed them something, doesnt need to be something serious, just a bit from your life, like maybe a funny story you had in the supermarket or an intresting discussion you had on the internet. Dominant Fe have an unique quality, you can basically talk to them for hours about anything and tho they understand only half of it, they are comforted by the pure fact that you are talking with them and are communicating.
It is quite counter-intuitive to think that this stuff should re-establish a 'connection'. But I can imagine giving a weekly report of banalities. It might even work if she does really not require anything substantial. Good cue.

If you dont want to talk to them at the moment or maybe forever, you are of course in a diffcult position. Not talking anymore with relatives is near to impossible and if you do it, it will always result in them worrieing or being even pissed at you. Its like the saying "You can choose a friend, but you cant choose family".
It is not that I hate her; we are just living in very different worlds.

Here's one attempt to motivate you: maybe talking more to your mother and getting on a new level of relation with her as a grown-up can present you with different perspectives and new insights about her. She prolly has some more life experience than you have and its always good to know a lot of peoples life experience, especially when you are writting stuff or when you want to develop your own self.
That is not an issue. She accepted that I am an adult some years ago. Otherwise she would surely call more often. Also, it is usually the case that I give her advice. Of course, though, that does not save her from motherly feelings.

One critical notion: fathers generally are ultimatively calm and dont burden their sons. This doesnt mean tho that he doesnt want to talk to you as much as your mother does. Sometimes, and I know that from my own Dad, the things fathers say and the things fathers want are in absolute opposition.
He calls more often, so I talk to my father more frequently than to my mother. He is the softer parent, too: less intrusive, thus easier to talk to.
 

Giggly

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After a dinner and a subsequent visit to a pub with my mother, her husband and a friend of hers, the following dialogue occurred between mother (ESFJ) and son (INTJ):

Nico's mum: "I have the feeling that I have lost the connection to you."
Nicodemus: "I don't know what I should to tell you."
Nico's mum: "Hm. Well, when you are fine, I am fine."

I know that she wants me to present her my heart on a plate. That I cannot do. She has in the past asked for texts that I have written; yet when I send them, she does not respond. I figure what I write about is probably fancy nonsense to her; she has even confessed to have given up on reading one of my rather good essays. So that is obviously not the right method.

Background information: We do not live in the same city and see each other around five times a year.

Thus my question for the ESFJs here: What else could I do to satisfy her motherly need to get inside my head?

:cry: This is heartbreaking to read.

Would it be too weird to talk to your Dad about this (like in the same way you've spoken about it here)? Maybe he could give your mom some hints.
 

Nicodemus

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:cry: This is heartbreaking to read.
epie375_1_1.jpg


Would it be too weird to talk to your Dad about this (like in the same way you've spoken about it here)? Maybe he could give your mom some hints.
My parents are not enemies but not really friends either. My father knows that my mother can be annoying (they were married for 12 years); but, actually, I don't want him to interfere, nor, in case you meant him, do I want my mother's husband to interfere. I guess I will try the weekly-report method.
 

Giggly

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I'm sorry, I assumed they were still married. I'd already figured that might not be something you wanted to do anyway but I thought I'd ask anyway.

Weekly report? Are you that exciting? lol
Might be weird to jump into considering how little you two talk now. Maybe start with something less frequent than weekly and build up if that's what you want/she wants.

(PS - I'm doubting the report is what she only wants but that might best thing for you two to do at this point.)
 

Nicodemus

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Weekly report? Are you that exciting? lol
If entropie's information is correct, I can tell her just about anything - if only it pertains to me - and it will better our relationship. Do you agree with the ENTP's assessment?

Might be weird to jump into considering how little you two talk now. Maybe start with something less frequent than weekly and build up if that's what you want/she wants.
It does not have to be much. Three topics per week should suffice. I intend to do it via e-mail. Or do you think talking on the phone (sensory data, bla bla) might be better suited? Because in that case it would probably be a two-weekly report.

(PS - I'm doubting the report is what she only wants but that might best thing for you two to do at this point.)
What do you think she wants?
 

Giggly

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If entropie's information is correct, I can tell her just about anything - if only it pertains to me - and it will better our relationship. Do you agree with the ENTP's assessment?

Well, I'm not ESFJ but if all you want is for her to stop complaining and know that you're fine, then yeah I think that will work.

I tried this sort of thing on an ESFJ and it did work but I disliked doing it. It felt forced but that's probably just my hangup.


It does not have to be much. Three topics per week should suffice. I intend to do it via e-mail. Or do you think talking on the phone (sensual data, bla bla) might be better suited? Because in that case it would probably be a two-weekly report.

Do whichever one that you are most likely to keep it up.

Best of luck. :) I have to go now.
 

Jaq

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.
 
Last edited:

Nicodemus

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It did not work out as intended, by the way. She answered mails the next day when she was supposed to wait a week. She did not reply to the things I had said and talked about her usual boring stuff. We are back to the old.
 

Jaq

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Ok ESFJs, your like the amazons to me. I know nothing about you guys, but you guys left me with a nasty scar and some diseases. Would you kindly explain yourselves to me?
 

Giggly

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Ok ESFJs, your like the amazons to me. I know nothing about you guys, but you guys left me with a nasty scar and some diseases. Would you kindly explain yourselves to me?

I don't think we have any ESFJs here right now.
 

mrcockburn

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Ok ESFJs, your like the amazons to me. I know nothing about you guys, but you guys left me with a nasty scar and some diseases. Would you kindly explain yourselves to me?

Get some condoms next time and stop scratching.
 

Jaq

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Get some condoms next time and stop scratching.
Interesting, however I wasn't implying something such as that. I was using the amazons as a metaphor.

Allow me to elaborate on that metaphor than, you see I had a nasty run in with an ESFJ before. Left me with a nasty mental scar. The diseases part really did't matter to the metaphor, but I figured I'd add it for kicks.
 

mrcockburn

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Interesting, however I wasn't implying something such as that. I was using the amazons as a metaphor.

Allow me to elaborate on that metaphor than, you see I had a nasty run in with an ESFJ before. Left me with a nasty mental scar. The diseases part really did't matter to the metaphor, but I figured I'd add it for kicks.

oh, but I was speaking in metaphor. :coffee:
 

Sunshiney

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OOh, goody. Pardon my T coming out and the fact nearly every ESFJ I met has made me want to bash my head through a wall, but...

Why must you people be so overtly obsessed with social standing? Can you not go one day without shaming/bullying some sort of group of people for whatever /illegitimate/ reason? Also, why must you insist on sending me hate messages and calling me names, making me so sick I skipped my first year of high school? :( It's not polite, you know...

T mood is over. :> Back to hugs and cuddles! Those questions are only directed at the ESFJs which they can apply to.

EDIT: I forgot one more thing, which I'm not sure if it's an ESFJ thing or what (I'm assuming it isn't ), but why IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS HOLY must you people be so jealous?! Jealous in general. Of everything. I'm only asking this because my "friend" who is an ESFJ sent hate mail to another girl who at least had my sympathy and continued to do so. She never admitted it but we have screenshots and the typing style is the same as hers. I'm so glad she deactivated...Hope she learns to grow up and not be such a rude elitist.

Like I said, though, more than likely it's just her and the other few ESFJs I've met who have turned my opinion on them into the gutters.
 

Saslou

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OOh, goody. Pardon my T coming out and the fact nearly every ESFJ I met has made me want to bash my head through a wall, but...

Why must you people be so overtly obsessed with social standing? Can you not go one day without shaming/bullying some sort of group of people for whatever /illegitimate/ reason? Also, why must you insist on sending me hate messages and calling me names, making me so sick I skipped my first year of high school? :( It's not polite, you know...

T mood is over. :> Back to hugs and cuddles! Those questions are only directed at the ESFJs which they can apply to.

EDIT: I forgot one more thing, which I'm not sure if it's an ESFJ thing or what (I'm assuming it isn't ), but why IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS HOLY must you people be so jealous?! Jealous in general. Of everything. I'm only asking this because my "friend" who is an ESFJ sent hate mail to another girl who at least had my sympathy and continued to do so. She never admitted it but we have screenshots and the typing style is the same as hers. I'm so glad she deactivated...Hope she learns to grow up and not be such a rude elitist.

Like I said, though, more than likely it's just her and the other few ESFJs I've met who have turned my opinion on them into the gutters.

So her standards are not the same as yours .. So what if ESFJ's like social standing, let them get on with it. Does it hurt you and your way of life, no.

Whenever someone is bullying another, why not look at possible reasons as to why they are behaving as they are. Could they have issues going on at home, are they themselves being bullied .. It's easy to say someone actions are wrong, but have you played any part in it? Maybe you upset the person and instead of the person speaking up, it's eating their insides. It easy to place a label on another without knowing the full story. And the jealousy, maybe that person lives in a home where their views are not heard, been told they'd never accomplish anything meaningful in life and are just a fucking wreck .. Maybe their actions are just a cry for help, but instead people view the individual as a jealous ESFJ .. Heaven forbid she/he could be another type.

I am tired of people slating the underdog .. Everyone has the capability of being a fucking bitch/bastard, hurting those close to them, acting out behaviours which seem totally irrelevant .. It's called the human condition and we are all capable of it .. Thank god people learn from their actions (most of the time) and choose to grow and become a better person.

Ultimately i suppose it comes down to which perspective you are looking from.
 

skylights

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OOh, goody. Pardon my T coming out and the fact nearly every ESFJ I met has made me want to bash my head through a wall, but...

Why must you people be so overtly obsessed with social standing? Can you not go one day without shaming/bullying some sort of group of people for whatever /illegitimate/ reason? Also, why must you insist on sending me hate messages and calling me names, making me so sick I skipped my first year of high school? :( It's not polite, you know...

T mood is over. :> Back to hugs and cuddles! Those questions are only directed at the ESFJs which they can apply to.

EDIT: I forgot one more thing, which I'm not sure if it's an ESFJ thing or what (I'm assuming it isn't ), but why IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS HOLY must you people be so jealous?! Jealous in general. Of everything. I'm only asking this because my "friend" who is an ESFJ sent hate mail to another girl who at least had my sympathy and continued to do so. She never admitted it but we have screenshots and the typing style is the same as hers. I'm so glad she deactivated...Hope she learns to grow up and not be such a rude elitist.

Like I said, though, more than likely it's just her and the other few ESFJs I've met who have turned my opinion on them into the gutters.

you are aware that there are assholes of all types?

like saslou said, there's often a reason people bully. they've learned that behavior pattern at home, or they're scared, or they're hurt... healthy people don't follow that behavior pattern. it doesn't make that right, obviously, and i'm sorry that you've had to deal with that, but it seems like you're coming into this thread with some personal issues that are being vented and dumped on ESFJs instead of the real group they should be dumped on, which is that of bullies or jealous people. as for jealousy - it's generally fear-based. and envy from lack of self-confidence.

my ESFJ mom is definitely not particularly interested (much less overtly obsessed) with social standing nor is she anywhere near a jealous type (actually i would be way more likely to be called jealous than her). same for a close ESFJ friend of mine. her ESFP sister is much more cliquey and dramatic.

actually you're kind of doing exactly what you're talking about... stereotyping and blaming... :/ i'm sorry that you've had to go through these things but i think you're directing your anger and questions at the wrong group.
 

Istbkleta

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Any older ESFJs?

I want to know how you experience Ti in your 40s and 50s.

Is there any drama?


For example ExTJs might get into some career damaging soul searching with their Fi, and ENTPs get crazy.

I have an ESFJ friend suffering with depression and stuff. I want to help.
 

King sns

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Any older ESFJs?

I want to know how you experience Ti in your 40s and 50s.

Is there any drama?


For example ExTJs might get into some career damaging soul searching with their Fi, and ENTPs get crazy.

I have an ESFJ friend suffering with depression and stuff. I want to help.

I was actually wondering the same thing this morning. ESFJ's and Ti- how that works, I guess it must supplement their Si a little bit take the Si framework and and the Ne ideas and then the Ti would work out all the kinks in the end. There aren't many ESFJ's here, let alone older ones to elaborate for us.
 
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