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  1. #1
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Default ISTJs and being good at distinguishing right and wrong and enforcing it

    Is this normal with ISTJs or is it just me? I find myself giving advice to friends and feeling very strongly about expressing what is right/wrong and what should/shouldn't be done. I've been known to get on friend's bad sides for being blunt and honest with it too.

    Is this something that just depends on the person or is it found more so in one or a few types over others?

  2. #2
    Senior Member niffer's Avatar
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    Haha, my ISTJ friend does this. I like this. It's good people care enough to feel the need to do this. Most of the time I just don't give a poo, and decide that 99% of the time, ultimately what should/shouldn't be done is really up to the person.

    Once in a while, though, my friend tells me I give pretty good advice myself. So touching.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member autumn's Avatar
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    Hmm, I wonder if this is an xSTJ thing more than a particularly ISTJ thing. I don't think it's bad; I think it can be very important to have this trait, depending on how you use it. How the other person receives your advice depends as much on the person you're speaking with as it does on you. Some types will be offended by this kind of advice in one way or another, and others won't. One thing that could probably help, but would probably take a lot of practice and could be tricky is to try to adjust the way you deliver your advice depending on the kind of person you know you're speaking with. So if you know you're speaking with someone who tends to be rebellious or inattentive or sensitive, you could say the same thing but try to modify the way you explain it to better suit that person, if that makes sense.

  4. #4
    The elder Holmes Mycroft's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBeatGoesOn View Post
    Is this normal with ISTJs or is it just me? I find myself giving advice to friends and feeling very strongly about expressing what is right/wrong and what should/shouldn't be done. I've been known to get on friend's bad sides for being blunt and honest with it too.

    Is this something that just depends on the person or is it found more so in one or a few types over others?
    I've had extensive experience with ISTJs in my life. Invariably arguments erupted because they would try to do what you're describing. I would ask why. Their answer would be something akin to "because that's the way it is!" I would scoff. They would become angry at me. From their perspective, they were simply presenting the facts and I was being unnecessarily contrary. I would become frustrated. From my perspective they were spouting platitudes and failing to use their own God-given minds.

    It was annoying.

  5. #5
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    It is an XSTJ thing.
    I live with one of each...it is like having the behavior police on patrol 24/7.

    The thing that kills me is they both do things themselves they preach at others about.........AND are OFFENDED if anyone says a thing to them about THEIR behavior.

    It kills me. ha

  6. #6
    Senior Member Lookin4theBestNU's Avatar
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    I would trust an ISTJ to judge my actions fairly as they tend to have sound reasoning ability for the most part. There are some exceptions. However I don't think they are the best "enforcers" out there. I believe this is the underlying reason why I like and trust the ISTJ temperament far more than the ESTJ. As an N type I don't see right/wrong as clearly plain and simple as the ISTJ. I have found ISTJs are actually open to explaining their processes as best as they can. ESTJs though are not nearly as open for discussion and will attempt to enforce things only as they see them. As an Extroverted Judger type myself that doesn't work for me.
    "At points of clarity, I realize that my life on earth is meaningless, and that I am merely a pawn in a bigger game. A game I cannot possibly understand or have control of. Thankfully, before depression sets in, I drift back into my cloudy, bewildered daily routine." **Joel Patrick Warneke**

  7. #7
    Senior Member reason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBeatGoesOn View Post
    Is this normal with ISTJs or is it just me? I find myself giving advice to friends and feeling very strongly about expressing what is right/wrong and what should/shouldn't be done. I've been known to get on friend's bad sides for being blunt and honest with it too. Is this something that just depends on the person or is it found more so in one or a few types over others?
    I do this to, though unlike mancroft's respondant, I can argue all the way down, which must be awfully frustrating
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

  8. #8
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBeatGoesOn View Post
    Is this normal with ISTJs or is it just me? I find myself giving advice to friends and feeling very strongly about expressing what is right/wrong and what should/shouldn't be done. I've been known to get on friend's bad sides for being blunt and honest with it too.

    Is this something that just depends on the person or is it found more so in one or a few types over others?
    I've always considered right and wrong to be subjective until either I or someone else does something that violates my values. When I encounter XSTJ types, they are very weary of me for that reason and their first impression is that I'm some sort of criminal or anarchist because I have no interest in their kind of social order.

    I think XSTJs are very good at interpreting the current perceptions of what is right and wrong, and using the current authority to enforce those beliefs. Where they are lacking is in their ability to objectively question their own beliefs so that they understand why some things are right or wrong, and because they tend to not understand the underlying concept, they may extend their enforcement to the point that it no longer makes sense.

    However, the XSTJs that I know that have studied the philosophy beyond the religious or societal perception of right and wrong, have all ended up border line suicidal. So strong are their convictions that when they do begin critically questioning their conception of right and wrong, they begin to see the world as meaningless and purposeless. Probably not unlike an NF would without their values.

  9. #9
    No me digas, che! Recoleta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBeatGoesOn View Post
    Is this normal with ISTJs or is it just me? I find myself giving advice to friends and feeling very strongly about expressing what is right/wrong and what should/shouldn't be done. I've been known to get on friend's bad sides for being blunt and honest with it too.

    Is this something that just depends on the person or is it found more so in one or a few types over others?
    You're not alone, I do this too. For me at least, right and wrong is not something that is subjective or that should be rationalized. Of course I can always rationalize my reasons for doing something, but frankly, I always know deep down when I am doing something wrong...it bothers me on the inside. Granted, this does not mean that I always refrain from doing things that I know are wrong. I'm only human.

    Although, I find it kind of funny that many N's think ISTJ's or XSTJ's (whichever we're talking about here) look at right and wrong too simply, but from my perspective, N's are making something that is very simple into something that becomes infinitely complicated.

    Oh the beauty of diverse thinking....

  10. #10
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Sometimes I get the feeling that my ISTJ friend sees me as a moral authority second to God...
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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